Honda engine oil - is there a difference

[maillon]

Hello,<br /><br />We recently purchased a used Honda which was shipped with no oil. We are wondering if it is worth going with Honda oil over a some other premium oil.<br /><br />Thanks for your help.

 

[Oil Man]

Re: Honda engine oil - is there a difference

Use a good quality petro or synthetic oil of the weight recommended by Honda for your climate. Don't bother with the Honda oil....<br /><br />Dave

 

[Fouled Plug]

Re: Honda engine oil - is there a difference

The only additive specific to Honda brand oil? A much higher price!

 

[9675hpforce]

Re: Honda engine oil - is there a difference

Just put wall mart decron fluid in my 98 Transfercase i cant see a diference in oils? Stay away from synthetic its great but can lea out of the gas ets.

 

[MajBach]

Re: Honda engine oil - is there a difference

When it comes to cutting corners and penny pinching, I am the worst! However.......<br />I have talked to several sources, HOnda and non and have heard the same from all, even though Honda oil is signifcantly more, you get what you pay for. Anyone who has a Honda car should know all about quality of genuine Honda parts - even if their made by other mfgs. - they still meet certain standars. Apparantly, the same standards run true for their fluids and disposable parts, like oil filters. It's one area that I do spend the extra money.

 

[Skinnywater]

Re: Honda engine oil - is there a difference

I agree with MajBach on OE (original equipment)oil filters. I won't scrimp on oil filters and I'll pay double for an OE filter.<br />However, Honda doesn't manufacture thier oil. It's a relabeled oil from who knows who oil company that makes oil to meet Hondas specifications.<br />My official Honda Marine workshop manuel says:<br />"Recommended oil--SAE 5W-30 (API Classification SG, SH)"<br />It does not make mention of any particular brand. Nor does it make any mention of petro based, petro/syn blend or fully synthetic oil.<br />Personally I run a fully synthetic 5W30 with a service classification SG,SH as well as additional classifications.<br /><br />You have to be warned though. In addition to synthetic causing your seals to leak, <br />It's been known to cause your parking brake to release by itself while launching your boat.<br />It causes your hour meter to run continuously.<br />It causes you to get terminally snagged, resulting in you loosing your $9 Yozuri lure.<br />It causes SPF45 suntan lotion to loose effectiveness to SPF7.<br />It causes your prop to flex over 4200 Rpm.<br /><br />Since I've started using synthetic in my lawnmower, all my outside spigots have started leaking. <br />

 

[Cricket Too]

Re: Honda engine oil - is there a difference

Having worked at a Honda dealer I can tell you exactly what Skinnywater told you, they don't make their own oil and it makes no difference which brand you use, I personally prefer Castrol, but anyway Skinnywater is also correct in his not so subtle way of saying that synthetics do not cause gaskets to leak, if they did they wouldn't be on the market, and if I were you I would use them in my outboard for better protection and longer oil and engine life. Tight Lines.

 

[MajBach]

Re: Honda engine oil - is there a difference

I wanted to elaborate on this entire point, but not sofar as to argue it. No, Honda does not make their own oil, but neither do they make their own oil filters, fuel injectors, speedometers or even engine blocks. They're all subbed out but to meet specific standars. I used to make engine parts for Honda and Toyota ( as well as Volkswagon, and GM). Like most who have worked in a machining factory for more than one auto maker will tell you, specifications for each car company vary a great deal. How many have seen the cross section of a Fram oil filter from Walmart and one sold by Honda? Big difference, right? Surprise! Fram makes oil filters for Honda (although not exclusively).<br />It is also my understanding that their are only two makers of oil in N.America: Shell and Esso. Although I don't state that with to much confidence, I do believe that just because Honda doesn't make their own oil, doesn't mean it's no better than the .99 cent Canadian tire stuff. I DO say with a good deal of confidence that Honda's marine oil is a semi-synthetic that IS indeed better than your average Walmart 10W-30 and specifically manufactured for that application!<br />One other point. I didn't pay much attention to any threads regarding gasket leaks and synthetic oil. However, since I am now a pilot, many of the 'rules' regarding what 'parts' or fluids that are used on aircraft are adhered to strictly. I don't remember specifically which way it went, but in flight school we were taught that on piston engine aircraft, one cannot switch from regular oil over to synthetic ( or the other way around. Like I said I cannot remember which way the rule goes). The reason for this is it WILL make gaskets leak. Dunno what the reason was though. Food for thought at least.

 

[Fouled Plug]

Re: Honda engine oil - is there a difference

I have a quart of Honda 10W-30 in front of me at the moment, and it makes no mention whatsoever of being 'semi-synthetic'. Why? It ain't. Any decent quality motor oil is every bit as good as the Honda-labeled variety, and may cost 1/3 as much. This oil came with the motor I purchased, otherwise there's no way I'd part with $3 for a quart of it.

