Kicker motor question

[BruceW]

I have a 1989 18ft carolina skiff that I want to put a kicker motor on . My question is ,what is best , long or short shaft. Also whay HP would be the best ,taking motor weight into consideration. I was thinking 15hp . This would be used in emergency case only. The boat has a 20" transom. Any advise would be appreciated, Thanks, Bruce

 

[bassboy1]

Re: Kicker motor question

Without knowing anything about your boat, I can see one problem in your plan. If you use it only for emergencies, it won't work when your big motor does puke. Ya see, an outboard is only reliable when used regularly. The absolute worst thing you can do to an outboard (besides submerging it) is to leave it idle for months on end. If you use it combined duty on a jon, or troll with it, it will be find, but an emergency only motor isn't good.

 

[BruceW]

Re: Kicker motor question

other than that ,I guess what I need to know is what HP and shaft length would enough to push a 18 ft carolina skiff loaded with camping gear. The reason I ask is that I was in the wilderness camping and my 40 johnson decided to act up,fuel problem. I have sinse replaced the VRO system with a regular fuel pump, seems to have curred the problem. I never want to be in that position again. So I thought a small kicker would be cheap insurance.

 

[dajohnson53]

Re: Kicker motor question

other than that ,I guess what I need to know is what HP and shaft length would enough to push a 18 ft carolina skiff loaded with camping gear. The reason I ask is that I was in the wilderness camping and my 40 johnson decided to act up,fuel problem. I have sinse replaced the VRO system with a regular fuel pump, seems to have curred the problem. I never want to be in that position again. So I thought a small kicker would be cheap insurance.

Often (usually?) 15 hp are the same weight as their 10 hp cousins, so that might be a consideration.

Will you be putting your kicker on a motor mount or mount it directly to the transom? If transom- you'll need a 20" shaft because just like you main engine, the AV (aka cavitation) plate has to be approximately even with the bottom of the boat. If it's too high, even though it's in the water, the kicker will tend to cavitate because of turbulence coming off the back of the boat.

If you're mounting it on a motor mount, get one that allows you to lift and lower the engine. Then you'll probably be able to lower it enough to use a short shaft. You should check this out though. I've done both on my boat and now have a long shaft. The short shaft worked, but when lowered, it was just a little more hassle to use the tiller and controls. No big deal, but I like the long shaft better.

Although there's a lot to be said for having your kicker on it's own fuel supply, even with that, there's a lot to be said for having a kicker that uses the same fuel as your main engine - in other words if your main engine uses pre-mix fuel, your kicker should too (my opinion). I wouldn't have a 4 stroke kicker with a premix main for that reason.

I also agree with the advice to use the kicker regularly. Run it whenever you can at least for a while.

One final thing: if you haven't already, intstall a water separating filter and set it up so you can run both engines off it. They usually have two outputs. If you're in the backcountry, a water sep. filter is essential. Even if you use a separate tank for your kicker, you should still run it through the filter.

 

[hitace]

Re: Kicker motor question

i think you left one out bassboy running the wrong gas oil mix is one of the worst things you can do to it too

 

[ondarvr]

Re: Kicker motor question

Any motor in the 6 to 15Hp range will work and while more HP is better, I would get the best (condition) motor in that range that you can find. What hull type do you have, C S makes a few different models, on a flat bottom you may need a longer shaft, but with a V hull you may get by with a shorter one. You just need enough length to get the prop down below the hull so it can get clean water.

 

[kenmyfam]

Re: Kicker motor question

My opinion.....shaft length should be enough to get it into enough water. HP at least 8.

 

[Frank Acampora]

Re: Kicker motor question

If you live near Baltimore, chances are you will at some time be out on the Chesapeake. Here is one instance where you would definitely want the long shaft and bury the prop as deep in the water as possible. The reason is the bay has a good chop and if the prop is not deep, as you roll in it, the prop will come up high enough to ventilate or even possibly leave the water. You also would want the 15 because: on my 18 foot deep vee, 10 hp drove me at about 3-5 mph. That's only about the speed of the tide going out so more is better.
AND---I run my kicker for about an hour every week or two to get fresh oil in it and to convince myself that it will start when I need it.

By The Way: I broke a prop shaft by the Fishing Battery Light. With that 10 hp engine it took 2 hours to get from the Havre de Grace channel to Port Deposit. I paid 25 for the engine, (Had it on the boat for years and never needed it.) and it took a long time to get back, BUT I didn't break the bank on a tow job. I'd say the engine more than paid for itself in that one use. Would have been cheap at 10 times the price.

