Need a Suzuki Mechanic's ADVICE

[AlwaysFishn']

2004 DF115 Suzuki- Still getting water in oil only under a load
Started out having water in oil unfortunately end result was white foam. I bought a Full gasket set - proceeded to go after my head gasket which wasn't it. I followed the service manual to fit back together torquing sequence.(Maybe it needs to be redone/)I have no liquid in cylinders. I found an area around my engine holder exhaust that showed to have a blow by leak it appeared to be burnt marks I've check for flatness with a straight edge it doesn't appear to be warped (I've been through 3 crushed gaskets thinking that was the problem)(so I put a thin layer of the "Right Stuff" gasket maker under gasket and on top of crushed gasket in between the engine holder and power head in last resort as going through 3 gaskets previous. Are these blocks or heads known to crack is there a way to check for cracks or am I not looking at this right? I notice that there are many large screws or inspection screws but I don't know what to look for using them. The motor runs great/ idles great/ sounds good/ I go to lake to test run put it under a load and ten minutes later the oil is white errrrr. I realize the best thing is to bring it in but for the finance situation I have---I have a few months to figure it out on my own or with your help. If I'm not explaining myself correctly ask me the question I will try to answer to figure this thing out.

 

[Silvertip]

Re: Need a Suzuki Mechanic's ADVICE

If it has ever been overheated -- yes heads and blocks can crack. If you are in a northern state where it routinely freezes and and engine was stored tilted up, frozen water can crack a head or block. Improper gasket installation, sealer not being used on bolts that thread into water jackets, are all ways water can get into the oil.

 

[AlwaysFishn']

Re: Need a Suzuki Mechanic's ADVICE

Thanks for the reply sounds like I need to break into it again. Can these heads be repaired or do they need to be bought brand new from a parts dealer? But before I do that can you advise me on how to use those inspection screws what to look for or ?

 

[Silvertip]

Re: Need a Suzuki Mechanic's ADVICE

Depends on where they crack. If it's cracked through a valve seat its new head time.

 

[AlwaysFishn']

Re: Need a Suzuki Mechanic's ADVICE

Well I think it's time to do some digging Thanks

 

[bezerk]

Re: Need a Suzuki Mechanic's ADVICE

when you take the power head off again.check the very bottom of the crank case ,on the head side of the crankcase in the middle where #4 cyl is .this is where the water passage is for the cyl's clean the area you should see a little hole. you don't have to take the head off

 

[AlwaysFishn']

Re: Need a Suzuki Mechanic's ADVICE

Thanks bezerk for the heads up.
I will look for that it's funny when I tore it apart the first time I had sand at the bottom of the #4 water passage(as we have many sand bars where I live). But I think I should be able to Marine Tex the hole crossing my fingers.

 

[AlwaysFishn']

Re: Need a Suzuki Mechanic's ADVICE

I had to take some time off from working on this machine so here I am again
and am I stumped -- I've got the engine torn apart again I checked cylinder #4 for any pin holes or disturbed paint I've scraped and looked for anything in the jacket as well. I've scoured every inch of the jacket to the block I can't see where it would be leaking. I did however have a intake valve that was wet compared to all others that were dry it would have came from bottom #3 cylinder- but all pistons look the same not washed or cleaned out. So I looked very carefully for anything out of the ordinary on all valves anything around the jackets as well and they all look good. I put a straight edge on the head and block I can't physically see any warping going on. I do have white deposits in my exhaust shoots figuring that's cause I have a leak somewhere uh? Could my pressure relief/pressure regulator have anything to do with what I have going on? As for the plug going into my exhaust port reports of others having a pinhole in theirs and rusting from in to out the plug has nothing to do with my oil / water mixture not contacting oil just exhaust from what I can see. I don't remember reading a bolt that needed sealed when in contact with the water jacket is there? Or better asked is their a bolt that secure's the head to block that requires a sealant to prevent water in oil mixture

 

[goldstem]

Re: Need a Suzuki Mechanic's ADVICE

may not be in the powerhead. Our suzuki wore out a gasket in the oilpan. the water from the water pump goes up right through the oil pan on the way to the powerhead. we were pumping water right into the oil from there. I can imagine that if this is just starting to go, it would only pump water into the oil pan under higher pressure/higher RPM.

 

[AlwaysFishn']

Re: Need a Suzuki Mechanic's ADVICE

goldstem-- So how did you come to the conclusion it was that gasket did it show plain visual able wear/cracks or did you just start changing gaskets and are you talking about the round one that fits over the tube to the oil case?? I did look at that at one time thinking the same but it looked fine but I will definitely looking again Thanks

So I have a picture of the dots on right hand side of the piston in to which I would think it's water am I right or do I have something else going on here??

 

[bezerk]

Re: Need a Suzuki Mechanic's ADVICE

yes looks like water. need pic of head now.
i think i added a pic of where i wanted you to look if it works .
did you take the engine holder off too, the bolt that's on the in side next to the exhaust should be be sealed with the suzuki bond the black stuff .

