J/E Powerheads from Blackbird Ind

[Jcstratt]

Anyone have any experience with using powerheads from Blackbird Industries (aka 1Outboard.com)?<br /><br />I am contemplating replacing my 90 Johnson with either another 90 or maybe a 115 (I know I have to swap carbs too).

 

[Dhadley]

Re: J/E Powerheads from Blackbird Ind

If you notice any difference at all it will be very minor unless you have something like an Allison or a Mirage that responds to tiny increases in torque. And even then youll wonder why you did it.

 

[Jcstratt]

Re: J/E Powerheads from Blackbird Ind

Well, you may be right. I wouldn't even be thinking about it, but I broke a ring and trashed a cylinder sleeve. I've been trying to decide if I want to repair it or replace the powerhead. We're not talking much difference in price between the 90 and 115. The boat is rated for 120 max.<br /><br />Overall, I keep leaning towards repairing it anyway. $850-1100 versus $2500.

 

[Dhadley]

Re: J/E Powerheads from Blackbird Ind

If it broke a ring I'd bet it was on the starboard side. And I'd further bet the motor's a crossflow.<br /><br />Those things being true I'd also bet the top rpm is in the 5200 to 5500 range.<br /><br />And possibly, but not as likely, youre using something other than Champion plugs.<br /><br />Any of this sound right so far?

 

[Jcstratt]

Re: J/E Powerheads from Blackbird Ind

Close! Port side, bottom cylinder. It's a 2000 loop charged v4 60deg. Here's a few pics if you feel like looking.<br /> http://photobucket.com/albums/a78/jcstratt/?action=view&current=Picture050.jpg <br /><br /> http://photobucket.com/albums/a78/jcstratt/?action=view&current=Picture049.jpg <br /><br /> http://photobucket.com/albums/a78/jcstratt/?action=view&current=Picture056.jpg <br /><br /> http://photobucket.com/albums/a78/jcstratt/?action=view&current=Picture048.jpg <br /><br /><br />The plugs are Champion QL78YC.<br /><br />The boat and motor were a gift from my brother a few months ago. He bought it new in 2000. This same cylinder went bad 2 years ago. I don't know what the cause was then, but he had it repaired.<br />I haven't yet decarbed it, but it was on my short list of things to do. I am guessing carbon buildup caused the ring break, but I'm not sure.<br /><br />Wot is about 5300, but I don't run it that fast. Between chop at the lake and the wife, it often runs 3500-4000. I try to run it a bit at WOT each run.

 

[Dhadley]

Re: J/E Powerheads from Blackbird Ind

5300 is sure not helping that motor live long. Once you get it up and running make sure you get at least 5800-6000 with an average load.<br /><br />Good choice on plugs.

 

[Jcstratt]

Re: J/E Powerheads from Blackbird Ind

It's got a SS 3 blade prop on it that I believe is a 13 1/4 x 17. I was thinking of dropping to a 15 anyway. I see iboats has a SS 13 1/4 x 15 on sale for 128 right now. The prop that came on it from the dealer was an aluminum 14x17, which I still have as a spare.

 

[Dhadley]

Re: J/E Powerheads from Blackbird Ind

I wouldnt drop in pitch right away. That will decrease efficiency. Basically a losing situation. I'd work with the set up to make the prop you have as efficient as possible. Then if its still not right you may have to drop pitch. But only as a last resort.

 

[Jcstratt]

Re: J/E Powerheads from Blackbird Ind

Well, I'm not doing anything at the moment. I started tearing it down today and will try to get the block repaired this week. Then, I'll order the parts and when I get it back together and running right, we'll see where to go next. The prop is going to get changed no matter. It's been run through an oyster bed at some point and it looks like I can pickup a new one cheaper than a repair.<br /><br />I really appreciate your insight Dhadley. I haven't run or worked on a 2-stroke since '89. I'm quite sure I'll be inquiring again!<br /><br />Also, I see rebuild kits for these motors on Ebay for around $560. Any reason I should stay away from these? If so, where's a good and reasonable source for parts?

