series vs. parallel

dragula65000

Petty Officer 2nd Class
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Apr 14, 2004
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180
Ok, I have a 1989 hydra-sports bass boat, 18 ft. I took I have 3 batteries, I asume 1 for starting, and 2 for accessories. The 2 for accessories are dead, and they are 780 CCA. Do i have to get the same batts, or can I go bigger without destroying the 12 V system. Also, what is series and parallel in running the wires have to do with hooking them up?
 

SuzukiChopper

Senior Chief Petty Officer
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Oct 10, 2004
Messages
782
Re: series vs. parallel

Can't answer about the battery replacement other then they should be 12v batteries you replace them with if they began their life as 12v batteries.<br /><br />Series wiring: In your case with three batteries, you could connect the negative of one to the positive of your 2nd. The negative of your second to the positive of your 3rd and then use the positive connection from the first and the negative connection on your third for all your power. This will effectively give you 36v of power and release the magical smoke from everything electronic on your boat (unless of course the device is meant to run at 36v).<br /><br />Parallel wiring: when you connect the all the positives together and all the negatives together, leaving a positive and negative lead for use for power. This setup still gives you effectively 12volts, but the effective power you're able to draw is more. <br /><br />Hope this helps... if I screwed that one up someone let me know. Ciao!
 

burp

Petty Officer 1st Class
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Aug 3, 2002
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Re: series vs. parallel

12 volt batteries connected in series will result in the output voltage being the sum of the batteries voltage. 12 volts + 12volts = 24 volts. <br /><br />While 12 volt batteries connected in parallel will have an output voltage of 12 volts but the available current will be the sum of the current each battery can supply. An example of this is a boat with dual batteries and an Off-1-2-All battery switch. If battery 1 and battery 2 are discharged and neither one individually will start the engine. Move the battery switch to the all position, the current available in battery 1 and battery 2 together, will then hopefully be enough to start the engine.
 

JB

Honorary Moderator Emeritus
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Mar 25, 2001
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45,907
Re: series vs. parallel

Yup. Like burp said.<br /><br />Series adds the voltage.<br /><br />Parallel adds the current.<br /><br />Good luck. :)
 

ThomWV

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Dec 19, 2003
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Re: series vs. parallel

That was well put. Let me eleaborate on it.<br /><br />Draggula,the first thing I can tell you is that you have the wrong batterys in your boat. Your question tells us that. I am sort of suprised that no one picked up on it. I'll get back to that in a moment.<br /><br />Count the caps on one of your batterys. Notice that there are 6 of them, one for each cell of the battery. Each one of those cells has the ability to put out about 2 volts of power and depenedent on its internal surface area it will have the ability to hold some amount of power. No matter how big the cell is it will still only put out the 2 volts but its capacity to store energy will go up as the volume of storage material goes up - which is generally associated with a physically larger battery.<br /><br />Inside of the battery all of those little 2-volt cells are connected together in series, so the result of having 6 of those cells connected together in series is that you have a 12-volt battery. So internally it looks something like this: The first cell's positive side is connected to the battery positive battery post, but its negative side is connected to cell number 2's positive terminal and cell 2's negative side is connected to cell 3's positive and so on until the end of the line where the last cells negative side is connected to the battery's negative post. As this goes on the capacity of the each of the cells just adds up, so if the first cell had the ability to hold 20 amps of power and the second cell, to which it is connected in series internally, has the same capacity then the total capacity of the two cells together is 40 amps. So when wired in series the battery's output will be both the sum of the voltages of each cell but also the sum of the amperage capacity of each cell. So what that means is that if you connect the positive terminal from one 12-violt battery (lets say 100 amp hour battery) to the negative terminal of a second 12-volt battery (also 100 amp capactiy_ and then draw your power from the remaining positive and negative terminals (one on each battery) the result is a capacity that is going to be the total of 200 amp hours capacity and 24 volts output.<br /><br />To connect batterys in parallel is to simply hook positive leads to positive leads and negative leads to negative leads. When you do this you still get the additive effect on capacity, which is to say the the amp/hours capaictys of the two batterys will be simply added together, but you will still only have 12-volts output.<br /><br />I said I'd get back to how I knew you had the wrong batterys and so here it goes. You said in your question "The 2 for accessories are dead, and they are 780 CCA." Here is the question you might have asked yourself when you said that - what am I cranking with those batterys?<br /><br />If those are your accessory batterys they aren't cranking anything at all. It is your "Starting" battery that 'cranks' the engine, not your accessory battery(s). Now let me grossly oversimplify an aspect of battery construction so you'll understand what I'm trying to say here and also to point out a little battery choice trick that is never mentioned.<br /><br />All power that comes from a battery results from a chemical reaction that takes place where the electrolite meets the active material of a plate. Batterys that are made for putting out a large jolt of power in a short period of time tend to have lots of very thin plates. Having lots of skinny ones means that there is a lot of surface area, and that's where the power is made (I know as well as anyone that batterys do not 'make power, they store it). Unfortunately skinny plates can't hold a lot of power and they disintegrate faster than thick ones, but they do put out power. Batterys that are made to store large amounts of power, the sort of battery you would want to run a trolling motor, tend to have fewer plates, but thicker ones. They will still put out a great deal of power but they are designed to be able to do it for a longer period of time, but at a lower intensity.<br /><br />So how do you tell one battery from another? They all look about the same on the outside. Well, there is one way to tell, look at the specifications. There are a zillion differenct specifications, and they can be confusing as hell, but basically there are really only two sorts. There are cranking specifications which are used almost exclusively for batterys with lots of skinny plates and there are capacity specifications for batterys that have fewer but thicker plates. When you said your batterys had so many CCA capacity what it told me was that you were using starting batterys to perform what are basically deep cycle duty. If you are looking for a battery that will power things for hours onj end look for one that advertises its Amp/Hour rating and makes no mention what so ever of any kind of cranking power, not marine cranking amps (MCA) or cold cranking amps (CCA) or even "Reserve Capacity" which is one of the most meaningless of all of the specifications but one that can generally be converted into Amp/hour capaictiy by simply multiplying by 0.6, so a battery with an advertised Reserve Capacity of 215 amps would probably be about equal to a rating of 129 Amp Hours if it were being sold under other circumstances. Yours are 'starting' batterys, that is all I know about them.<br /><br />Thom
 

