Shame on them

[gonfishn]

It seems that returning War Vets are finding when they return that they have no jobs to come back to..Even though the law says that they must be rehired many employers are finding loops holes to get out of it..<br /><br />A man leaves his family and life behind him to preserve our freedom of right and comes back to an uncaring society..It was that way 30years ago except no law was around to help a fellow vet out.<br /><br />Not Surprised since it took the goverment 30 years to recognize the effects of agent orange on returning vets and compensate them..Wonder how long they will wait when vets come back after exposure to the chemicals that are being used now against them..Different year same game..Use the vet then sweep them under the carpet and hope they would just go away..Shame on us for letting this happen..

 

[gaugeguy]

Re: Shame on them

A couple lawsuits have been filed by returning Vets here because the jobs they left are no longer there for them

 

[JB]

Re: Shame on them

Kind of a broad brush you are using there, GF.<br /><br />How many employers are you unfairly bashing by complaining about the few?

 

[RichP1269]

Re: Shame on them

We had one vet return after almost a year of service. Not only did his company hold his job for him, but they paid him his full salery for the time he was on active duty.<br /><br />If I remember right, it was a computer company here in the S.F. Bay area.

 

[gonfishn]

Re: Shame on them

I don't recall saying how many JB in my post..Be it one or a thousand does it matter..Since your the man in the know JB maybe you could do the reasearch if you need the exact numbers..Excuse me I did say "many"..You do get newspapers where you are at don't you? Our paper carried a section that interviewed a few who had this done to them..<br />I say try the shoe on and if its fits you then its for you ..Wide brushes are for folks who have big mouths so that they can cover more areas at one time...

 

[gsbodine]

Re: Shame on them

It is certainly happening, though hopefully it's not the norm. Here are some cases, if you are interested. I have heard of a case where it happened at Pep Boys as well, but didn't immediately see the link.<br /><br /> http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2001886624_guard24.html <br /><br /> http://www.military.com/NewsContent/0,13319,FL_sues_072904,00.html <br /><br /> http://www.aberdeennews.com/mld/aberdeennews/8593320.htm

 

[gonfishn]

Re: Shame on them

Thanks ON..I think I read in the thousands already. I may be mistaken here but aren"t there still 500,000 or more who are still in the war zone and have yet to come home..<br /><br />That great RP to hear that..I bet that employer had some military background to..What is a small majority>1,000 10,000, 100,000. Even if its one its not right for these emploers to try and find loop holes not to hire..The brush seems to be growing JB..

 

[mellowyellow]

Re: Shame on them

MY got yur back GF ..couldn't agree more! <br />problem is, enforcing requires litigation and<br />that is never quick or cheap.<br /><br />anyone know what the "penalty" would be for a<br />company that didn't adhere to law???<br />prob. slap on wrist...

 

[Carphunter]

Re: Shame on them

Couldn't agree more GF! <br /><br />If this has happened once, then it is one time too many!<br /><br />I am not a Veteran. There are some in my family that are. Regardless if I am a Veteran or not, these folks that have served, and are serving in the military, have always had my utmost respect and admiration.<br /><br />Haven't we learned from our past mistakes! <br /><br />There are laws to prevent this from happening, but some, (S O M E), employers are finding loopholes . Another law that won't be enforced I guess.<br /><br />Pathetic how some of these folks get treated.

 

[BrianFD]

Re: Shame on them

I know of only one person here at work who's reserve unit got called up for an extensive stay in Iraq. If I'm not mistaken, he is receiving full pay from his (my) employer all the time he's gone, PLUS his vacation pay for what he'll not use this year (option to roll 1/2 of it into next year's vacation bank). That made me feel real good to know that the outfit that I thought were 'skinflints' are really good humanitarians.

 

[mellowyellow]

Re: Shame on them

maybe wrong, but think feds. offer some $ breaks<br />to employers like yur's BFD...

 

[SpinnerBait_Nut]

Re: Shame on them

There are a lot of employers out there that wioll do it as long as they can get by with it.<br /><br />It's the bottom line is all they care about.<br /><br />I seen it happen to many a Viet Nam vet and yep, it will and is happening this time too.<br /><br />Such a shame. Maybe something can and will be done.<br /><br />1 is too many. IMO.

 

[Barlow]

Re: Shame on them

I see this in both lights<br />the Gaurd is a job .. like none other of course .. but still a job (part time for most) job duties include playin' war 2 weekends outa every month for which they get paid for with the understanding that if some state, regional or national emergency arrises their 'job description' includes the possible participation of them as a person if needed... with pay of course.<br /><br />- they know this when they signed on -<br /><br />now, how ever long they've been away for - say 6mo. for conversation sake, they expect thier old employers to welcome them back with open arms while durring those six months they may have had to take the time to search, train and brush up a replacement... <br /><br />hmmmmm .... not too sure where I stand on this one.

 

[gsbodine]

Re: Shame on them

Originally posted by Barlow:<br /> hmmmmm .... not too sure where I stand on this one.

it doesn't matter where you stand. it's the law for employers now. they not only should, they must.

