Force 85 HP tilt/trim model no.

[59Hustler]

I HAVE A 1989 FORCE 85 hp MODEL NO. 856A9A, I am trying to fix the tilt/trim system. The original problem was that it leaked down. after a couple of minutes. but it went up and down easily. I bought a new pump assembly from Ebay and it will not go up past the full trim up. position. with my assistance I can get it up and it doesn't leak down.
I contacted the seller and he wants to know the model no. for the tilt trim assembly. I cannot find a model no. anywhere on the assembly . Nor in the service manuals that I have. one being the Brunswick service manual for 1988-91 Force 85 thru 125 HP A models pt no.0B4642..
There is alot of info on the trim but it does not mention model numbers. It also just says to replace the whole pump and motor assembly.
My pump is different in one way from the replacement and all of the others on Ebay listed for 85-120 HP Force motors in that it has a allen screw with a lock nut installed in a verticle post sticking up. I assume this is a pressure adjustment. I am wondering if I need to install this into my new pump. I am posting a picture of my new and original pump.

 

[59Hustler]

I found some info on the sticky above but it doesn't address model no.

 

[topgun3690]

I bought a new pump assembly from Ebay

"New from ebay" probably means a cheap China clone.....could be bad right out of the box. The leakdown is probably caused by the check valves in the VB.....might try the repair described in the sticky at the top of this forum. A repaired original VB would be a lot better than any "new" one you can buy.

 

[topgun3690]

If you decide to try the repair, I have some of those tiny red seals that I will probably never use......you only need 2.

 

[jerryjerry05]

The 1989 T@T didn't come with a model or serial number it came as part of the engine package.
If the "new" pump isn't working right??? Send it BACK.
There's nothing you can do to it to fix it. NOTHING!!
The only thing you can do to one of these pumps is to change the tiny red seals, these seals stop the leakdown.
The allen head screw: quite possible it will break if you try to "adjust" it.
The following link has all the T@T used by Force and Mercury.

https://www.boats.net/catalog/force/outboard/force-trim-tilt-85-150-hp-1984-1999

Like I said nothing in the hyd. part of the pump that you can fix, NOTHING!!
You'll probably ruin it for good. Sorry for being brutal but I warn some and they break them anyway

IF? you buy a new pump, these guys have good products.
https://maxrules.com/ChryslerModels/chrysmodelindex.html

 

[59Hustler]

If you decide to try the repair, I have some of those tiny red seals that I will probably never use......you only need 2.

I am going to rebuild. Thank you

 

[59Hustler]

The 1989 T@T didn't come with a model or serial number it came as part of the engine package.
If the "new" pump isn't working right??? Send it BACK.
There's nothing you can do to it to fix it. NOTHING!!
The only thing you can do to one of these pumps is to change the tiny red seals, these seals stop the leakdown.
The allen head screw: quite possible it will break if you try to "adjust" it.
The following link has all the T@T used by Force and Mercury.

https://www.boats.net/catalog/force/outboard/force-trim-tilt-85-150-hp-1984-1999

Like I said nothing in the hyd. part of the pump that you can fix, NOTHING!!
You'll probably ruin it for good. Sorry for being brutal but I warn some and they break them anyway

IF? you buy a new pump, these guys have good products.
https://maxrules.com/ChryslerModels/chrysmodelindex.html

Thanks Jerry, I am going to rebuild.
This is probably an ignorant question but exactly where are these seals located are they under the hex bolts or behind the ports.
I have watched your videos several times but I am unsure of their location. I do not mind the brutality. I was going to rebuild earlier but decided at the time to take the "easy" way out and buy the pump. I already replace the O rings inside the trim cylinder, after watching that video it was the first thing I did .
Thanks for responding. The link you gave for MAX rules was a site I used to go to for my 1960 Mercury engines But the name had changed.

 

[59Hustler]

"New from ebay" probably means a cheap China clone.....could be bad right out of the box. The leakdown is probably caused by the check valves in the VB.....might try the repair described in the sticky at the top of this forum. A repaired original VB would be a lot better than any "new" one you can buy.

I agree a cheap China clone. I am going to return the "new" one. The seller was asking for information that according to Jerry and my own investigation does not exist. Thank you.

 

[topgun3690]

I am going to rebuild. Thank you

Those seals are inside the check valves.....shown here with the hex hole....one on each side. Follow those 2 stickies for info. Send PM if you want some seals.

 

[59Hustler]

View attachment 382968
Those seals are inside the check valves.....shown here with the hex hole....one on each side. Follow those 2 stickies for info. Send PM if you want some seals.

Thanks, I will Pm you later I have to put my old t@T pump back on so I can hit the lake this weekend and make sure my new stator from CDI works but that is another story. LOL

 

[topgun3690]

Thanks, I will Pm you later I have to put my old t@T pump back on so I can hit the lake this weekend and make sure my new stator from CDI works but that is another story. LOL

If it aint one thing, its another....lol. Hope it runs and be safe on the water.

 

[jerryjerry05]

If you look at the first 5-6 posts in the Force forum you'll find a bunch of info on the T@T
The pic that Topgun posted shows 1 of 2 different valves.
The second (older style) is held in by snap rings. HOPE that yours is the newer style, much easier to work on.
Remember: there's nothing in the pump that needs fixing. The 2 valves are the only thing you can work on. Most try to undo the nut and they break it off.

 

[topgun3690]

Mine had this style held in by snap rings.....harder to get out. Never did get the check valves apart.....totally destroyed them. Lol. