Lifted F250 with bed camper and boat

[Biggredd]

I have a 2008 Ford F250 crew cab, long bed, tuned Diesel (up to 650 horsepower). I have a pop up style truck bed camper that probably weighs around 1500 fully loaded, it isn't too heavy (give or take a few pounds). I recently got a 21' open bow Marada with V8 probably weighs in the 3,000 lb range. It does not have any brakes on the trailer. My truck has a 6" lift and 35" tires fyi. Should I be making it a priority to get brakes on that trailer or should it be acceptable if I use caution while driving when towing both the inbed camper and boat?

 

[H20Rat]

Re: Lifted F250 with bed camper and boat

going down the road, your boat/trailer/fuel/gear is probably well above 3000#, so without brakes, you are illegal in colorado already. The fact that it is has larger than OEM tires cuts your braking ability even more, so I'd probably do brake upgrades on the tow vehicle also. (people usually overlook the fact that its probably not a good idea to add more power without first figuring out how to stop it. Brakes and power upgrades go hand-in-hand.)

 

[Bamaman1]

Re: Lifted F250 with bed camper and boat

I too have a F250 Supercab setup for towing with a D-P power programmer. If you weighed your trailer and boat, you'd be pushing 4,000 lbs with a full tank of fuel and your "lake stuff." V8 powered I/O's are all pretty heavy and need trailer brakes in most states.

You're in Colorado where there are big mountains and deep valleys. And, a 6" lift and 35" tires do nothing for you in the handling department. You should consider adding the brakes.

If your boat trailer already has the square brackets welded on the end by the spindles, you could easily and inexpensively add brakes to your trailer. I use ChampionTrailers.com for info on anything to do with trailers and parts.

When I went to the power programmer, my truck had the shakes when stopping, and it had a bunch of steering play. I went went through the suspension and brakes--to like new condition. The preferred brakes on a SuperDuty truck are Hawk LTS brakes, and the preferred shocks are Bilsteins. You may be someone that also needs cryo-treated drilled and slotted brake rotors.

With high horsepower, big tires and lift kit, you should pay very close attention to your brake parts AND the suspension condition at all times. You can easily get in big trouble with that much power in a vehicle that handles like an elephant on ice.

Good luck!

 

[boat1010]

Re: Lifted F250 with bed camper and boat

Yes you need trailer brakes. When you say " should I just take it easy" isn't the problem. Others do not know that you might have a hard time stopping. Trailer brakes just make it that much better. Without them you are putting LOTS of stress on the bumper and hitch. I assume you have a drop down hitch with the lift and big tires. So there is stress on those with just normal stopping. Get trailer brakes and be comfortable driving knowing that if something comes up you can stop. It will be pretty bad if you rear end someone and they figure out that you should have had brakes and the insurance company says Ummmmm we will not pay for that. Protect your stuff and get brakes put on the trailer.

Just sayin....

 

[BobGinCO]

Re: Lifted F250 with bed camper and boat

The Battlestar Galactica (F-250 with V-10 Gas) has worked well with my 2,100 pound Lance Camper, and pulling the 4,300 pound boat and trailer. Sure it's a little slow heading up to the tunnel, and over Berthoud pass, but it does OK.

But you would be a fool to try that without brakes. I had to add them to my trailer. And illegal. And did I say really, really stupid?

Adding brakes wasn't that hard. It cost me about $1,200 WITH replacement of both axles.

 

[Biggredd]

Re: Lifted F250 with bed camper and boat

luckily the trailer does have a welded on bracket with holes for me to add the brakes. Truck does have a stock brake controller so I may look into some marine style electric brakes so I can use that. Truck handles the camper like it isn't even there. And yes, will be a drop hitch. Would suck for sure having limited brakes on the far side of the Eisenhower tunnel before Silverthorne. Guess this will be my winter project after I learn to winterize for the first time. Thanks

 

[batman99]

Re: Lifted F250 with bed camper and boat

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Trailer (RV, Utility, Boat) must have its own brakes under the following conditions:
a - Local laws state the max trailer weight before needing its own brakes. In my region, the number is 3,000 lbs. In next region over, its 2,000 lbs. And in some USA states (like California), its 1,500 lbs. Regardless of Tow Vehicle, any trailer above xxx lbs must have its own brakes (on the trailer). Suggest researching the towing laws in your Region. And, research in visiting regions as well.
b - In some regions, the Tow Law is applied to visitor Tow Vehicle combos as well. For example, my region is 3,000 lbs and if I plan on driving within California (as example), then "their region" rule applies to my Tow Vehicle / trailer. Meaning, my trailer over 1,500 lbs (but below 3,000 lbs for my regional law) must have its own brakes (on the trailer).
c - Details of the unique Tow Vehicle. For my Tow Vehicle (which is a V6 engine ), it clearly states that any attached trailer over 2,000 lbs must have its own brakes (on the trailer) - regardless of local laws. If I tow a 2,500 lbs Trailer, I'm towing "under" the local region laws. But, my Tow Vehicle's factory brakes is being over taxed. Especially on panic stops - where braking power can warp front rotors and create other vehicle damage. Thus, my attached trailer (boat trailer) of 2,500 lbs needs its own brakes.

