Need help big time at a loss

[Sebbieboy]

Here are two pics to try to show you whats going on - one doesn't have the starter mounted and the other does. The gear is off the starter as I need to turn first before I put it on. The solenoid is a three pole one - I have a four pole as well and I have tried both - doesn't appear to make a difference.

The pic without starter is to show that without starter on, everything seems fine. Solenoid clicks and I get 12.7 V when I crank the key out of the big yellow cable.

Problem is that when the starter is mounted - the pic with the starter - it doesn't work. All of sudden I don't get the 12 V out the solenoid - it's like it short-circuits itself. And I don't understand why. I hear like a hissing sound out of the starter when I crank key - like something spins inside.

I tested the starter it works fine.

I have an older thread on this called starter and solenoid and I did a bunch of things to get to this point but now I'm stuck big time. Hoping I can get some more ideas. Thanks everyone.

 

[MH Hawker]

Re: Need help big time at a loss

If the starter is spinning and the Bendix isn't jumping up then the starter is spinning back wards.

 

[Sebbieboy]

Re: Need help big time at a loss

If the starter is spinning and the Bendix isn't jumping up then the starter is spinning back wards.

No it doesn't spin - I just hear a sounds inside of it when I crank the key. The Bendix is not on it at this point.

 

[MH Hawker]

Re: Need help big time at a loss

no idea. Have you measured the resistance across the big solenoid posts. it should be 0 ohms. Any resistance at all means its not letting the amps through. And what dose it do if you jump across those posts.

 

[Sebbieboy]

Re: Need help big time at a loss

no idea. Have you measured the resistance across the big solenoid posts. it should be 0 ohms. Any resistance at all means its not letting the amps through. And what dose it do if you jump across those posts.

I will do a resistance test between the two big ones - although am not sure what it tells me - but you will

 

[Sebbieboy]

Re: Need help big time at a loss

I will do a resistance test between the two big ones - although am not sure what it tells me - but you will

K I think I got something - I did a resistance test - I did the tests with starter and solenoid mounted and connected - this is what I can make sense of:
- good continuity from big pole to starter
- good continuity starter to ground
- I get no reading between big poles
- I get resistance between small pole 3.9 ohms (three pole solenoid) and big pole to starter
- I get no reading from small pole to battery big pole.
- I get resistance from small pole to ground 3.8 ohms
- I get continuity between big pole starter to ground
- I get no reading between big pole battery to ground

Can you make sense of this? I didn't try to jump am scared to fry my starter. I think I fried my other one when I tried to jump yesterday (the smell). I probably didn't understand that diagram properly you posted. This starter is new an works I tested it yesterday. Thanks MH for your help.

 

[MH Hawker]

Re: Need help big time at a loss

Lets try this first.
The big posts on the solenoid transfer power to the starter. All it is is a big set of contacts designed to transfer a large amount of amps directly to the starter. A momentary touch between the two ( 1 second is more than enough time ) is exactly what the solenoid dose when you use the key it goes directly to the starter. This is a very common test to see if the solenoid is bad, or if the starter is bad. Its a pass or fail thing, when you jump the posts the starter will spin and turn the motor if its good, if it dosnt then the starter is bad. it really is that simple.

My boat is on the slip or I would make you a vid.

 

[Bob_VT]

Re: Need help big time at a loss

Just a question....... have you bench tested the starter while not mounted?

 

[Sebbieboy]

Re: Need help big time at a loss

Just a question....... have you bench tested the starter while not mounted?

I bench started it - it works - but without the solenoid - I don't have the tools to bench start both of them together - I would need one of this key switch thingy right?

 

[Sebbieboy]

Re: Need help big time at a loss

Lets try this first.
The big posts on the solenoid transfer power to the starter. All it is is a big set of contacts designed to transfer a large amount of amps directly to the starter. A momentary touch between the two ( 1 second is more than enough time ) is exactly what the solenoid dose when you use the key it goes directly to the starter. This is a very common test to see if the solenoid is bad, or if the starter is bad. Its a pass or fail thing, when you jump the posts the starter will spin and turn the motor if its good, if it dosnt then the starter is bad. it really is that simple.

My boat is on the slip or I would make you a vid.

I was about to do the solenoid test and realized that I didnt even have a click no more in the solenoid. I changed the solenoid cause I have two of them and same thing. I charged the battery last night - may be it was the problem all along (am hoping). Am going to get a new battery tomorrow.

 

[Sebbieboy]

Re: Need help big time at a loss

Alright I was hoping but it isnt the battery - I bought a new one and still the same problem. MH I tried the solenoid across the two big posts and nothing happens whatsoever.
So are you thinking the starter is bad? I really don't think so, it must be something else I just tested it a couple days ago. I could test it again. suggestions anyone?

 

[MH Hawker]

Re: Need help big time at a loss

If you jump the big poles on the solenoid and the starter dosnt spin and crank the motor the starter is bad , its that simple. Thats if the battery is charged and has good connections. And i am sure you do. Off of the motor is not much of a test.