Roster tail fear - technical advice needed

[DaveM]

I hate to admit this, but I am starting to have fear crossing the wake on my weak/off side turn. I don't have this problem from my strong side. I am hoping that someone can describe the proper stance and technique when crossing the wake that eventually gets me over this new fear of mine.

I refuse to use my own I/O and instead ski behind a friend's Brendella, which has a wake with a roster tail at 15 off. I hit that roster tail smack on, but really don't want to go to a shorter length rope. My skill level is OK, but not great--2 buoys at zero off.

This probably started after a few fly swatter falls with the ski too neutral when hitting the wake coming out of my weak side turn. I really would like to get thru this if I am going to continue to make the effort of 5:15 AM runs!

Any advice would be appreciated. Feel free to be technical.

 

[haulnazz15]

Re: Roster tail fear - technical advice needed

I assume that the Brendella is a jet boat since you mention rooster tail? If it is a jet boat, does he have a jet-a-vader that he can trim down to keep the rooter tail as short as possible? I'd say "don't hang out" on the wake when crossing it. On your off side, most people have a tendency to not lean as aggressively on that side. Make sure to hold the handle at your waistline and keep enough weight on your front foot to keep the edge planted.

 

[DaveM]

Re: Roster tail fear - technical advice needed

Nope, not a jet boat. The Ski Brendella is an older tournament ski boat with a flat wake and a characteristic roster tail. The original builder sold and went on to create MB tournament ski and wakeboard boats, using his initials for the name.

 

[haulnazz15]

Re: Roster tail fear - technical advice needed

Well, I was asking because when I googled that manufacturer, both the Ski Brendella and the Brendella Jet Boats came up. So apparently the name exists for both boat designs. While I don't have any experience behind inboards, what is causing a rooster tail on the boat?

 

[skibrain]

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

Agree the rooster tail on inboard tournament boats can be issue at 15' off or 22' off.

If you're skiing buoys, I'd skip it for now and just fee ski for a while.
I may even skip trying to make turns for now and just work on wake crossings so you get the feel of a solid pull.

I'm guessing that you do the following on your off side: You turn in toward the wake (maybe breaking forward at the waste because it is not your strong side), load the line and begin accelerating. Then see the wake, take a good look at it, unload and ride the ski FLAT over the wakes becoming airborne or doing a whoop de doo, and then try to continue a pull.

1. Stance on Your Ski

No straight legs. Your front knee should not be in a locked, straight position. Keep your knees soft. with weight EQUALLY on front and back feet. The days of tail-riding a slalom ski ended 20 years ago.

2. Body Position

During your pull toward the wakes it is important to be in a strong position. The ski is on edge between you and the boat. Your arms should be straight, shoulders back and square with the direction the boat is moving, hips up toward the handle (or rope pushed down toward your thighs if that is an easier way to visualize). Think of rope as a steel cable pulling you from your navel. From your core. From your center of mass. Your body in a strong stacked position, your back straight and you taking the load through your core and legs. If your UPPER BODY is square, strong and back, then your knees can be free to bend as you ski through the wakes absorbing the rooster tail bump.

Start wide. Slide into that strong position behind the boat, keeping your ski on edge and the handle low all the way through the wakes. Then glide out wide. Don't worry about a sharp cut. As your ski slows and begin drifting back toward the center line, slide into that strong pull position again and ride the ski on edge with handle low and shoulders back all the way through the wakes again. Do it 6 times. Do it 30 times. Get used to skiing FAST through the wakes and on edge both ways. BTW, Don't look at the wake. Don't look down. Look at the pylon or back of the boat or even down the lake in the direction the boat is going.

 

[paultjohnson]

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

Are roster tails bigger or smaller then rooster tails?

 

[haulnazz15]

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

All I know is apparently rooster tails in the inboard world are much different than in the jet boat world, lol.

 

[skibrain]

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

More often I hear people refer to it as a "bump" at 15' or 22' off.
You didn't state your skiing speed but boat speed may have an effect as well...both in size and the distance from the boat. As does weight, we pull the back seat out and prefer to ski with quarter to half tank of gas. And a shorter line generally puts you ahead of the bump on an inboard.

