Problems on First Slalom Ski Outing

Sondar

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May 1, 2008
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I tried slalom skiing (on a connelly Outlaw) for the first time last weekend. Had an absolute nightmare!

Finally worked out how to get out of the water, but could only stay up a couple of seconds because the front of the ski started squirrelling and flipped me straight off.

Any tips on what I was doing wrong?
 

12vMan

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Jun 4, 2008
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Re: Problems on First Slalom Ski Outing

Sounds like you may have had too much weight forward. Lean way back, be aggressive and pull hard while keeping the ski straight.

If that doesn't work, you may want to switch feet and see if it feels 'right':cool:
 

tommays

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Re: Problems on First Slalom Ski Outing

When learning we allways found it better to get up on two skis and kick off one (watching out for other boats ;)) so you can get a feel for standing before learing a deep water start


This will also help you decide if your a left or right foot forward as there is no correct way BUT which feels better to YOU
 

Sondar

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Re: Problems on First Slalom Ski Outing

Thanks guys. I thought it might be a problem with the weight too far forward, but that was the only way I could get up at all - just need to be able to shift the weight as I come out I guess!

I'm aiming to book in for some lessons so hopefully that'll help.
 

12vMan

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Re: Problems on First Slalom Ski Outing

Good luck, and don't get too frustrated. You'll be cutting the wakes before you know it:cool:
 

wca_tim

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Re: Problems on First Slalom Ski Outing

Good luck, and don't get too frustrated. You'll be cutting the wakes before you know it:cool:

As above.. most important thing, don't get discouraged and keep at it. It can take a while to get to the point where you can stay up for a while... and then if you're like me... you keep pushing and wipe anyhow.

Once you get some time in and really start to geth the knack of it, it's a real rush... still one of my favorite playtime things to do... and i'm just a hack...

enjoy!

ps. dropping a ski does make it easier when you first get started, also I've found that early on most people learn to deepwater start better with the back foot dragging...
 

lombard

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Jun 26, 2008
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Re: Problems on First Slalom Ski Outing

I've been fighting the slalom thing for a while. Of course, going out once a year makes it tough. Anyway, since I'm at about the same stage as you, my only thought is that maybe you're pushing and standing up too soon. Lean back and stay that way until you're comfortably up on plane. Should help you avoid getting your weight too far forward.
 

OhWellcraft

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Jun 22, 2007
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277
Re: Problems on First Slalom Ski Outing

I agree with above stay leaned back and keep your knees bent but don't break at the waist, that will get the center of gravity too much over the ski and make it want to wash out. Also make sure you are going fast enough for the ski to track well if you are going too slow it will want to wash out as well. Also ski design has ALOT to do with stability on the water. If the concave on the bottom goes from edge to edge that offers the most stability but makes getting up a bit tougher due to more water being pushed. Skiis that have a small concave right down the center 1"-2" wide will be easier to get up on but much less stable/trackable once on the water. Try and experiment with more pressure on your rear foot by leaning back a bit even if you are going a bit faster this will slow you down and straighten everything up quickly. Stay with it and it will come, try different skiis too.
 

shorts&chanclas

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Mar 27, 2008
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Re: Problems on First Slalom Ski Outing

All good advice especially about leaning back. I use the same ski with a double boot. Its a very good intermediate to advanced recreational slalom. It's responsive, tracks, and cuts great. Deepwater starts are fine for me and it feels fine as low as 27-28mph.
 

Sondar

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Re: Problems on First Slalom Ski Outing

Thanks for all the comments!

Had a couple of lessons yesterday, starting on the learner bar and by the second session I was getting up on the ski on the tow rope (we didn't try the dropped ski method). Made it across the wake a few times and round a couple of turns without falling off it, so I'm pretty stoked with that.

One thing he did say was that it helps to have the tow rope attached to a pylon so that you get some help with lift on the start. He was running it off quite a high pole (maybe 2m), but said that it's normal to drop to a lower pylon once you're used to the starts. My boat's a Bayliner 175 with a transom mounted hitch, so it's quite low - is it necessary or advisable to fit a pylon to it?
 

wca_tim

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Re: Problems on First Slalom Ski Outing

I have a feelling that the vast majority of us learned to slalom with a transom mounted tow rope...

It's just a matter of practice... drop a ski until you get better at deep water starts. You'll definately get the hang of it and if you keep at it, you'll be dragging an elbow before you know it...

Depending on what kind of water you boat in and the kind of people you ski with, I used to love to do hop ups and dock starts as well...
 

AguaSki

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Jul 4, 2005
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545
Re: Problems on First Slalom Ski Outing

Lots of comments about getting your weight to the rear of the ski. This is because of the fin under that ski. The fin is what gives you the stability. The more you keep the fin in the water, the more stable the ride will be. If you get your weight to far forward, the fit starts to come out of the water and you lose your stability. Everyone's comments seem to be right on target, but I thought an explanation as to why keeping weight to the rear is important.

As for pylons, they really are not needed, but I personally would not slalom without one. I think you need to decide how serious you are about slalom skiing. In most cases towing from the transom will be fine, but the pylon is a nice option if you can get your hands on one. Pylons run $125 - $200 at most boating stores. I watched Ebay for a year and eventually picked a pylon up for $30. Most pylons on Ebay go for close to $100, but I happened to get lucky.
 

codertimt

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Re: Problems on First Slalom Ski Outing

Thanks for all the comments!