 

[Skinnywater]

Re: Honda engine oil - is there a difference

Excellent post MajBach. Your statements are entirely correct that different manufactures require different specifications from a single supplier.<br />Tests on Fram filters are pretty scary though.<br />Denso is the manufacture of my OE Honda oil fiter.<br /><br />It's also true that switching to a different viscosity, brand, type oil in a high mile/hour/moderate to high wear engine increases the chance of a moderate/well worn seal to leak.<br />This was especially true 20 years ago as synthetics were first emerging into the mass market. Numerous reformulations have occured since.<br /><br />This past year there was another major reformulation of Mobil1 and Castrol Syntec. Mobil1 has expanded its special use applications and has raised the bar in these areas.<br />Hats off to Castrol though. Thier Syntec, a petro/synthetic blend has managed to meet all fully synthetic specifications, properties and criteria in every way. This is why they are able to label thier oil as a fully synthetic.<br /><br />I'm not pushing any particular brand. I feel confident with most all. What I am pushing is using the correct classification and viscosity lubricant that the manufacture recommends. This will satisfy all warranty, performance and longevity issues.<br /><br />Far outwieghing the importance of an oil brand is the quality of the oil filter. People are making a terrible mistake by not using an OE filter.<br />If money was the issue, I'd buy any $1.09 quart (recycled included)of 5/30 SG/SH oil and an OE Honda (Denso)filter for $12.00

 

[MajBach]

Re: Honda engine oil - is there a difference

I have a quart of Honda 10W-30 in front of me at the moment, and it makes no mention whatsoever of being 'semi-synthetic'. Why? It ain't. Any decent quality motor oil is every bit as good as the Honda-labeled variety, and may cost 1/3 as much. This oil came with the motor I purchased, otherwise there's no way I'd part with $3 for a quart of it

Yeah, and a bar of soap make no mention that it contans animal fat. Whoopee.<br />There are many ingredients that aren't listed on oil, like just about any other product you buy. <br /><br />You don't have to believe that one brand is better than another because it costs more. But if you really want to know the bottom line of what's in the oil you use, write your manufacturer and ask them if they use any anti-foaming agent in their oil. Then write any oil maker that sells a marine grade oil and ask the same question. You'd have to be an idiot to believe that a 4-stroke marine engine is subject to the same operating environment as a 4-stroke automobile engine. <br /><br />Some people just need to reassure themselves I suppose.

 

[MajBach]

Re: Honda engine oil - is there a difference

Just an ammendum to the above. This, assuming you give any merit to the validity of labels on products and the legal requirements for them, the label on my Honda marine oil states:<br /><br />"Specifically formulated with Honda-specified oil conditioning polymer..." (i.e. synthetic)<br /><br />"....OCP is a shear stable synthetic lubricant..."<br /><br />OCP is a trademark for a type of Ethylene-propylene copolymer. You can read what it is/does here .<br />Thst is not something found in any off-the-shelf department store oil.

 

[Skinnywater]

Re: Honda engine oil - is there a difference

"Thst is not something found in any off-the-shelf department store oil."<br /><br />Ethylene-propylene copolymer, a synthetic rubber and additive, is used as a viscosity modifier, a sealer, and a major ingredient of modern o-rings and gaskets.<br /><br />Is a very common ingredient in most all modern motor oils and lubricants. This certainly includes petro, synthetic, blended and recycled lubricants.<br /><br />It's a carcinogen, so it's not used other oil applications, such as body, hair and cooking oils.<br /><br />It's also used in pesticides and solvents. It's a major ingredient in lock-tite. NASA specifies it for oring manufacture. It is used extensively in refrigeration lubricants and seals. Self sealing tires and other self sealing pressure systems.<br /><br />Type in "Ethylene-propylene copolymer in motor oil" into a good search engine.<br />Data (hazzardous material)sheets are viewable online listing Ethylene-propylene copolymer from most of the off the shelf department store brands.

 

[Cricket Too]

Re: Honda engine oil - is there a difference

All I can add to this "discussion" is that it just says something to me when Honda dealers don't even use Honda oil in the cars when they come in the door. That's not to say that an outboard 4 stroke doesn't need better protection because it does, but all maillon wanted to know was if he absolutely "NEEDS" to use Honda oil, and the answer is no. I would not use Wal-Mart oil either, but any good premium oil will do and a synthetic may give better protection. And I really don't think he or anyone else here for that matter wanted to get involved with the specifics of airplanes, I think it's pretty obvious to everybody that we are not dealing with anything that advaced or any regulations that strict. So let's try to keep the preaching to a minimum. Good Luck with your new motor maillon.

 

[maillon]

Re: Honda engine oil - is there a difference

mmcpeck,<br /><br />Wow what a discussion!<br /><br />Guys, I must admit, this thread played out to be very interesting. Thanks for all of your passionate writing. <br /><br />BTW the new engire (used but new to me) is running great.

 

[Fouled Plug]

Re: Honda engine oil - is there a difference

Skinnywater sez it best. But if you truly believe "Honda" oil contains some miracle additive that is lacking in all other lubes, more power to ya.

 

[dolsen]

Re: Honda engine oil - is there a difference

Run Mobil 1 10/30 and forget it.

 

[BillP]

Re: Honda engine oil - is there a difference

If you use oil that meets what the mfgs manual says don't worry about the motor "exploding". I personally don't believe there is enough difference between Honda oil and others to make a difference on the wear life. Regardless, I run the mfgs brand oils in my outboards just to take the "worry" element away...and am probably just paying to be a fool. Price isn't a factor but I sure don't like spending $4.95 (at the merc ob dealer) for the same spec 4 stroke oil I can get for $1.50 at Autozone.<br /><br />I believe there is a law that keeps mfgs from being specific on what brands you MUST use. I found this out when having new motor waranty work done on my auto 2 yrs ago.

 

[lakeman1999]

Re: Honda engine oil - is there a difference

It is foolish to use the manufacturers oil if it cost you a premium price, as they are making a big profit on another manufacturers product.