Shifting issues - I hate outboards

[aborgman]

I hate outboards.

Hate 'em.

Absolutely, categorically, hate 'em.

Once again, I'm not fishing. I'm never fishing. Three outboards on two different boats over the last 5 years, and probably 2/3 of the times I wanted to go fishing I couldn't because of motor troubles.

I thought the most recent motor was going to be good. It ran reasonably well the couple times I took it out last year after I got the boat.

So this spring I had a tuneup done on it and the impeller replaced. Turned out the lower end was trashed so he rebuilt that too.

Get it out for the first time - and it wouldn't run with the cowl on. It had an exhaust leak. Missing inner cover over the shift rod. Mechanic sent me a replacement and I threw it on.

Took the boat out and it ran great for the half hour I had to play with it that afternoon.

Now I'm on vacation and have a chance to do some fishing. Tried to go out this morning. Shifted into forward, and now it won't come out. It's not the cables - it won't shift even with it removed.

Over the last 5 years I honestly think I've easily spent 3x as much time trying to get my boat(s) capable of use as I've spent using them... and it's all been because of outboards.

$250 to the mechanic, weeks upon weeks of waiting... for about 30 minutes of actual use... that I had to do 30+ minutes of working on the boat to even get to.

If only I was independently wealthy I could actually afford to buy a new outboard - well, maybe I'd have to mortgage my mansion... but that whole having a boat motor worth more than my car (which is utterly reliable, and is an entire car) just isn't in the cards.


So I pulled the shift rod cover and disconnected the two halves of the shift rod. The lower half won't move/shift the lower unit out of forward gear. So probably something trashed in the lower with my luck.

There's oil in the lower unit, no water (heck, the boat has barely touched the water). It was running and shifting fine when I took it out a couple weeks ago... anyone have any suggestions?

The only one that is coming to my mind right now is "insure it and torch it".

 

[Daviet]

Re: Shifting issues - I hate outboards

What engine are working on, model number?

 

[F_R]

Re: Shifting issues - I hate outboards

Calm down and tell us what you are working on. Sure would help.

BTW, is the UPPER shift rod moving?

 

[aborgman]

Re: Shifting issues - I hate outboards

Calm down and tell us what you are working on. Sure would help.

Oops... sorry about that.

RDS-23
1961 Johsonson Seahorse 40HP, short shaft, electric start.

BTW, is the UPPER shift rod moving?

Yep - upper shift rod an all associated linkage seem to be working perfectly normally once disconnected from lower shift rod. Lower shift rod basically won't move up/down at all.

 

[bigpoppakdog]

Re: Shifting issues - I hate outboards

how about taking out a low interest loan and buy something less than 49 years old?

 

[aborgman]

Re: Shifting issues - I hate outboards

how about taking out a low interest loan and buy something less than 49 years old?

I did - problem is the thing I bought is known as "a wife and kids", and that really doesn't leave much money for a motor that isn't approaching 20 years older than I am. Heck, my car didn't cost as much as a new 40hp outboard does.

 

[F_R]

Re: Shifting issues - I hate outboards

Well, something is screwed up in the lower unit. Can't tell you what without looking. You haven't removed the phillips head screw----have you? That isn't an oil check plug. It holds the shifting mechanism inside.

Those motors are super reliable if in good condition. They were OMC's bread-and-butter at that time. Any motor is junk if mis-used, abused, and "repaired" improperly.

BTW, just for information, if somebody leaves the o-ring off the top of the water pump housing, it won't run worth beans with the hood on. Did I mention "repaired"?

 

[aborgman]

Re: Shifting issues - I hate outboards

Well, something is screwed up in the lower unit. Can't tell you what without looking. You haven't removed the phillips head screw----have you? That isn't an oil check plug. It holds the shifting mechanism inside.

No - I pulled the oild drain plug to check for oil, and the shift rod cover - but didn't touch anything else.

Those motors are super reliable if in good condition. They were OMC's bread-and-butter at that time. Any motor is junk if mis-used, abused, and "repaired" improperly.

I've pretty much come to the determination, both from my own experience and talking to others, that the idea of a "super reliable" outboard is an oxymoron. Or maybe my expectations for a "super reliable" are just higher than most. Most automobiles I've owned I wouldn't put the label on, much less outboards.

I'd call something that starts first try, every time, no matter the weather for 5+ years in a row with nothing done to it but routine maintenance "super reliable". Much less than that... and it ain't there.

BTW, just for information, if somebody leaves the o-ring off the top of the water pump housing, it won't run worth beans with the hood on. Did I mention "repaired"?

The exhaust leak was because the inner shift rod cover fell off - as I specifically said in the first message, and is fixed.

 

[bigpoppakdog]

Re: Shifting issues - I hate outboards

well, if you expect that out of an outboard, you have some pretty lofty goals. Here is a link to cheer you up and also to show how even the new 4 strokes don't last very long without problems. cheers!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrnU2nDj_Yk

 

[aborgman]

Re: Shifting issues - I hate outboards

well, if you expect that out of an outboard, you have some pretty lofty goals.

