Hard starting 3.0 Volvo

ss9940

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Hi Everyone!<br /><br />I have been in the forum for quite some time now, but didn't post much :) i was rather reading and absorbing knowledge :D You guys are great. The forum helped me alot with my project. Now, to get to the problem:<br />I come from Europe and bought a '94 Caravelle 1750BR in Michigan in november. The engine was dismantled (water in the cylinders), so i bought a new 3.0 GM and imported the boat & new engine to Europe. I combined the new base engine with stuff from the old engine (carb, alt, starter, pump,... ) - of course cleaned & repaired everything. The carb, alternator and starter were rebuilt. When we put everything together, we set the ignition timing to 6 degrees BTDC (that's what stood on the HEI label that came with the new distributor) - but the engine backfired when i accelerated fast on the hose so we set it to 8 degrees BTDC and the backfire was gone. Finally, after hard work, we tested the thing. It started right away on water, worked perfectly, no backfires, stalling aso. I tried to turn the engine off and on - perfect. Yet, when i tried to do that like 5th or 6th time, it wouldn't start. Just cranked and nothing happened. When i almost drained the battery it would start and ran like nothing happened. It thought it would be a dirt in the fuel or something like that, but when i ran the engine on hose yesterday, it did the same thing. The acc. pump is working ok, i can see the 2 shots of fuel pumping into the manifold when i push the lever. Any ideas? Should i set the ignition timing back to 6 degrees?<br /><br />Thanx in advance!
 

Don S

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Re: Hard starting 3.0 Volvo

Do you have spark to the plugs?<br />What distributor do you have, is it the GM EST distributor?<br />Have you checked the cylinders for water, and did you use any of the old exhaust system from the old engine.
 

ss9940

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Re: Hard starting 3.0 Volvo

Yes, there is a spark... The engine starts up, but i have to crank it for a long time and pump in fuel... The distributor is a brand new DELCO Remy HEI distributor that came with the 3.0 engine. Yes, i used all the old parts from the exhaust sistem. The manifold was like new, and the riser also. The gasket for manifold was also replaced, cause a new one came with the engine. Could it be the choke?
 

ss9940

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Re: Hard starting 3.0 Volvo

Could it be a bad connection? Perhaps the spark is gone momentarily... When the engine finally starts, there is smoke coming out of the exhaust (i think it's cause i pump in too much fuel)
 

Don S

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Re: Hard starting 3.0 Volvo

Is this the distributor you have?<br /><br />
Delco%20EST%20Distributor.png
 

ss9940

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Re: Hard starting 3.0 Volvo

Yes, that's it. Of course the shunt from the picture is not connected when running ;)
 

Don S

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Re: Hard starting 3.0 Volvo

OK, Is this a Mercruiser setup?<br />Did you put the distributor into base timing mode before setting the timing? <br />Both Mercruiser and Volvo set the timing at 1° BTDC to 1° ATDC, never at 6°
 

ss9940

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Re: Hard starting 3.0 Volvo

The orig. engine is a Volvo penta. Yes, i used a shunt connected to a B+ source to set the timing. There was a sticky label from DELCO that came with the distributor that said: 4cyl engines 6degrees BTDC. Bondo + others.. any ideas?
 

Don S

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Re: Hard starting 3.0 Volvo

Volvo calls for anywhere from 2° ATDC to 0 TDC.<br />This is used for setting the intial timing only, and after the shunt is removed, you should see around 6° BTDC while running.<br />The base timing mode is used to hold the timing steady so it can be set accuratly, if you try to set it at 6° BTDC while in base timing mode, you will be around 12 or 14° BTDC when running.... and that is probably your problem.
 

ss9940

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Re: Hard starting 3.0 Volvo

Hmmmm... interesting... When we set the timing to 6deg BTDC in base timing, the motor ran ok but backfired when i accelerated hard on hose ... I think if i set the timing to 0deg BTDC it will stumble and die.. but will try it out... It's strange that the boat ran fine for an hour when i tested it on water, if the timing was off so much (8 deg BTDC in base timing!). Another thing - degrees are measured up on the scale that is welded to the block, right? Each tooth represents 2 degrees. How to set ATDC?
 

ss9940

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Re: Hard starting 3.0 Volvo

Hehehe... looked at the old motor and found out the same... The problem was, that the paint on the new motor made the text impossible to read so i thought that the botoom tooth marked 0. I'm also including 2 pictures... what do you think of it? Is it 6deg or 1 deg? I currently have 4 deg in base timing mode (according to the scale u just gave me). According to the label, i'm still 2deg off! Or should i rather set it to 1 deg? The bottom picture is my old engine.<br /><br />
1.jpg
<br />
2.jpg
3.jpg
 

Don S

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Re: Hard starting 3.0 Volvo

If it was me, I would set it a 1° ATDC, then make those pictures a lot smaller so we don't have to scroll sideways to read the thread.
 

ss9940

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Re: Hard starting 3.0 Volvo

Sorry about the pics ;) I have 1280X1024 res and didn't notice that at all :) Hmmm... 1deg ATDC... So, the label is incorrect? The engine backfired when the ign was set to 0 deg...
 

Don S

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Re: Hard starting 3.0 Volvo

You aren't running it with a too lean carb adjustment are you?
 

ss9940

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Re: Hard starting 3.0 Volvo

Hmmmm... i'll try to do what you say... 1deg ATDC + adjusting the carb... Would the engine backfire if the carb adj was too lean? What deg should the timing have when I disconnect the shunt? At what RPM exactly?
 

Don S

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Re: Hard starting 3.0 Volvo

Would the engine backfire if the carb adj was too lean?
Absolutly!<br /><br /><br />With the shunt removed you should see around 8 at idle, 17 at 2000, and 20 at 4000.<br />Max is 21 at 4600 rpm
 

ss9940

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Re: Hard starting 3.0 Volvo

Ok! The only thing that bothers me is how the hell did it run so great on water with the ign misaligned + carb not adjusted well? Oh, and BTW DON... Didn't say thanx yet -> THANK YOU... you're da man<br /><br />I kinda wonder that Bondo didn't say a thing in this post though :) <br /><br />BTW, we use 95 octane fuel here... Should i still set it to 1 deg ATDC?
 
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