help with outdrive

mh11

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Messages
126
Hello, I have a 1978 galaxie 22xl with a mercruiser 260 originally in it. It now has a rebuilt 350 chevy with about 100hrs on it.

1) I have followed all of your advice on what to do. It came with a 23 pitch 5 blade stainless prop. Ran it and could get 2900-3100 rpm at best. Went down to 17 pitch 3 blade prop, get up to about 3900 at best. I am supposed to be running at 4200-4600 rpm at full throttle. Should I go down to 15??

2) I have read about other boats in this era, Hallet, Galaxie, etc with the same combo that are saying they are hitting 56-60mph easy. I am around 37 mph according to my speedo.

3) I had the timing/dwell/advance set to factory specs. Made a big difference.

4) The outdrive does not look like the stock one in the owners manual. It does not have the little fin like thing with the hole in it, on the upper cap like the stock one did. Also, the outside of the upper case says 1.98R on it. Could this be my problem? Was the outdrive replaced with the wrong ratio? I belive the stock 260 came with 1.50 correct? Could the last owner have ruined the outer case, and replaced the externals with another unit? Can you put the 1.5 gearing into a 1.98R case?

5) Also, I am thinking about putting the high rise GM manifold, k&n flame arrestor, and the later year manifold aluminum kit to drop weight by about 80 pounds, and get more horsepower since both my rubber boots between the riser and y-pipe both cracked, figured I would improve performance and save weight at the same time, does this make sense?

6) How do I get more top end out of this boat?

7) Can I hook up another battery on the other side of the boat to run electrical accessories off of without changing the alternator?

Thanks so much for all of your help!!!
 

chiefalen

Captain
Joined
May 18, 2008
Messages
3,598
Re: help with outdrive

I am going to ask such a simple question as to maybe get you angry with me.

You have hidden water in your hull ??

Maybe waterlogged stringers adding a 1000 pounds to the boat.

Friend said no, and we cut a hole in the front floor of his cuddy and sure enough there was water trapped in there cause the drain to the bilge was blocked.

The foam was also water logged.

This your problem??
 

Bondo

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Apr 17, 2002
Messages
70,894
Re: help with outdrive

Can you put the 1.5 gearing into a 1.98R case?

Ayuh,... The cases are all the same,...

If you have Anything but the 1.50:1s,.. Your Problems would be exactly the Opposite as you're experincing....

It sounds like your motor is on it's last legs,+ is terribly Down on Power,...
Or,..
As noted by Chef,... Your Hull is extremely Over-weight....

Run a Compression Check on the motor, before you tear it apart,...
It may Not be worth pouring Extras into it, til it's brought back to Spec....
And,...
Investagate the Hull Issues.....
 

mh11

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Messages
126
Re: help with outdrive

Yikes, you guys are scaring me. This boat, the previous owner had around $8000 in receipts put in to the boat over the last few years. Paint and gel coat, upolstery, outdrive rebuilt, new gauges, new carpet, trailer paint, came with a very expensive 5 blade stainless prop, etc. The boat seems to be very well taken care of.

Upon arrival to the local boat shop, the manager remarked how he hadn't seen one of these boats in a while, that they were great boats, but very heavy, he said around 4000 lbs with no fuel if I remember correctly.

The boat holds 25 gallons on each side, so there is 50 gallons of fuel in the boat fully fueled. Is this a lot of fuel for that size boat?

I know the bilge is unobstructed, doesn't seem there would be any water in the hull, but I am not sure, the boat was only used a few times a year by the previous owner. He had three boats, and this one was the least used by far.

Sorry, what are waterlogged stringers? The stringers to stiffen the hull? Is there foam in the boat? Sorry, I am a neophyte when it comes to boat construction.

What is the best way to check the hull? How do you know if it's waterlogged and how do you fix it?

I will never get angry with any of you for your advice....I am just looking to get the maximum performance out of the boat.

Don't get me wrong, maybe the speedo is off, the boat accelerates pretty well, the top speed seems decent, just seems like there should be more.

Thanks so much for the help!
 

CheapboatKev

Vice Admiral
Joined
Oct 4, 2008
Messages
5,813
Re: help with outdrive

do you have a portable GPS like a tom-tom or magellan?
you can use its mph rating to see if yours on the dash is off

welcome aboard as well!
 

mh11

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Messages
126
Re: help with outdrive

No I dont have a GPS, but since I fly gliders during the summer I was thinking about getting one as it would be used i both applications.

Where is the best place to get a good affordable one?

Thanks for the input!!!
 

CheapboatKev

Vice Admiral
Joined
Oct 4, 2008
Messages
5,813
Re: help with outdrive

anywhere anymore..I got my Tom Tom for 100 bucks, from Radio Shack in Dallas (My Magellan was stolen from my rental car at my hotel)
Lots of online stores as well. Circuit City is going outta biz nationwide, may get one on a blowout fire sale.

my input is minimal, but your welcome. LOTS of guys here know waaaaaay more than I do, but I'm learning like everybody else...
 

mh11

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Messages
126
Re: help with outdrive

Thanks I will try that, that's a great idea! By the way, what is the best way to do a compression check on this motor?

Thanks!
 

chiefalen

Captain
Joined
May 18, 2008
Messages
3,598
Re: help with outdrive

Do you plan on working on this boat yourself??

Things like oil changes and tuneups ?

Ever do a tune up on a carbed motor ?

Do you have any tools?

And know how to use them?

Maybe if you post where you live, general area someone can recommend a good mechanic for you, and he can do the compression check?

Good luck !
 

mh11

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Messages
126
Re: help with outdrive

Yes, I do plan on working on the boat myself, the things that I can do. I bought the big suction pump to get the oil out, and changing the oil filter is no big deal.