 

[scottwell]

Re: J/E Powerheads from Blackbird Ind

You are getting information that will save you thousands of dollars by just reading my auction, so there's nothing here but good pictures.

If you are considering a outboard engine or power head from Ebay Seller 1Outb@@rd also know as B@#$%bird Industries, stay away. This fellow will sell you a good talk, but doesn't live up to it. I personally trailered my 24' Wellcraft for him to do a powerhead replacement. He quoted me a price of $3450.00, but when he and his unskilled bunch of ragtag helpers were done, the bill was $4452.00. He said that was because my crankshaft was shot. If I would have just had the motor shipped and the crankshaft was bad, I would have lost the core deposit of $350.00, not $750.00 for a crank, the balance was Pa. Sales tax. Being that I paid him $4000.00 in cash, I hope he reported it to the IRS,because I will after dealing with this whack job.

Don't go now, there's more!!!!!! I took my boat to my marina to put it in its slip, and after just 10 hours of use, the engine would start and idle, but when shifted into gear,it would die. I thought maybe something was caught in the prop......there was alright. Old parts, pieces of a piston and rings,as well as a piston connecting rod wrist pin, which completely wiped out my prop and destroyed the exhaust chamber of the lower unit.........I had to pull the lower unit and get this stuff out, this was on a Saturday, I immediately sent Mike Demayo, owner of 1outb@@rd also know as B@#$%bird Industries the following email:


Mike,
I currently have 10 hours on the engine you installed on 3/21/2008, the engine is running great except for one major detail. Parts were left in the exhaust portion of the middle unit, which made it to the gear case, destroying the gear case and prop, which you will see in the couple of pictures I have put in the email. I am assuming that these are old pieces of the old powerhead,because the engine is running great.
Today, while boating, at a no wake speed, the engine quit and seemed like there was something caught in the prop, well there was, a piston wrist pin caught in there and two large pieces of a piston with some ring still on it. That may have been overlooked while the new powerhead was being installed.After being towed back to my slip, I removed the prop, and got one piece of the piston out and the wrist pin. the other piece was so large,that I had to remove the lower unit and fish the other piece out.
The total damage to my engine is the lower unit and my prop. Is there some way that you'll be able to cover this under the warranty? Or how will we solve this issue? Please get in touch with me asap by phone, or email. Home phone 610-xxx-xxxx, cell phone 610-xxx-xxxx and email **********@aoldotcom .
Thanks,
S


His Response via Email was:

That is a freak thing . WE dont remove the exhaust system to rrebuild a powerhead although you probaly think we should but you cant really do that cost effectively. We did remove the lowerunit to replace the water pump at that time nothing fell out they must of got stuck in the exaust cavity where you are unable to see them. You should call your insurance co or we can call them for you thats why you have insurance.



So I called him and he told me to call the insurance company, then he also said to call my homeowners and see if the would cover it......sounds like an insurance fraud job if I ever heard one.
He said he'd send me a replacement lower unit, but I'd have to send him an additional $1000.00 and he was going to deduct shipping, and didn't even mention the prop. I just wanted to let all the good people looking for an outboard engine to look elsewhere. Please do yourself a favor and look else where. have a look at the pics of my prop and lower unit, then look at these links and see if you really want to do business with this guy.
Click here: http://www.stayawayoutboardrepair.biz/
Click here: http://www.stayawayoutboardrepair.biz/otherscomments.htm
http://forums.screamandfly.com/forums/showthread.php?t=51683&highlight=Blackbird
http://forums.screamandfly.com/forums/showthread.php?t=78718
http://forums.screamandfly.com/forums/showthread.php?t=58911&highlight=Blackbird
http://continuouswave.com/ubb/Forum3/HTML/012164.html


I'm filing a formal complaint with the Attorney General of Pa., I am also in the process of letting the Better Business Bureau know of his dealings, and I am considering suing him in claims court.

Oh, and my auction, if you're the lucky winner, I'll send you pictures, with free shipping!


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Select a picture

 

[CATransplant]

Re: J/E Powerheads from Blackbird Ind

What auction? I don't know, but this bashing of businesses doesn't really seem to have a place here. Sometimes, perhaps often, complaints about a company are in error or even attempts to harm a business for other reasons.

Now, I don't know if this is your personal experience or not, but such stuff should be handled in private messages, since the business being maligned can't respond here.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: J/E Powerheads from Blackbird Ind

scottwell , washing your dirty laundry in the forum is not advised, just saying you have had a bad experience, and the links would have been enough. don't want to see anymore about it. you have said enough.

 

[Dhadley]

Re: J/E Powerheads from Blackbird Ind

Keep in mind Scottwell did not start the thread. Jcstratt asked if anyone had experiences with a particular company. Scottwell did and replied to the asked question. Perhaps the detail was more than we (collectively) need to know but JC did. Yes, at that point a PM would have been prudent but, as you can see, Scottwell's experience is not unique. Who knows how many other folks were comtemplating using the same company? One for sure as seen the the prop forum.

Ask Scottwell to tone it down a bit? Maybe, but in a private message and allow him the opportunity to edit his own post - IF he considers it necessary.

Censor him totally if he started a bashing thread? Absolutely, even if he is right.

Censor him totally from answering the same question? No way.

 

[SpinnerBait_Nut]

Re: J/E Powerheads from Blackbird Ind

Maybe so, but 5 posts of all the same, I don't think so.
1 is enough.

 

[riverjet502]

Re: J/E Powerheads from Blackbird Ind

I agree with Dhadley completely. I know if I asked a question on this board or any of the other forums I use about a company that I wasn't familiar with and somebody gave their experience dealing with said company whether good or bad I would be most gratefull.

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: J/E Powerheads from Blackbird Ind

I have seen ads for this company and am glad to have this information about them. I also agree that it was a question asked and answered.

That said, I would have stuck with the basic facts. In these sorts fo disputes, emotional reactions usually don't help much. It would have been much more effective to simply say that a price was agreed and ended up much higher, and that there were problems later involving old parts that were not removed from the motor, resulting in significant damage. As long as those are the actual facts, the point has been made and others can make use of the info as they choose.

 

[scottwell]

Re: J/E Powerheads from Blackbird Ind

Keep in mind Scottwell did not start the thread. Jcstratt asked if anyone had experiences with a particular company. Scottwell did and replied to the asked question. Perhaps the detail was more than we (collectively) need to know but JC did. Yes, at that point a PM would have been prudent but, as you can see, Scottwell's experience is not unique. Who knows how many other folks were comtemplating using the same company? One for sure as seen the the prop forum.

Ask Scottwell to tone it down a bit? Maybe, but in a private message and allow him the opportunity to edit his own post - IF he considers it necessary.

Censor him totally if he started a bashing thread? Absolutely, even if he is right.

Censor him totally from answering the same question? No way.

Dhadley, Thanks, Yes I did answer his question, and yes to some people it may be extreme, but if you had to go through what I've been going through with trying to get the guy to do the right thing,and he won't even budge, he said it's "dual negligence" as I didnt look in the exhaust or he didnt either, He had it all apart,not me. I just want the gearhousing and prop replaced, thats all. nevermind the towing and the fact that the wife and kids will probably not go back on the boat.
Some one asked, I responded, but thats my dealings with Blackbird

 

[kai1414]

Re: J/E Powerheads from Blackbird Ind

Just to toss in my .02 cents. The powerhead on my grandfathers 115 was rebuilt by these guys. They pulled the "need a new crank scam" only after "losing" the powerhead for 3 weeks. They claimed they didn't know what it was. It came back with broken coils, styrofoam jammed into every possible orifice, the carb airbox/housing had been dented, broken and rewelded and reinstalled, two broken sparkplugs and some other stuff. Long story short it runs like crap, and we haven't been able to straighten it out since. Not real impressed. Def wouldn't go business there again.