Had a couple of lessons yesterday, starting on the learner bar and by the second session I was getting up on the ski on the tow rope (we didn't try the dropped ski method). Made it across the wake a few times and round a couple of turns without falling off it, so I'm pretty stoked with that.

One thing he did say was that it helps to have the tow rope attached to a pylon so that you get some help with lift on the start. He was running it off quite a high pole (maybe 2m), but said that it's normal to drop to a lower pylon once you're used to the starts. My boat's a Bayliner 175 with a transom mounted hitch, so it's quite low - is it necessary or advisable to fit a pylon to it?

Congrats on getting up and slaloming.

My opinion on the pylon is that is not needed. It might make it a tad easier, but a normal ski pylon is only going to be slightly higher than the center tow eye on your I/O Bayliner.

Even though you've had coaching and got up now, I wanted to throw in one more suggestion that I've seen other places and can really attest to now...don't look down at your ski. Keep you head up, looking at or over the boat. For some reason this magically keeps the rest of your body in a better position and helps you from getting pulled to far forward.

I just repropped my boat and on my second outing since a 5 year hiatus, I kept getting pulled out the front everytime. Probably made 15-20 attempts and never made it up. The boat was pulling strong and in my overweight and out of shape state, I couldn't compensate for the bad body position and the boat was just pulling me forward. In hindsight, it dawned on me that I was always staring down at the ski. I went out again today and made a conscience effort to keep my head up, never looking at the ski...and lo and behold, I came right up. Of course, then I skied for about 1 minute and was exhausted, but that's another issue...:redface:
 

WizeOne

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Re: Problems on First Slalom Ski Outing

Oh, where to start Sondar. First off, if you were able to get up and on the surface, you have won half the battle. I did google Connelly Outlaw 'cause my early experience with Connelly was that it was a real hot rod ski, not one for beginners. The description, however, showed that it was a good ski for you.

Secondly I will ask, were you suitably fortified with Fosters.:D Water skiing is a very intuitive undertaking. For my part, I struggled for many seasons, hanging on for dear life, every ripple threatening to toss me off. I would not let go because I was skiing with friends and did not want to fail.

Then one day I discovered ALCOHOL. It relaxed me and in no time at all I kicked back and cruised thru the chop. (I have to add, I tried that with snow skiing and it did not work for me)

Many have said, you need to lean back. I do not think that is an adequate description of what you need to do. You need to lock your rear knee and lean back against your stiffened rear leg. Leave you front knee loose to variably absorb the shock while you keep the skeg planted with your rigid rear leg.

Another pet peeve of mine is that new skiers are started off with a single handle. I think this is a big mistake by big hot dog skiers trying to teach newbies. I think double hands are much easier to get up with and they are much easier to adjust slack and tension on the rope.

I think the "pylons' are a gimmick. It also doesn't matter whether the rope starts out low on the transom or higher on a ski pole.

Bottoms up and good luck to you.

Oh, I forgot to comment. Which foot forward? Traditional wisdom is the right sided person should place their right foot forward. To do the opposite was long ago labled "goofy foot". I contend that, once up, it is the rear foot that excercise the majority of control, the front just acting, if you will, as a shock absorber.

If you are considerably one sided, as I am, you should start out with your dominant foot in the rear boot. It is true that while getting up your forward foot has most of the control but once up it shifts to the rear foot and you certainly want to use your best foot. Although you have not spoke about your foot position, I could almost guarantee you, that along with an understanding of balance, that you best foot is in the least position of control.
 

Sondar

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Re: Problems on First Slalom Ski Outing

All interesting stuff, thanks guys.

I did read the new skiers threads and I'm sure all the info was there, but having a sieve for a brain I forgot most of it once I got in the water, so it helped me enormously having an instructor telling me exactly what to do!

My instructors view was that the strongest leg should be in the front binding & it worked for me under tuition. My initial thought had been that it would be the other way round, like in snow boarding, but my experiences seem to bear out his view. I did try both in my initial "day of disaster", but I think there were too many other things going wrong to give me a balanced view of it.

He was pretty hot on keeping the head up as he reckoned that most learners fall off if they look down. As far as I was concerned, as soon as I was out of the water, it didn't bother me much looking down, but I can see why it's a good idea.

I think I'll see how I get on without the pylon before I go making any holes in my boat to fit one. Hopefully I wont need it.
 

cmcpherson

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Jun 11, 2006
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Re: Problems on First Slalom Ski Outing

What kind of a boat are you taking lessons on? If you are going to ski normally behind that 175, that thing is going to drag you through the water a lot longer than what my guess is that you are learning on. BTW, pylons are far from a "gimmick," and they are far from necessary either for recreational skiers. If they are such a "gimmick," why is nearly every true ski boat made with a pylon?
 

Sondar

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Re: Problems on First Slalom Ski Outing

Lessons were using a purpose built Malibu ski boat - and yes, I'd say that I'll probably be pulled through the water longer on my boat that with the ski boat. I can live with that.

I don't think the pylons are a gimmick - but I'd guess the benefit is more in relation to getting the tow rope at a natural height when the skier is up, rather than helping to get the skier out of the water. I don't know much about it, but I can imagine that this may be critical in competition use and not really relevant for recreational skiers.
 

tashasdaddy

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Re: Problems on First Slalom Ski Outing

not relevant to casual skiers. a tow harness works just fine, and more money for skiing.
 

rak98221

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Jul 9, 2008
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Re: Problems on First Slalom Ski Outing

If you can adjust the fin, adjust it all the way to the back of the ski, this should make the ski more stable.
 
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