 

[AlwaysFishn']

Re: Need a Suzuki Mechanic's ADVICE

bezerk Thanks for responding here's the pic's. I also have some vertical indentations grooves in my cylinder walls #2,#3. (I'm thinking due to lack of lubrication) I had a guy from down the road who has worked on vehicle motors he says the grooves should be able to be smooth out with a honer without having to replace the rings. (there not deep but definitely needs to be re-honed) And yes I've removed the engine holder many a times I have used the black silicone on those bolts but maybe not enough I will when I put back together again. As for the area you had pointed out I don't see any holes or dips with the pick all looks and feels good. My next question is when I dig into the crank case to remove the piston's and all the goodies of course I will keep everything in order and replace back together in the exact spot as to which they came from but is there anything that I should replace while I have that assembly apart whether it needs it or not since I'm already there? I should add this motor only has maybe 150 hours running on it.

Thanks for the heads up

First pic is of head
2nd pic I pointed as to where I think the water was coming in
3rd pic as to where no water

 

[goldstem]

Re: Need a Suzuki Mechanic's ADVICE

thegasket in the oilpan ( our oil pan is in two parts) was far enough gone that it was clear when we pulled it apart that there was our breach. we were pumping water in at idle at this point. btw this was a suzuki df50, don't know if the oilpan in the bigger motors is constructed the same way.

 

[GoogieMan]

Re: Need a Suzuki Mechanic's ADVICE

thegasket in the oilpan ( our oil pan is in two parts) was far enough gone that it was clear when we pulled it apart that there was our breach. we were pumping water in at idle at this point. btw this was a suzuki df50, don't know if the oilpan in the bigger motors is constructed the same way.

Just heard the same thing happening with a 05' honda, had been leaking trough were the pan mainly because it was never flushed .

 

[AlwaysFishn']

Re: Need a Suzuki Mechanic's ADVICE

goldstem -- Interesting two parts mine is actually just one big box but either way when I order another gasket set I will order a new pan gromment/gasket heck I've gone this far. Thanks for the heads up

 

[AlwaysFishn']

Re: Need a Suzuki Mechanic's ADVICE

GOOD NEWS I found the culprit to my many nights of headaches after the 12th time of tearing down finding out where the water in oil is happening I got frustrated left the lower end off and placed the hose directly to the water port with the engine tilted back far enough for the hose to remain on the pipe I let the water run for quite some time with the engine off I had drained the oil after having the motor hot in the process I had the unit turned to the right in the process of draining all the oil==anyways I noticed I had a ever so light amount of straight water coming out of the drain hole and as the motor cooled down the water come to a stop. But while the water was dripping about a tablespoon worth in a 15 min. period I took the valve cover off I could hear a dripping sound but couldn't see it (tell you the truth I was wishing I had one of those snake camera's but who's got that amount of money) so I took the motor off the engine mount thinking the matting surfaces was not correct but as my observing the light exposed a hair line crack in the water jacket and the oil case underside of the mount. The epoxy gray paint the factory used was scraped off in doing this other wise I would have gone right over it again. I have the unit at a machine shop hoping to have it home next week. A new one will run well over $800 bucks which at this point I just want it fixed. I will try to get a pic up as soon as I can I hope this helps someone else.

I also had a friend over the other night and he was asking if I go in the ocean as well as the freshwater and yes I do he said maybe the salt had built up on my crank shaft the water will work it's way up and eventually enter the oil seals in the engine mount all it takes is a small bur either on the shaft or on the seal to enter the oil case so I used a tub called Bel-ray Waterproof/salt resistant grease $7 dollars a tub the grease is a dark blue/green my opinion very awesome.

 

[fovea]

Re: Need a Suzuki Mechanic's ADVICE

I have a suzuki 9.9 kicker on my boat in saltwater; I saw the thread re the screw in attachment (finally!!!!) to be able to flush out the cooling passages, located up on the engine (so i'm also looking for this screw...) ; however, it says i need to plug the intake hole(s) first:

the boat's in the water, and I can tilt the engine up and out only only so far , but where exactly is/are the intake water hole(s) and how the heck does one plug these before flushing?

I tried to get a 5 gallon bucket on the ehd to flush, howeveri dont think I can fil it with water appropriately given the angle needed and the short transom.

 

[ronniejames]

Re: Need a Suzuki Mechanic's ADVICE

I have a 2005 Suzuki 140DF 4 stroke do you have to pull the powerhead to replace the head gasket?????

 

[lakensea]

Re: Need a Suzuki Mechanic's ADVICE

I have a 2005 Suzuki 140DF 4 stroke do you have to pull the powerhead to replace the head gasket?????

Yes.

 

[ronniejames]

Re: Need a Suzuki Mechanic's ADVICE

Thank you!!!