Reclaim thread for outdrive malfunction problem

[fredcrn]

Lost original thread. <br /><br />Thanks to those who responded. Capt Ken and ****. I'll recap here:<br />Was cruising at idle just fine. Sped up to 20mph and shortly therafter the engine revved up and boat was out of gear. <br /><br />The thinking here seems to be a problem with the shafts between the upper and lower unit.<br /><br />**** had suggested putting shifter in gear and attempt to turn prop counterclockwise. I tried this and was able to turn prop clockwise with resistance...counterclockwise there was a lot of resistance at first and then it would turn about the same as clockwise. Does this confirm Capt Ken's diagnosis?<br /><br />Thanks, Fred

 

[fredcrn]

Re: Reclaim thread for outdrive malfunction problem

I guess the moderators have decided your name is not appropriate for this board ****...otherwise known as Richard. Please respond again.

 

[Capt Ken]

Re: Reclaim thread for outdrive malfunction problem

Oh man, I knew all those drugs I did in the sixties would catch up to me. Now I've lost a whole month. There is three shafts in that drive that are vertical. Lower shaft that is connected to the lower unit, upper shaft that is connected to the lower gear in the upper gear housing. Then the middle shaft that powers the water pump and connects the two gearhousings together. It is very common for the middle shaft to strip out where it connects to the upper shaft. Your test results tells me either the shafts are stripped or the gears in the upper is stripped.

 

[fredcrn]

Re: Reclaim thread for outdrive malfunction problem

Thanks Capt<br />Either way, I assume I'm going to have to pull the outdrive. I've been checking out the clymer manual and it appears I'll have to dimantle most of the outdrive to get at the problem. Does this sound right?<br />Fred

 

[Capt Ken]

Re: Reclaim thread for outdrive malfunction problem

Give the boy a donut, he's getting smarter. Yep, no way around it. Time to disassemble ol bessie.

 

[fredcrn]

Re: Reclaim thread for outdrive malfunction problem

Finally got some time to tackle the outdrive. Before I removed it I drained the gear oil and apparently I have a real problem. The upper was milky, big time, and the lower was a pukey yello-tan color. I ran the motor briefly to winterize the engine and noticed that the squeal was coming from the upper. It also stopped just before the engine stalled out from fogging.<br /><br />Assuming there is any good news here at all...I didn't see any filings/metal chips in the crap that drained out. Do you suppose the gears might have survived this? Probably be a week or two until I can get to tearing down the unit.<br /><br />Appreciate your thoughts on what I might encounter.<br /><br />Thanks, Fred

 

[sea wolf]

Re: Reclaim thread for outdrive malfunction problem

sounds like bad seals as witnessed by the milky gear lube. what kind of outdruve? year?

 

[Capt Ken]

Re: Reclaim thread for outdrive malfunction problem

Yep, you have seals leaking but that's not the cause of your problem. You can replace the seals now, then you can replace them next year and the year after that. You can't keep those stringer models from leaking especially the uppers. If you went thru a marina and pulled the plug on all stringer models, half would have some amount of water in them.

 

[dick]

Re: Reclaim thread for outdrive malfunction problem

Well glad to here you got it winterized.Sounds like you got a winter job ahead.Can't say how the bearings and gears will be but I've pulled a few of these drives down(and put them together) and you don't now what you get till your in there .There are some things you should know ,some parts for these drives are becoming rare and expensive so DON'T force things apart ,take your time.If the drive is put together right you will need a press to remove the ball gear from the shaft and the driven gear of the vertical shaft.There is also special tools needed to shim the drive and place seals at the right depth.Just a few hints.Here is a exploded picture of a 800 series upper drive

My scaner is toasted so I can't give you the right picture of the upper and I havn't been able to find a lower view on the net yet. good luck.

 

[fredcrn]

Re: Reclaim thread for outdrive malfunction problem

Seawolf...thanks for responding. It's an '83 OMC 5.7L with a 260 HP outdrive. Since it's a V8, I'm assuming the outdrive is an 800 series.<br /><br />D...I'm curious about the magnets. I think I have a mechanical shift. Will I still encounter magnets? I appreciate the blowup...I have both a seloc and clymer manual for the boat now. Hoping to be able to start tearing the outdrive down this weekend. As for the pressed on parts, I'm hoping to be able to get them to a local machine shop or marine repair shop to have them removed as necessary. No sign of metal in the gear oil, so I'm keeping my digits crossed that it's not too torn up in there.<br /><br />Cap't...If that's the case with the seals, what kind of recourse is there? If the seals leak that badly, would it help to replace gear oil after every use? I don't imagine the gear oil is going to be doing much if it's contaminated with water.<br /><br />Thanks for all responses. There may not always be a solution to be offered, but sometimes it's nice just to have some moral support.<br /><br />Love this forum.<br /><br />Fred

 

[Capt Ken]

Re: Reclaim thread for outdrive malfunction problem

Actually the hypo 90 oil will absorb 50% water and will lubercate everything just fine. The leaking was always a problem with all the stringer models. Yours doesn't have magnets. The pull/pull cables rotate a wheel in the lower unit that changes the gears. You're going to have to reseal the upper because it will need breaking down for the repair. Just pressure test the unit when reassembled and hope for the best.