 

[Barlow]

Re: Shame on them

yea ...<br /><br />but there again - theres a law that states no spitting on the sidewalk in town here too... <br /><br />and two of the 4 male officers we have here are smokeless tobacco users ... big deal.<br /><br />who's to say that employers are to be regulated as to having to hold a job for someone whos part time job took them away from their full time job for a span of time longer than a few weeks.<br /><br /> I just question the judgement on which the law makers have made their decision...<br /><br />its my right to question ... keep an open mind ... <br /><br />one link above for example ... why in the world would you sue a company for a job/gain employment ..??? ..<br /><br />.. realy confuses the H-E-DOUBLE-HOCKEY-STICK outa me! ... comfortable working conditions for all after that I assume.<br /><br />can't find a job .. hog wash. maybe locally ... but someone somewhere is hiring .. and you/they/me might be perfect for the job.<br /><br />BTW my father is a nam vet, 3 tours in the air... one of the few lucky ones to come home. Have many other friends and family that were/are involved in both full time military and nat. gaurd. I've never spent time with the military myself.

 

[gsbodine]

Re: Shame on them

Originally posted by Barlow:<br />can't find a job .. hog wash. maybe locally ... but someone somewhere is hiring .. and you/they/me might be perfect for the job.

seeing that many if not most of the people have families, it is just not that simple. at least I wouldn't consider it that simple. kids and schools and spouses with jobs, family nearby (or not nearby ), all factors that would make non-local job transferring (especially the unplanned sort) make extremely difficult. that's why this law was passed. we depend on reservists now more than ever militarily. this law was recently passed (1994) to account for this. it's not some now-random/arbitrary archaism left in the records like so many of our state and municipal statutes.

 

[kenimpzoom]

Re: Shame on them

Its just the media scrambling for headlines, these cases are pretty rare. Check out the story on Yahoo. Headlines say "Many reservists losing civilan jobs" but read further and find this.<br /><br />"Labor was receiving about 900 formal complaints a year before the Sept. 11. The statistical picture since then, based on fiscal years ending Sept. 30: <br /><br /><br />_1,218 cases opened in 2002. <br /><br /><br />_1,327 cases in 2003. <br /><br /><br />_1,200 cases from Oct. 1, 2003 through July 31. If projected over 12 months, the figure would be 1,440, the department said. <br /><br /><br />Soldiers' complaints were upheld or settled by the department in one-third of last year's cases, while another third were found to have no merit. The remaining cases are inactive or closed, often because the government lost contact with the soldier or the soldier returned to active duty. <br /><br /><br />When Guard and Reserve troops returned from the first Gulf War (news - web sites), there was one complaint for every 54 soldiers leaving active duty. Currently, with the government's aggressive drive to inform employers of the law, the figure has improved to 1 in 69. <br /><br /><br />The complaints represent a small percentage of the quarter-million Guard and Reserve troops who left active duty since the Sept. 11 attacks. "<br /><br />That doenst sound like many to me. But I agree, it shouldnt happen to any one of them.<br /><br />Full story: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm...20040816/ap_on_re_us/returning_from_war_guard <br /><br />Ken

 

[Barlow]

Re: Shame on them

I agree totally Ol' Norse .. the situation does not seem easy at all. I see your point and the laws.<br /><br />for a minute hypothetically assume the position of an employer who is not of corporate size and one that can't absorb the expenses and difficulties involved tho? .. say the man/woman was a sales/product rep. <br />Who covers their territory in the mean time?<br /><br />.. probably push more responsability onto other people that aren't involved in the day to day ops. of the person thats gone ... customer service suffers, sales may suffer, and general chaos, and poor attitudes by folks picking up the slack.<br /> These might be only a few of the troubles encountered.<br /><br />now, put up with that for 6mo. to a year and see where your business stands. <br /><br />in the link above ,if I read it correctly, the guy had been working there for 10mo. up until December 2002 when he was deployed. He became clear from the Doc. last Oct.<br /><br />that's dang near 2 years ... wow! now how've your sales been? office attitudes? any people 'jump ship' from too heavy a work load? ok now what do you do?

 

[gonfishn]

Re: Shame on them

Those who have served have given up a part of there lives to secure everyones freedom Barlow..<br /><br />Lives,families careers are put aside because of there love for their country..Is it to much to ask to let those who sacrificed everything to be able to come home and resume there lives again where they left off. <br /><br />Your so right Spinner..For me its like seeing yesterday 30 years ago today..A quick pat on the back,some thanks and then you hope you go away and not bother them anymore....I remember those days and see the attitude today..<br /><br />Remember you have what you have today because of those who gave their all with no questions asked ..

 

[Barlow]

Re: Shame on them

GF - My Fathers flight helmet and other sorts of memorabilia from are here in my home office on a shelf no further than 20' to my left. I'm reminded of this daily the sacrafices men and women make for our great country and the life of freedom we know and cherish and sometimes take for granted.<br /><br />My father- God bless him, hurts for these kids and what they might face when they return .. and to respect my father in the way that I do also rubs off onto the other men and women that have put it on the line. <br /><br />Heck ...In March, I drove to Fort Campbell on the Tennesee/Kentuky border when my bro-in-laws brother returned from Iraq. A member of the 101st Airborne Screamin' Eagles .. He has 3 kids .. I had them stay here with me at my home when they came through on vacation. Sis/bro-in-law have 4 kids and there was no room at the 'Inn' so I offered. In doing this I learned from Tony some of the difficulties they are currently encountering .. but he also stated that doors are opening more so for these people than others on the other hand because of the increased patriotic movements.<br /><br />I can say I support our troops -as civilian people too- and their sacrifices with-out a doubt and fully!! <br /><br />but I'm still not sold on the law ... maybee I'm shallow or ignorant. I don't know.