Johnson FD14 1960 18hp slows then dies at WOT

[Who Pooted]

Ok guys here's what i got: 1969 Johnson Seahorse 18hp model FD14. It has ran top notch for this fishing year until the last two trips. The problem I'm having is my motor will slowly die at WOT. Here's the scenario: launch boat, pull choke, hit e-start and motor fires right up, idle out of marina then WOT for 2 minutes at about 22-24 mph w/1436 flatbottom, then the motor begins to slow down and then hold at 12mph for about a minute, then slows to 8mph and if i don't keep the motor at full throttle the motor will die. I can try to restart, but nine times out of ten it will die. I usually have to fish a while with my trolling motor (at least an hour) before i can get the motor to start again. After it starts and i go into WOT my speed is not back at 22-24, it's more in the 8-12mph range, and as i mentioned before if i let off full throttle it will die. I also found out that the head becomes extremely hot when this happens. Burned myself a little bit.
Here's what i've checked:
Compression- Upper cylinder 105psi, Lower cylinder 107psi
Spark- need to check on this one
Spark Plugs- new and gapped to .30
Coils- looked at them through inspection plate and no cracks or damage
Fuel- new lines throughout whole motor, new fuel line with bulb and end connectors, new gas tank
Fuel Mix- 50:1
Cylinders- have not fully inspected, but did notice water droplets on the spark plug in the lower cylinder.
New Head Gaskets- do i need to order these?
I just noticed that my engine does not have a thermostat, should i install one? I assume it would go in the upper left area above my spark plugs. You can see three bolts that attach a plate to where i suspect the thermostat should go. Stupid question- what will the thermostat do? If i'm near overheat will it stop the engine? I will post a picture. Thanks - Adam

 

[lindy46]

Re: Johnson FD14 1969 18hp slows then dies at WOT

Re: Johnson FD14 1969 18hp slows then dies at WOT

There should be a thermostat under that triangular cover, held on by 3 bolts. Put a new one in and make sure to get the grommet that it rides in. The grommet does not come with the thermostat. The thermostat regulates water temp by opening and closing to keep temp about 140-160 degrees. As far as your problem, it could be a number of things. Is the motor pumping water OK? How old is the impeller? If the motor gets hot, it will not run properly if at all. If there's water in the cylinder, could be a head gasket or an exhaust cover gasket leaking. Usually if it's a head gasket, pressure in the affected cylinder will be low (not your case). So check the lower exhaust cover gasket. Water in the cylinder will cause a misfire and could be your problem. I'd check these things first.

 

[kfa4303]

Re: Johnson FD14 1969 18hp slows then dies at WOT

Re: Johnson FD14 1969 18hp slows then dies at WOT

Hi Adam. Welcome to iboats. I have a '66 FD-20C 20 hp myself. If yours really is an FD-14, then it's actually a 1960 18 hp model. If it's a 1969, then it would be and FD-23. Based on your description, I'm pretty sure you have a problem with your ignition. As the components heat up they begin to fail, which causes you to run on only one cylinder. After the the components have had a chance to cool while trolling, they work well until they heat up again. I suspect that you may actually have a bad coil and/or condenser. You'll need to remove the flywheel to inspect everything thoroughly. Be sure you use GRADE 8 bolts (1/4 x 20 x 3'') and washers with the puller as the ones that come with it are not strong enough. Be sure you're using Champion J6C plugs as well. I would suggest you run 24:1 mix as well. These old 2-strokes like the extra oil and it won't affect your performance at all. Here are some great links that can walk you through a tune up from top o bottom. You can get any routine parts like carb kits, points/condensers/coils, etc...right here at iboats for about $20 each. Good luck. Holler if you get stuck.

http://www.leeroysramblings.com/johnson_E-FD_15_18hp.html

http://www.marineengine.com/parts/v...ntage-evinrude-johnson/378126/37812600001.htm

 

[Who Pooted]

Re: Johnson FD14 1960 18hp slows then dies at WOT

First off I completely mis-typed the year of my motor. It definitely is a 1960 FD14.

Lindy46
Water is pumping out fine. If i remember right i did not see a thermostat under the cover, but i will recheck this. I plan on getting new head gaskets and exhaust gaskets just for upkeep.

kfa4303
I've always ran Champion JC6 plugs. I will switch my ratio to 24:1 as suggested by you and many others from another forum (tinboats). I plan on buying a flywheel puller and install the bolts as suggested. I will be buying a spark checker this weekend to test everything out. I do plan on taking the flywheel off to do a complete inspection b/c the inspection port only gives me a so so view of the insides. I want to do a complete revamp of my motor this winter.
What your saying makes sense, but I do have one greenhorn question. Am i wrong in thinking that the ignition system is only involved in starting the motor? I took your advice to mean that the ignition system is failing while the motor is in operation. I thought once the motor has turned over the ignition system has done it's part and it's letting the rest of the motor do the work.
Thanks for the links on the tune ups. This site is sooooo helpful.

 

[kfa4303]

Re: Johnson FD14 1960 18hp slows then dies at WOT

Hello again Adam. Actually, it's the other way around with regards to the ignition. When you hear the term "ignition" think "spark" and the "timing" of the motor is simply the frequency of the spark. To get a motor going, you provide the initial power by pulling the starter cord, or hitting the electric starter either of which simply gets the flywheel spinning. There is a magnet(s) on the interior rim of the the flywheel that passes by the faces of the coils and induces and electrical current (anytime you move a magnet past a copper wire electricity is created.) This current then passes through the points and condensers then into the spark plug wires and finally to the spark plug itself. Once the flywheel goes through a few revolutions, enough sparks is made to get the motor going. As the motor runs, it spins the flywheel which then passes by the coils again to create more spark, which fires the cylinders, which spins the flywheel, which creates a spark, which fires the cylinder, etc.... It just perpetuates itself indefinitely after that and the spark is made through purely mechanical means. As a result, no outside electricity is needed. You could disconnect your battery after you start the motor and it would just keep going and going. The system is called a magneto for obvious reasons, and is an ingenious little invention. So much so that it was used on OMC motors form the early 50's through the mid 70's as well as most other engines of the day, including cars. They've since been replaced by electronic ignition components that are supposedly "better", but a lot of actually prefer the simple magnetos, which can be every bit as reliable as their modern counterparts and can be rebuild for about $20 rather than $120. Here's a great little article and links that can explain some more about them. Keep asking questions.

http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/03/r/columns/max/07/index.htm

http://www.outboard-boat-motor-repa...on 3 HP 1952-1967 Ignition System Tune-up.htm

http://www.leeroysramblings.com/johnson_E-FD_15_18hp.html

 

[Who Pooted]

Re: Johnson FD14 1969 18hp slows then dies at WOT

Re: Johnson FD14 1969 18hp slows then dies at WOT

kfa4303, Talk about typing remorse! As soon as i posted that whole stupid ignition thing i could've killed myself. I appreciate you being so eloquent in your response. Most people would've mistaken showing their class for intelligence by putting down such a "duh" post as i did. I can't tell you how much i appreciate your in depth explanation you provided rather than totally ripping on me.
I look forward into the input from you and others involved in this forum. I will post updates and any questions once i get said replacement parts and tools to start working on my motor.
-Adam

 

[Who Pooted]

Re: Johnson FD14 1969 18hp slows then dies at WOT

Re: Johnson FD14 1969 18hp slows then dies at WOT

Is there a way to fix this thread title to reflect the proper year of my motor? It is a 1960, not 69

 

[Who Pooted]

Re: Johnson FD14 1969 18hp slows then dies at WOT

Re: Johnson FD14 1969 18hp slows then dies at WOT

UPDATE- just bought spark checker and flywheel puller.
Checked spark in upper cylinder and at idle it burned bright and consistent, and at full rev it really glows!
Lower cylinder- spark was weak and inconsistent at idle, but at full throttle it would be very bright but not consistently. Seems like the motor was hiccuping or something. Maybe misfiring? how to fix this?
Pulled flywheel off to inspect ignition system and the coils looked flawless. the only thing i noticed was a fair amount of grease on the crankshaft where the wick is. Isn't that area supposed to be grease free? I did see that one of the points looked cupped. It was flat on one side and cupped on the other. Could this be the issue? Notice the picture where you can see the starter bracket on the left and the fuel filter on the right. Right in the middle my head has got a bunch of oil on it. Perhaps i need to install new gaskets? I've got pictures following.
Quick question- when i rope start my motor it takes some real pull versus my buddies motor. His 1985 15hp you just barely tug the rope and it starts right up. Mine you have to put your feet on the transom and give it a good yank or five.

 

[Who Pooted]

Re: Johnson FD14 1969 18hp slows then dies at WOT

Re: Johnson FD14 1969 18hp slows then dies at WOT

Anyone have any suggestions?

 

[lindy46]

Re: Johnson FD14 1969 18hp slows then dies at WOT

Re: Johnson FD14 1969 18hp slows then dies at WOT

Use a point file or some 400 grit emery paper to dress the points. Then spray them off with some carb cleaner. The cam wick should apply a light layer of grease to the cam to lube the end of the points which ride on it. Too much grease is not good. Why aren't you using the electric start? An older 18hp will be harder to pull start than a newer 15hp.

 

[kfa4303]

Re: Johnson FD14 1969 18hp slows then dies at WOT

Re: Johnson FD14 1969 18hp slows then dies at WOT

I agree. Although, I would just get a tune-up kit with new points and condensers for about $20 here at iboats and be done with it. The coils look fine so you should be ok there. I suspect you're dropping on cylinder due to the bad points, which is also making start up more difficult. Once the ignition is in good shape, it should fire right up. My '66 20 hp starts in 1-2 full pulls and my old '66 33 hp would start with the slightest tap of the electric starter.

 

[Who Pooted]

Re: Johnson FD14 1969 18hp slows then dies at WOT

Re: Johnson FD14 1969 18hp slows then dies at WOT

Lindy46 Thank you for your suggestion, but i think I'll have to defer to the the new tune up kit. I'd like to know that i've got new components on my motor. I almost always use the electric start, and after starting it that way i can usually pull start in one or two pulls. But I didn't know if i could make it to where mine would pull start on the initial start rather than electric in case the battery craps out on me. Lindy46 why do you think the older motors are harder to start? That may be a dumb question so be easy! Ha
2nd problem- water in lower cylinder. Do you guys think a new head gasket would take care of that, or do you think i should just order the kit that includes all seals both upper (engine) and lower (lower unit)?