Dunaruna

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May 2, 2003
Messages
6,027
Re: series vs. parallel

Originally posted by ThomWV:<br /> So what that means is that if you connect the positive terminal from one 12-violt battery (lets say 100 amp hour battery) to the negative terminal of a second 12-volt battery (also 100 amp capactiy_ and then draw your power from the remaining positive and negative terminals (one on each battery) the result is a capacity that is going to be the total of 200 amp hours capacity and 24 volts output.Thom
Thom, could you check me on that statement. You are saying that connecting in series doubles the AH (same size batts). Is that a typo? My understanding was that it doubles the CCA but not the AH.<br /><br />I run 6 x 6volt batts, all same brand/size (220AH each). 3 banks of 2 batts, each bank connected in series. Using your statement I should have 1320AH but I don't , I've got 660AH. Have I got this all wrong?<br /><br />Aldo
 

18rabbit

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Nov 14, 2003
Messages
3,202
Re: series vs. parallel

No. You are correct, Aldo. You either combine the voltage (series) or you combine the amps (parallel), but not both. It was probably just a typo.<br /><br />In your case, a pair of 6v batteries in series is combined for 12v. Then each pair in parallel is combined to increase the amps. Your total amps is 3 x 220. Your total voltage is 12vdc.<br /><br />Btw, congrats on choosing the 6v bats. Excellent deep cyclers...also works great for starting, too. :) <br /><br />Edit: If you got to http://www.rollsbattery.com and click on [Products], then click on [Marine] you will see a little animation that is exactly what Thom is talking about. It is a 12v battery that is made up of six 2v cells…in this case they are removable 2v cells so the battery can be maintained. Some of those 12v Rolls bats with removable 2v cells cost close to $1400. They have a 10-year warranty, if that helps.
 

Dunaruna

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May 2, 2003
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Re: series vs. parallel

Thanks guys, I don't have a problem with understanding all this, I've actually already successfully setup my house/motor batt systems - just wanted to double check Thoms' post.<br /><br />Merry Christmas!!<br /><br />Aldo
 

Realgun

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Jul 31, 2003
Messages
2,484
Re: series vs. parallel

I think I will just as the guy at walmart for a 12V battery. ;) <br /><br />ThomWV your very helpful.<br /><br />I was going to just use the sarter/troll battery to start and troll but I thing I will get a real trolling motor battery for the trolling motor and leave the combo to start.
 

Darrendude

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Nov 16, 2004
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Re: series vs. parallel

Real gun,<br />They have trolling batteries at walmart. They are called deep cycle. I got two huge ones for about $56 each
 

Realgun

Commander
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Jul 31, 2003
Messages
2,484
Re: series vs. parallel

I got the original battery that says start/troll for about 39 I think at wally world. But I am going to get another battery fror trolling and can then swap if I eveer need to just to start the motor. (It is a Force and I love the simplicity.)
 

18rabbit

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Nov 14, 2003
Messages
3,202
Re: series vs. parallel

Realgun - I suggest the biggest deep-cycle battery you can afford for trolling. Most are capable of providing the amps needed to start a motor. Never seen one that wouldn’t.
 
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