 

[haulnazz15]

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

Ahhh, I understand what we're talking about now. I was under the impression that he was having an issue with a rooster tail the center of the wake, not the edge. Mooving ballast to one side to minimize the bump is about the only way I'd know to combat the problem aside from generally ignoring it and just cut through it.

 

[DaveM]

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

I'm guessing that you do the following on your off side: You turn in toward the wake (maybe breaking forward at the waste because it is not your strong side), load the line and begin accelerating. Then see the wake, take a good look at it, unload and ride the ski FLAT over the wakes becoming airborne or doing a whoop de doo, and then try to continue a pull.

Thanks, Ski. You give some great advice--exactly what I was looking for. Impressive, you are spot on with your guess.

I see that you are in Mini-soda, but I swear you have seen me ski here in WA.

Are roster tails bigger or smaller then rooster tails?

Dammit Jim. I'm a software nerd, not a copyright editor. OK, so I am either a spelling idiot or that is the west coast syntax (I'm not from here originally).

 

[DaveM]

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

You didn't state your skiing speed but boat speed may have an effect as well...both in size and the distance from the boat. As does weight, we pull the back seat out and prefer to ski with quarter to half tank of gas. And a shorter line generally puts you ahead of the bump on an inboard.

I usually free ski at 32-33 MPH as I am older than I once was. I rarely ski the course, but my last time doing so is probably a fair assessment of my ability. I swear this bump has grown in the past few years. There are soft spots on the floor and I wonder if the floor/stringers on the old Ski Brendella are starting to get soggy.

 

[skibrain]

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

This is the best wake photo I could find.
34 mph behind a 2004 Malibu LXi. I think my buddy Dave is at 15' off just heading toward the entrance gates. The foamy bump or rooster tail is just in front of him.

You can see that closer to the boat (by the orange ball and closer) it is flatter. Further back it spreads out into two small but distinct wakes.

 

[DaveM]

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

Yes, this is it and I can see why you would call that a bump. The Brendella wake is a little different in that it produces a 6-8" shark fin like wave on top of the bump. This is probably why Brendella never matched the reputation of a Malibu or Mastercraft.

This is an interesting photo. I can see why this is my weak side: squaring my shoulders to the boat looks like it requires more of a countered upper body position compared to a turn in the other direction (does that sound right?). So my question now is, when he hits that bump, is he finishing his current turn or does he initiate the new turn?

Sorry for wanting to break a turn down into nano-second increments. I have been training to become more aware of edge angles and body positions throughout a turn.

 

[skibrain]

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

Yes countered skiing into the turn. and shoulders twisted square to the boat coming out. Edge change just after the bump.

Viewed from the boat, after the wakes you should be seeing the top of the skiers ski (they have switched to the inside edge) On the way toward the wakes is when you see the bottom of the ski.

Here are a few quick youtube links to take a look at:

Marcus Brown ? I am amazed at how he skis and hooks up out of his turns and creates acceleration by putting his center of mass AHEAD ? not just back away from the boat.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3QAKJudLVvI&feature=related


Terry Winter ? More compressed behind the boat. Really smooth. Instructional V.O. and slow-mo is helpful. There are other youtube movies for these two as well. When I grow up I want to ski like Terry.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9DTxTJ1FslM&feature=related

 

[haulnazz15]

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

The angle of your shoulders should be the same regardless of which side you are on, it just requires you to work harder to square you shoulders on the off-side due to your stance. Keeping that rope off of your waist/bellybutton/etc allows you to keep a consistent reference point on both sides of the wake. Do you ski with a matched grip or baseball-bat style grip?

 

[DaveM]

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

Re: Rooster tail fear - technical advice needed

This is great stuff and exactly what I was looking for! I should have known there would be Youtube videos on the subject, but I also find the written word really helpful. Skibrain, you would make a really good coach. Say, now there's a swell idea--how about a lesson the next time I find myself in the neighborhood
I wonder if a ski will count as my 1 carry on personal item...

Keeping that rope off of your waist/bellybutton/etc allows you to keep a consistent reference point on both sides of the wake. Do you ski with a matched grip or baseball-bat style grip?

Yes, I think you are right about stance. As for grip, I use a baseball bat grip with the handle at hip level.