Sleeves Turned in Block

[blue01965]

I have a 1997 225 Oceanpro. The sleeves in 4 of the cylinders have turned, and they are blocking the ports. What could have caused this? If the sleeves are in good condition can they be realigned?

 

[CATransplant]

Re: Sleeves Turned in Block

Hmm...did you overheat this engine? You're going to have to do some serious measuring on the block here. Those sleeves should not have turned at all. It doesn't sound good at all to me.

 

[walleyehed]

Re: Sleeves Turned in Block

If they have moved, especially 4 of them, I'd say it was a factory screw-up during assembly, size-wise. I think if it got hot enough to let 4 sleeves move, there would be other problems as well. All assuming this has not been O/H'd before.

 

[noelm]

Re: Sleeves Turned in Block

never heard of a sleeve turning before on any type of engine, but I guess it could happen somehow, in reality it did huh!

 

[akita]

Re: Sleeves Turned in Block

if you bought this engine new with 0 hours then it is a mfg problem. if you bought it used and someone had the engine rebuilt because of major scoring and replacement liners were needed. then the machinist did not allow enough interferance between the liners and the parent-bore.

 

[CFronzek]

Re: Sleeves Turned in Block

The sleeves are some kind of fancy cast iron. The block is cast aluminum. The aluminum will aways expand more when it is heated up. For any piece of iron or steel to maintain it's position in an aluminum housing (like an outboard block) that undergoes wide swings in temperature it is necessary to "shrink fit" the iron/steel pieces. <br />This involves making the iron/steel pieces slightly bigger than the holes they go in to. The aluminum is heated up to make the holes expand and the iron/steel quickly inserted. When the aluminum cools it should have a "death grip" on the iron/steel. <br />There is nothing very tricky about this technique. Every aluminum automobile or motorcycle engine has to go thru this same process. If your sleeves came loose there are only two possibilies. You were somehow able to get the motor extremely hot or there was a screw-up by whoever built/rebuilt that motor. <br />If you could tell us a little more about the history of the motor we might be able to give a more definitive answer.

 

[blue01965]

Re: Sleeves Turned in Block

I am the original owner of the motor. One side of the engine was rebuilt about four years ago when the VRO failed. It has worked great since then. On the first trip out this season it would not idle, and when it did run it wasn't making enough power to get the boat on a plane. The temp gauge never went into the red. I was thinking it might be a fuel problem, so I put it in the shop. They said that it had two dead cylinders and when they took it apart they found the turned sleeves in four of the cylinders. Of course they are suggesting I buy a new E-tec from them.

 

[Dhadley]

Re: Sleeves Turned in Block

A couple of things come to mind. A 97 didn't come with a VRO pump, but rather an OMS pump. Neither one can pick on one side, or even one cylinder. If either pump isn't working, none of the cylinders are geting oil.<br /><br />The scenario you describe is not unusual. On the first trip out in the Spring it doesn't run right. Most times the carbs are gummed up from sitting. At that point the motor needs to be looked at. A clogged carb will not flow the proper amount of gas and oil.<br /><br />When they took it apart were the turned cylinders ones that have damaged pistons?

 

[CFronzek]

Re: Sleeves Turned in Block

One side of the engine was rebuilt? Why and what did the rebuilders do to make it right?<br />Were the rebuilders the same people that opened the motor up this time? Did this crew show any signs of amazment that the liners had moved? <br />The ins and outs of this story are truely interesting but, in the end, the only way to make things right is to strip the motor, heat up the block, pull the liners and start from scratch. The holes in the block and the outside of the liners have to be accuratly measured at room temperature. At that point, if the sizes aren't within ten thousandths of an inch of specifications there is no sense re-assembling the motor because the same thing might happen again.<br />Being so far from the action I may have analized this incorrectly. This is a stange occurance in my experience but, I am not a pro at outboard repair.

 

[akita]

Re: Sleeves Turned in Block

cuyahogachuck "At that point, if the sizes aren't within ten thousandths of an inch of specifications there is no sense re-assembling the motor because the same thing might happen again."<br /><br />ten thousandths of an inch=.010<br />do you mean .0001 ?

 

[CFronzek]

Re: Sleeves Turned in Block

Yeah. In the venacular of the machine trades when we say the fit has to to be "in thousandths" we mean ± .001" "In ten thousandths" we mean ±.0001". <br />A dimension of +.010" wouldn't be a "fit". It would be a "clearance". A dimension of -.010" would only work for a shrink fit if you were dealing with a fairly large hole. Maybe a foot or more in diameter.

 

[rodbolt]

Re: Sleeves Turned in Block

actually we try to press a -.008 or so fit when pressing sleeves. the originals were cast in place.<br /> never seen one turn. would not take much turning and piston destruction would be assured.<br />most of us use tenths of a thousanths to describe any thing past 3 digits to the right.<br /> however the venacular can get confusing.<br /> if you just state ten thousanths of an inch it would be assumed .010" just as twenty thousanths would be .020.<br />however if its 2.015 plus or minus 3 ten thousanths its clear as a bell. 2.0153-2.0147<br /> the average human hair is .003" or 3 thousanths.<br />the sae system is no more or less accurate than the metric I dont care who you are. its a matter of nomenclature and shifting the decimal point.<br /> we can do it in base 10,base 2 base 8 or base 16.<br />if humans had 8 fingers and toes on each hand and foot base 8 would be our standard.<br />its not difficult to count if you remember when the collum fills/empties and the digits shift left or right.<br /><br /> but I am having trouble visualizing turned sleeves.