tuliped valve

[paisaac]

I had 5.0GI volvo engine that tuliped a valve. the 5.0 had about 150 hours on it, ran great on year, the next year I took it out one time ran for about 5 hours, then tuliped the valve. I replaced the engine with Jasper 5.7 rebuild. put the old intake back on the new motor with the old throtle body. Ran the boat for a day and the valve tuliped on the new motor. Now I replaced the head and the motor has no power and back fires when you start to move away from the dock. I can not figure out what caused the tulip valve (both time on the # 3 exhaust valve). The new motor could never get above 4200 rpm and runs very poor. Seems to run fine when it is sitting at the dock, but when I pull away even at low rpm it back fires.
I have a couple ideas, bad gas? but I have run most of what I had in the tank out. The new engine was given a new water sep filter. Another idea is that the timing chain and gears where not put on right?
any ideas?

 

[Bondo]

Re: tuliped valve

Welcome Aboard,......

Most of the Symptoms you're describing would lead Me to believe that it's Probably a Lean Condition that's the Root of your Problems.......

Could be Bad Gas,...
Or a Restriction in the Fuel Delivery System,......

Valves are Tulipped by an OverHeat condition at the Valve itself,....
Detonation from Bad Fuel or it's Delivery is Probably Why it happened Twice........

 

[paisaac]

Re: tuliped valve

okay, thanks, I will check the fuel.

 

[Silvertip]

Re: tuliped valve

I just have to ask! -- Did you install a complete Jasper long block (including heads) or was it a short block and you used the 305 heads?

 

[paulie0735]

Re: tuliped valve

Re the stretched (tuliped) valve. I agree with bond-o, it sounds like number 3 is running so lean that it’s over heating the valve and distorting the valve head. I suspect you still have the problem despite the replacement engine. I would be looking at the injector(s). Also check the condition of the inlet manifold and the cylinder head by placing a straight edge on the mating surfaces to ensure they are flat. If either is slightly distorted the engine will suck air causing a lean condition.

The performance problems with the replacement engine sounds like incorrectly adjusted valves. If the engine was running ok before you damaged the valve again and changed the head than I would question how you adjusted the valves on the replacement head. Given that it was running ok prior I think you can rule out cam timing as a cause for the poor performance.

I’m not sure what effect stepping up from 5.0 to 5.7 will have on the Volvo EFI system, somebody here may know if the computer has enough variation in its programming to handle the increased fuel demand of the 5.7. You may also be outside the range of the injectors fuel delivery capacity at WOT. When you get it running right it would be wise to have a tech do a run with an exhaust gas analyzer to ensure you’re not running to lean, if it is your gunna destroy the new engine very quickly.

 

[paisaac]

Re: tuliped valve

the jasper engine was a long block. I just put the intake from the old 5.0 back on it. I will say that before it blew the second head, I dont know if it ran great, I was having problems setting the timing (from inexperience). I will say that when I pulled the old engine out, I pulled off the water seperator and there was a lot of orange nasty stuff in it.
I have someone looking at the engine, but he is as baffled as I. I suspected it might be the intake manifold, seems odd to me that even if an injector was bad or bad gas, that it would affect the same valve on two totally different engines, but I will check the throtle body anyway to see if the injector is bad. Any clue on how to check them?
So it blew the second head, then Jasper sent me the wrong head. I think they sent me one for a 305. I took that back off sent it back to Jasper and they sent me a new head for a 350. After replacing that head is when I started getting the back firing and inconsitent missing. So with the new 350 head I am now having the power/backfiring/missing issue.

 

[Silvertip]

Re: tuliped valve

Paulie reflects my thoughts regarding valve adjustment. I doubt the EFI system is smart enough to know it now has to feed a 350 rather than a small valve 305 so a lean condition may very well exist. The 350 breathes a bunch better than the 305. Verify firing order as well (1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2).

 

[Don S]

Re: tuliped valve

Was the original 5.0GI a throttle body injected model or MPI.
Really need the full model number or the Volvo serial number to really help you.

 

[paisaac]

Re: tuliped valve

The original 5.0 was a GI. that was the full model. So it is a throtle body with the two injectors.

 

[Don S]

Re: tuliped valve

Sorry, but that is NOT the full number.
Read this Volvo service bulletin, then you will understand.

Volvo Engine ID

 

[paulie0735]

Re: tuliped valve

I assumed it was TBI, I thought all 5.0Gi's were!

 

[paisaac]

Re: tuliped valve

I see, where would I find that number? on the block or the intake?

 

[Don S]

Re: tuliped valve

I assumed it was TBI, I thought all 5.0Gi's were!

May be, but without some indication as to year or exact model, you don't know if you are trying to troubleshoot an MEFI I,2,3 ECM. If a person is going to look things up for a question, why not use the CORRECT manual.

paisaac
I don't know where the number is on your particular model, because I don't know what particular model you have.
Look for a stickon tag on the electrical box on the stbd riser, on the valve cover.
There should also be a metal tag on the original block on one side or the other back where the bellhousing bolts to the engine.

 

[paisaac]

Re: tuliped valve

Don,
I will check and get back to you with the model. Thanks for the help

 

[paisaac]

Re: tuliped valve

Don,

Here are the numbers as they appear on the box next to the exhaust.
5.0gi PBYCCE
4110169053
3868862

Thanks for the help.
Pat

 

[Don S]

Re: tuliped valve

Ok, you have a BY model whiich makes it a 98 engine.
You are going to need to check the fuel pump pressure on the low and the high pressure pump.
Since it runs ok without a load, you may be getting air into the fuel system, or a restriction. You can check it out like this thread shows.
http://www.iboats.com/bbboard/bbBoard.cgi?a=viewthread;fid=24;gtid=1107009

Also make sure the advance and the knock sensor and KS Module and wiring are good.

Have you checked for any trouble codes in the computer?

 

[paisaac]

Re: tuliped valve

Don,
I dont have the equipment to check the codes. I do know that when I pulled the old engine out and pulled off the water seperator that there was a lot of "non-gas" stuff in it. I mean it was an orange like color and I am assuming some water. Any chance that is still haunting me?

Also can you tell me were the knock sensor and ks module are? I think I have one sensor on the bottom of the engine, starboard side? how about the ks module?

And thanks a bunch, you have been a great help!! I will tell you that this problem is baffling me and a few others since last summer.

 

[Don S]

Re: tuliped valve

The KS Module is behind the oil fill tube. But looking at it or the knock sensor itself down by the starter isn't going tell you anything.
Same with the fuel pressures, without the proper fittings and gauges and procedures you can't test it. Same with the codes. If there is something else wrong, then you are just going to keep loosing engines.

The FIRST and MOST important tool you need is a service manual. Go to your local Volvo dealer and have them order you a set for the BY model. The Volvo PN is 7797450 and retails at just under 70 bucks. It's set of 5 seperate manuals,
With them you can follow wiring diagrams, and test items even without a code reader. Someone posted how to make one with a paper clip and an LED which would work fine.

 

[marinemech1]

Re: tuliped valve

make sure your battery is a good and meets or exceeds engine specs.
believe it or not a weak battery will cause a lean condition on efi engines

 

[paisaac]

Re: tuliped valve

Don,


Thanks much. I Will start with the manual. I really am greatful for your help.

Pat