I did a tune up on my 1967 VW bug, carbed motor, I do know how to use tools, I work on motorcycle engines all the time.

Far as I remember on the bug, remove coil, remove fuel supply, crank motor over with the throttle wide open. Least that's my buddy's dad who owned the shop told me how to do it if i remember correctly.

Let me know if I am correct, I am very mechanically inclined, and really want to learn how to do boat stuff.

Thanks!
 

Don S

Honorary Moderator Emeritus
Joined
Aug 31, 2004
Messages
62,321
Re: help with outdrive

Read the link that ziggy gave you for the compression test.
 

chiefalen

Captain
Joined
May 18, 2008
Messages
3,598
Re: help with outdrive

Good read the link and just pull the center plug on the dizzy, no need to remove anything. Or fiddle with the gas. It can't start with the center plug pulled on the dizzy. And do the test on a warm motor.

Post the results after you write down what each cylinder is.

And yes if everything is kewl you might have to go down to a 15 pitch, but why was there a 5 blade 23 pitch prop on that boat it's like having a 25 pitch 3 blade.

That i just don't understand.
 

mh11

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Messages
126
Re: help with outdrive

Ok, I will pull the dizzy, and do the comp test. Thanks for all the help.

The boat was originally from Sacramento at sea level, and I am up in Reno Nevada from about 4000-and up at Lake Tahoe. I have a feeling the 23 pitch prop was a result of being at sea level

Will let you know what I find out, we are about a month away or so from getting the boats back out again, I want to be prepared when the season hits.

Thanks again!!!
 

Faztbullet

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Mar 2, 2008
Messages
15,878
Re: help with outdrive

Your gear ratio is off!! The 1.98 ratio is killing the motor. Running the data you supplied thru prop calulator (10% slip) the speed is pretty close. The data plugged in at 4600rpm @1.5 ratio pops you back at 45mph.
http://www.byuboyz.com/boats/prop.htm
 

captmello

Captain
Joined
Jun 30, 2008
Messages
3,844
Re: help with outdrive

I run the a 260 sbc in a 2100 lbs boat. However have not done a gps speed run.

NADA rates your baot at 3550 lbs, add 50 gallons of fuel and 2-4 people you'll be pushing 4500 lbs.

Noone is hitting 55-60 with that motor in a boat your size. Except some guy in a Chap. but thats another thread.:)

Like the chief said, that prop is not for that boat, no matter what elevation!

I run a 21 pitch and get 4400 RPM.

You should be reaching a similar RPM at WOT.

Do the compression check and tune up regardless. See what you get with the 17 pitch. Use a shop tach. Forget about speed, I'd focus on getting the RPMs correct. Last thing you do can be the GPS test.

I think you may have a cruiser not a ski boat.;)

Good luck.

BTW you can run two batterys on your alternator but need to wire correctly and safely.
 

mh11

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Messages
126
Re: help with outdrive

Thank you guys for all your help.

1) I will do a compression check in a month or so since the boat is winterized right now.

2) The local shop did the tuneup a couple months back, and I also had them check the tach which they said was spot on.

3) I am on a budget, so I really don't want to take apart the outdrive to check it, I just know that the stamp on the upper case says 1.98r, and that Bond-o said the cases are the same and they could have replaced the upper case for some reason. Is there a way to check the revolutions of the prop by turning over the motor to estimate the gear ratio?

4) The other boats like the Hallett, and the Tahiti, are similar boats running the same combo, but these guys are telling me they are running 55-60 mph and running away from ski boats. This is why i suspected my boat had something wrong.

5) I was told to lean out the secondary metering rods, as they are probably jetted for sea level, and I am up at 4200 feet and above.

6) Also, the backfiring I hear at full throttle at wot, what can be causing that? Engine seems to be getting plenty of fuel, I was wondering if maybe a stuck valve or something, compression test should indicate that correct?

7) What is the safe, effective way to wire the second battery in?

Thanks so much for all of your help, it's nice to know that there are people that care out there!
 

ziggy

Admiral
Joined
Jun 30, 2004
Messages
7,473
Re: help with outdrive

this will answer #3 i believe.


Do all these steps in order.
1. Shut off the battery switch
2. Pull the spark plugs out of the engine.
3. Put the shifter in forward.
4. Turn the engine till the prop starts turning, continue turning till the timing mark is at TDC.
5. Put a mark on the prop hub and the drive housing that align with each other.
6. Turn the engine by hand while someone watches the marks on the prop, and count the revolutions the crankshaft makes to turn the prop 1 complete revolution.
7. If it took 1.5 revolutions of the crankshaft, then you have a drive ratio of 1.5:1 which is what is needed for a small block V8. (a 260).

i don't take credit for this statement, thanks to whoever wrote it.
i just saved it from reading it on here somewhere from before...
 

Bondo

Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Apr 17, 2002
Messages
70,894
Re: help with outdrive

Also, the backfiring I hear at full throttle at wot, what can be causing that?

Ayuh,... That says it's Too Lean...
 

chiefalen

Captain
Joined
May 18, 2008
Messages
3,598
Re: help with outdrive

Ok there was nothing about backfiring in the original post ?

Mh11 should have included that in the op. No chiding just something we should have known about, thats all.

Backfiring, maybe just maybe the timing is off a little.

You been fiddling with the dizzy?? Maybe moved it a tad ??

You may have set it to factory specs but are the internals factory specs ?

And each motor likes it different.

Now to speed lets get it running right then go to the prop for rpm for wot.

Have a 17p ? Start with that Mello hit that one on the head.

Ziggy gave you the way to tell whats in the drive.

Post back when ya done and need more help !
 
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