 

[BruceW]

Re: Kicker motor question

Thanks guys for the input, Sounds like I need a 10-15 hp . I would get a johnson 2 stroke that uses the same gas and has the same gas fitting on the tank hook up.When using the mounting bracket would a long shaft be too long,or does the bracket bring it all the way out of the water.? I have the flat bottom type of haul.model 1860

 

[BruceW]

Re: Kicker motor question

Frank,you just answered my question of shaft length. I just remembered a time I broke down at the eastern shore rock pile with 5 and 6 footers rolling through ,taking me into the main channel.I hit the panic button and flaged down a fellow fisherman and got towed to Sandy Point. A nice pull start kicker would have been nice.My battery failed,try to pull start a 40 in rough seas,good luck! Thanks again, Bruce

 

[kenmyfam]

Re: Kicker motor question

Frank,you just answered my question of shaft length. I just remembered a time I broke down at the eastern shore rock pile with 5 and 6 footers rolling through ,taking me into the main channel.I hit the panic button and flaged down a fellow fisherman and got towed to Sandy Point. A nice pull start kicker would have been nice.My battery failed,try to pull start a 40 in rough seas,good luck! Thanks again, Bruce

I always carry one of those portable booster packs with me. It has a 12 volt power outlet as well and can be charged while you are running from anothere 12 volt outlet on the boat if necessary. I use it for deflating the tube fully when we have finished using it but want to stay out. Sometimes end up re-inflating the tube again with it if somebody wants another ride.
Very handy piece of equipment and a $35 investment.

 

[dajohnson53]

Re: Kicker motor question

Thanks guys for the input, Sounds like I need a 10-15 hp . I would get a johnson 2 stroke that uses the same gas and has the same gas fitting on the tank hook up.When using the mounting bracket would a long shaft be too long,or does the bracket bring it all the way out of the water.? I have the flat bottom type of haul.model 1860

You have to decide for yourself, but in my experience, my kicker bracket will lift the kicker far enough out of the water so that it won't be in the water when the boat's on plane. This is what I do when I'm just moving from one fishing spot to another. For longer runs, I lift it, and also tilt the kicker up. That's what you can do if you find that the lift isn't enough.

Don't forget that water sep. filter, especially if you're running the kicker and main off the same tank. My boat has two built in tanks (and a water sep. filter), so I really don't need a back up tank. If I didn't have two, I'd probably carry a portable tank for the kicker just in case the main tank had problems I couldn't correct.

 

[bassboy1]

Re: Kicker motor question

i think you left one out bassboy running the wrong gas oil mix is one of the worst things you can do to it too

I was trying to get my point across. There are a lot of things that are worse than leaving it idle, but they usually destroy the motor. Leaving it idle, is one of the worst things, that doesn't destroy the motor, like throwing a rod would. You can leave it idle, then it wont run, but it is fixable, unlike throwing a rod. Sorry hitace.

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: Kicker motor question

I use a '69 Johnson 6hp as a kicker on my 17'5' Glassmaster trihull. It will only push the boat about 4-5 mph but it gets the job done. Since I live in an area where it is not unusual to run 30-40 miles out into some pretty remote locations, the ability to get home on your own if the main powerplant fails is critical.

I don't use a kicker bracket because I find them to be a pain. If you are going to mount the motor on the transom. however, shaft length is important. Mine is a 15" on a 20" transom but that only works because the boat is a V type hull and the motor is mounted far enough to one side, to place the cavitation plate at the proper depth.

The issue of reliability is a matter of maintenance and occassional use. I know my 6hp well enough to be able to do all but major powerhead or lower unit "surgery" right in the boat. Its also important to do routine maintenance such as lubrication, checking the gearcase oil, etc. on a regular basis. I run the motor for at least a few minutes before I leave the dock, every time I go out in the boat. Sometimes I will even run a mile or so before stowing it and switching to the larger motor.

 

[Listless]

Re: Kicker motor question

Generally speaking you need to position the kicker so that the cavitation plate is slightly below the bottom of your boat when the engine is in the down/operating position. This allows the kicker to operate in clear, smooth water. You can determine the length of the shaft required by measuring from the point where you would like the cavitation plate to be while operating to the top of the motor bracket.

When sizing your kicker, you also need to make sure that in tilted/upright position, it is completely out of the water when the boat is moving. Even a small part of the kicker in the water will be problematic. I have found that meeting these requirements is best accomplished with the use of an adjustible kicker bracket.

Most engine manufractures will provide you with specifications and directions for the proper installation of kickers.

Regarding the size, I think that you need to consider where you are using your boat, and what type of emergencies you might get into (strong currents, running through river mouths with potential large waves and currents, or simply getting you home sooner or later. Even a 4 hp will probably push your boat at 2-3 knotts on flat water, but most people I know use at least 9.9 hp. I have a 20hp kicker because of the type of conditions I encounter, and because a have a slightly larger boat (23 feet). It also weighs virtually the same as the 15 hp but its still definantely on the heavy/large side.