If your Tow Vehicle manual states 3,000 lbs, then subtract the weight of your add-on camper. Thus, remaining factory stopping power could be 1,500 lbs. Any trailer attached to your loaded Tow Vehicle over 1,500 lbs needs its own brakes (on the attached trailer) - regardless of your local laws. Without trailer brakes, the Tow Vehicle factory brakes will be over taxed (over stressed).

Hope this helps…

 

[batman99]

Re: Lifted F250 with bed camper and boat

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If doing boating in Salt Water, many recommend the install of brake assemblies, hubs, etc. made for salt walter. re: Marine grade parts. These items are galvanized and can take salt water exposure much better.

If only doing boat in clean fresh water (like my region), then normal utility trailer brakes assemblies and brake hubs will work great. re: Normal steel parts found under utility trailers and RV trailers.

For fresh water, I like electric brakes the best. Simply unplug the 7-pin connector before backing boat into water. And after loading the boat, pull trailer into "on deck" parking spot, tie down the boat, then re-connect the 7-pin connector. I like electric brakes the best because of their electrical self diagnostics and in-cabin power adjustments. The other poster was correct… Cost me approx. $500-$800 to install electric brakes on a 1 x 3,500 lbs axle system (including inside Tow Vehicle Brake Controller unit and its wiring). And, it was well worth it…..

Hope this helps as well....

 

[Biggredd]

Re: Lifted F250 with bed camper and boat

Will be fresh water strictly. Lake Powell may be the big destination next summer, otherwise local lakes (oversize puddles) in Colorado will be the only water it sees. Not sure why it didn't just have brakes already, kinda sucks to have to pay extra but guess thats how it goes. Pretty good price on the website mentioned above. Guess I can just add those, just need to get the wiring from the brakes to my bumper and I'll be set.

 

[LippCJ7]

Re: Lifted F250 with bed camper and boat

you are well within Colorado law requiring brakes on your trailer (3000 lbs) but to be completely honest you most likely have four wheel disc brakes anyway and your going to want to be gentle with them anyway, I love my Ford but the achilles of the truck is the disc brakes, they are wonderful until you build heat in them and then they are simply done, with that in mind go ahead and get trailer brakes and be done with it. I would also advice airbags to help handle the top heavy camper, its not required but its one of the best additions I have ever done on my PSD to help control my truck camper, especially on those windy days.

 

[SWD]

Re: Lifted F250 with bed camper and boat

I just purchased a boat and trailer which were manufactured in the US. I guess one braking axle is the norm whilst here in Canada brakes on each axle are mandatory. I would deffinately get brakes put on your trailer, as for me, mine are surge brakes and I need to overhaul/rebuild the whole system. I will also be installing additional brakes on the second axle and just tee off the existing line.

 

[batman99]

Re: Lifted F250 with bed camper and boat

I just purchased a boat and trailer which were manufactured in the US. I guess one braking axle is the norm whilst here in Canada brakes on each axle are mandatory. I would deffinately get brakes put on your trailer, as for me, mine are surge brakes and I need to overhaul/rebuild the whole system. I will also be installing additional brakes on the second axle and just tee off the existing line.

Yes. Many trailers have brakes on one axle and the other axle (the front axle) remains as an idler axle. Before running out and installing brakes on the idler axle, suggestion doing some simple "upgrade benefit" math first. Thus, determining if brakes are mandatory or a "nice to have" - for your unique Tow Vehicle + trailer combo.

For simply math:
- Obtain the "empty" Cargo Capacity of your Tow Vehicle. For example, my V6 Tow Vehicle is 2,000 lbs. Many V8 Tow Vehicles are 3,000 lbs (or more). For now, let's assume its 3,000 lbs. re: 3,000 lbs can fit in the vehicle's insides and trunk - before being over loaded.
- With average loaded Tow Vehicle, determine remaining Cargo Capacity. For example, 1 x passenger @ 250 lbs, 100 lbs of cargo and a 50 lbs dog. Thus 400 lbs of cargo. Simply take 3,000 lbs - 250+100+50 = 2,600 lbs. 2,600 lbs of remaining Vehicle Cargo Capacity.
- What is your attached trailer's "average" loaded Scale weight? For example, let's say its 3,800 lbs. Thus, why 2 x 3,500 lbs axles are used under your loaded boat trailer. Or, perhaps 2 x 2,200 lbs axles under your boat trailer instead?
- For now, take 3,800 lbs (loaded boat trailer) and subtract 2,600 lbs (remaining Tow Vehicle Cargo capacity) = 1,200 lbs. If your trailer had NO brakes, your Tow Vehicle's factory brake system would be over taxed (over stressed) by 1,200 lbs. Thus, great idea to install Trailer Brakes. Without trailer brakes, your Tow Vehicle would risk warped brake rotors and other mechanical damaged - from being over stressed.
- Since 1,200 lbs is the "over stress lbs amount", your attached trailer only needs brakes on 1 of its 3,500 lbs axles. And if installing brakes only on 1 x axle, it get's installed on the rear axle. Installing brakes on its 2nd axle would be an over kill. And, a waste of money.