 

[dick]

Re: Reclaim thread for outdrive malfunction problem

Sorry about that , they lost your first thread and for some reason I thought you had a electric shift. Just ignore that stuff about the magnets and shaft seals . and here is a lower for you .

 

[fredcrn]

Re: Reclaim thread for outdrive malfunction problem

Capt Ken...thanks for the info. Does this mean the pukey yellow gear oil from the lower end was absorbing water, rather than contaminated? I noticed when I pulled the drain plugs the lower end drained clear water for a moment then gear oil. What's up with that? Also, if the problem is as you suspected and the shaft that connects the upper and lower has stipped the splines, won't I have to break down the lower as well?<br /><br />*ick...Thanks for the blowup. All assistance is greatly appreciated.<br /><br />I want to thank you all for having patience with the dumb newby questions. Are there any tricks/surprises I should be on the lookout for when I start to pull this thing down? I know from my experience working on my vehicles that the manuals can sometimes leave out little details that turn out more often than not to be crucial.<br /><br />Fred

 

[fredcrn]

Re: Reclaim thread for outdrive malfunction problem

Pulled upper off of lower today. Found numerous o-rings and seals worn or just plain missing. Discovered the upper drive shaft is worn almost smooth where it mates with the water pump pinion gear. The inside sleeve of the pinion gear shaft is looking pretty worn as well. The splines are recognizable, but not very deep. I can't figure out how to remove the pinion gear et al to replace the shaft. Any input now would be appreciated. <br /><br />The lower drive shaft looks to be pretty good. Do you think I should tear the lower down while I'm this far, or should I leave well enough alone, now that I've found the problem?<br /><br />Thanks guys<br />Fred

 

[Capt Ken]

Re: Reclaim thread for outdrive malfunction problem

Ok, so you've removed the four big bolts holding the water pump on. Well, those also hold the housing that holds the upper shaft and gear in. It should knock out also and you will have everything in your hands. Now getting the bearing preload on the new shaft is kinda tricky, so you might get some local help on that. I was taught by an old mechanic that had me spin it on the bench to get the proper feel. Don't think I can convey that over the internet.

 

[fredcrn]

Re: Reclaim thread for outdrive malfunction problem

Capt Ken...The upper shaft and gear should come out if I smack the bottom of the shaft? I guess I'm going to have to purchase the upper gear set for this repair, right? Was hoping you could just remove the gear from the shaft and replace the shaft. Not possible?<br /><br />Guess I'd better take your advice about the bearing preload, since I don't have a clue what you're talking about. I thought you would just reassemble the whole mess.<br /><br />thanks<br />Fred

 

[Walt T]

Re: Reclaim thread for outdrive malfunction problem

You'd be suprised what Ken is able to convey over the internet. he actually wears a shirt that says "Keep back 200 feet" on the back. We all say that isnt far enough.

 

[dick]

Re: Reclaim thread for outdrive malfunction problem

What , buy a new gear set ? I thought you said the shafts were stripped? You can buy just the shafts if the gears are good.Once you undo the nut on top of the gear you press the shaft out . Be sure to suport the housing as close to the outside dia. of the lower seals so you don't damage the housing.The seals will come out with the shaft.Just so understand you should have the lower bearing housing #51 out of the case sitting on the bench, undo the nut,#43 and press out the shaft#47 supporting the underside of #51 in a way that lets the shaft and seals to be pressed out.

 

[fredcrn]

Re: Reclaim thread for outdrive malfunction problem

Thanks D*ck,<br />That's what I need to hear. I did find the shaft available. When I first checked, it appeared to only be available as a set. But, you're right, on closer examination it is available. Whew! <br /><br />I'm thinking that since I don't have the tools/expertise to set up the gears, I'm going to let the boys at the shop put her back together. I'm going to talk to them tomorrow and price the parts through them and if they're to expensive, I'll buy them off the internet. <br /><br />What would you suggest I do about the lower? Would you keep going and replace seals etc. or leave well enough alone at this point?<br /><br />btw...really appreciate the help.<br /><br />Fred

 

[dick]

Re: Reclaim thread for outdrive malfunction problem

When it comes to gearcase work most people will take to a shop.It's completely impractical for you to buy the necessary tools for a one time job.The pukey oil in the lower is from water .Re-sealing the lower isn't to bad if you don't have a leak at the shifter housing(this is were the cable goes into the case)As you can see from the picture It can be a complex little bugger if you have never taken one apart.Can pressure and vacuum test the unit?If it's just propshaft seals or the seals for the vertical shaft you might want to do it or you may just want to have a shop check it out as well.One more thing I have said it before these drives are very difficult to keep water out . The best advice I can give is to check the oils often and change them at the first sign of water.