I know... I've had a several cars do it, a couple el-cheapo lawn tractors, and a few 70's era motorcycles - but I've never heard of even the newest most modern outboard managing it.

 

[ezmobee]

Re: Shifting issues - I hate outboards

I was just thinking that if you hate the shifting issues with an outboard you REALLY don't want an I/O

 

[jimdd810]

Re: Shifting issues - I hate outboards

Hey you said in your first post you had a mechanic redo the lower unit because it was trashed. By trashed what do you mean. If he had to dissassemble the lower unit then take it back too him and reassamble it right.

 

[aborgman]

Re: Shifting issues - I hate outboards

Hey you said in your first post you had a mechanic redo the lower unit because it was trashed. By trashed what do you mean. If he had to dissassemble the lower unit then take it back too him and reassamble it right.

Yeah, I'm waiting to hear back from him as to when to bring it by.... irritatingly, it's about an 1.5 hour drive each way.

 

[jtexas]

Re: Shifting issues - I hate outboards

"...the idea of a "super reliable" outboard is an oxymoron."
outboards (at least of the vintage we're talkin bout), don't have all the fancy sensors and computers we find on our cars, to optimize the timing and mixture of every single combustion cycle -- lotsa spark plugs going 100k miles nowadays. Remember when cars had carburetors, and tune-ups were annual events?

They sit around for weeks or months on end (tough on any kind of machinery), then get rode hard and put up wet. Our boat motors need regular maintenance, and break down if they don't get it. Or if they do.

1961 model...that's pretty old even by my standards. Late-70's/early '80's johnnyrudes IMHO best value for the $$$ and economical to maintain, if you're the least bit handy. Reliable enough but easy to fix, and plenty parts support (OEM and aftermarket). Once you stop paying for mechanic labor it gets a lot less painful.

 

[F_R]

Re: Shifting issues - I hate outboards

Well I don't know, I have a 1984 Johnson 35hp that sits for months and will always start right up and run flawlessly. I also have five old motors dating back as far as 1946, and they all will start and run and push the boat. The '84 has never had a thing done to it other than it just got its second water pump replacement, and one set of plugs has been changed. Both items "just because". The gear lube has been changed a couple of times too..."just because".

If you don't like outboards, perhaps you shouldn't have one.

 

[aborgman]

Re: Shifting issues - I hate outboards

"...the idea of a "super reliable" outboard is an oxymoron."
outboards (at least of the vintage we're talkin bout), don't have all the fancy sensors and computers we find on our cars, to optimize the timing and mixture of every single combustion cycle -- lotsa spark plugs going 100k miles nowadays. Remember when cars had carburetors, and tune-ups were annual events?

My previous daily driver car was a 1964 VW Microbus. 4 years, 53,000 miles - not a thing but routine maintenance and the only time it didn't start was when the battery died. I've had lots of old motors that were a lot more reliable than it seems like folks even relatively new outboards are.

..1961 model...that's pretty old even by my standards. Late-70's/early '80's johnnyrudes IMHO best value for the $$$ and economical to maintain, if you're the least bit handy. Reliable enough but easy to fix, and plenty parts support (OEM and aftermarket). Once you stop paying for mechanic labor it gets a lot less painful.

I definitely need something newer, but the insane prices just are too much...

 

[aborgman]

Re: Shifting issues - I hate outboards

Well I don't know, I have a 1984 Johnson 35hp that sits for months and will always start right up and run flawlessly. I also have five old motors dating back as far as 1946, and they all will start and run and push the boat. The '84 has never had a thing done to it other than it just got its second water pump replacement, and one set of plugs has been changed. Both items "just because". The gear lube has been changed a couple of times too..."just because".

I'd say that experience seems to the exception that proves the rule, but maybe it's just my experiences and the sample of folks I've talked to.

If you don't like outboards, perhaps you shouldn't have one.

Believe me, if there were another way to power a small boat similarly - I wouldn't. Lack of alternatives kind of forces my hand though.

 

[bigpoppakdog]

Re: Shifting issues - I hate outboards

Well I don't know, I have a 1984 Johnson 35hp that sits for months and will always start right up and run flawlessly. I also have five old motors dating back as far as 1946, and they all will start and run and push the boat. The '84 has never had a thing done to it other than it just got its second water pump replacement, and one set of plugs has been changed. Both items "just because". The gear lube has been changed a couple of times too..."just because".

If you don't like outboards, perhaps you shouldn't have one.

You're a supreme mechanic on outboards, so anything you own won't breakdown. Isn't that how it works?

 

[bktheking]

Re: Shifting issues - I hate outboards

So pull the lower unit off, seperate the skeg and look at what is going on with the gears/shifting, could be something simple. Outboards are (at least OMC ones) simple to work on with the proper tools and literature and the help of Iboats folk.

 

[1946Zephyr]

Re: Shifting issues - I hate outboards

Well, I think the biggest problems with outboards are lack of use and lack of maintenence. Many people let them sit for years without doing anything to them, then they wonder why they break down. You have to remember, this 40hp is only 49 years old. Not many cars that old are everyday drivers. There sure are a lot of motors that old that are still running strong though and are everyday runners for a lot of us old outboard nuts.