From a pure math calculations, your Tow Vehicle + Trailer combo only needs brakes on 1 of its axles (its rear axle).

Hope this tip helps…

 

[SWD]

Re: Lifted F250 with bed camper and boat

Your math makes sense, however in Canada all new trailers must be equipped with brakes on each axle. I realise I have an older trailer that is "grandfathered" into the single brake axle, but since I have to replace both the existing drum units, for the cost of $140 for two additional drum kits, its a great easy add on and will bring the trailer up to "code".

 

[H20Rat]

Re: Lifted F250 with bed camper and boat

Your math makes sense, however in Canada all new trailers must be equipped with brakes on each axle. I realise I have an older trailer that is "grandfathered" into the single brake axle, but since I have to replace both the existing drum units, for the cost of $140 for two additional drum kits, its a great easy add on and will bring the trailer up to "code".

seriously all new trailers? The added weight and expense of brakes on something like a 4x6 garden trailer that someone uses to haul leaves to the trash seems a little, idiotic? A braking system on a small trailer is going to DOUBLE the cost of the trailer!

 

[batman99]

Re: Lifted F250 with bed camper and boat

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Boath axles on "recreational" trailers need brakes?

Surf: http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/pubs/recreational-vehicles/pdfs/recreation-vehicle-info.pdf
Focus on lower page 5

re: "Service brakes are required on house trailers if the trailer's axle(s) transmit more than 1,360 kgs (3,000 lbs) to the road when the trailer is attached to the towing vehicle. This applies to cases where the trailer is loaded or empty. If brakes are required, at least one axle of the trailer must be fitted with brakes."

If you have documenation that clearly states both axles on recreational trailers like RVs (5ers, TTs), Utility and Boat trailers (re: not commerical trailers) need mandatory brakes when above 3,000 lbs, please share...

thanks.

 

[SWD]

Re: Lifted F250 with bed camper and boat

seriously all new trailers? The added weight and expense of brakes on something like a 4x6 garden trailer that someone uses to haul leaves to the trash seems a little, idiotic? A braking system on a small trailer is going to DOUBLE the cost of the trailer!

Yeah....sorry should have said tandem trailers. I have a 4x8 utility trailer with a single axle, no brakes on that. Anything over a certain axle weight needs to have brakes and if equipped with tandem axles then both need to be equipped with brakes. This requirement may vary from province to province. My 1999 5500# travel trailer has brakes on both axles, so does my 20ft stock trailer, so does my 32ft flat deck trailer.

The following is from the SGI web page regarding towing in Sask.
"Stopping distance is longer when towing a trailer. If your trailer is rated over 1,360 kg (3,000 lb) it must have brakes on at least 1 axle if manufactured before 1985, and brakes on all axles if manufactured during or after 1985."

http://www.sgi.sk.ca/individuals/registration/trailers/guidelines/index.html

 

[SWD]

Re: Lifted F250 with bed camper and boat

.

Boath axles on "recreational" trailers need brakes?

Surf: http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/pubs/recreational-vehicles/pdfs/recreation-vehicle-info.pdf
Focus on lower page 5

re: "Service brakes are required on house trailers if the trailer's axle(s) transmit more than 1,360 kgs (3,000 lbs) to the road when the trailer is attached to the towing vehicle. This applies to cases where the trailer is loaded or empty. If brakes are required, at least one axle of the trailer must be fitted with brakes."

If you have documenation that clearly states both axles on recreational trailers like RVs (5ers, TTs), Utility and Boat trailers (re: not commerical trailers) need mandatory brakes when above 3,000 lbs, please share...

thanks.

http://www.sgi.sk.ca/individuals/registration/trailers/guidelines/index.html

You're welcome.

 

[H20Rat]

Re: Lifted F250 with bed camper and boat

Yeah....sorry should have said tandem trailers. I have a 4x8 utility trailer with a single axle, no brakes on that.

That makes more sense! That reflects something similar in the states, because once you are in tandem axle weight territory, you will end up meeting the requirement for brakes in most states.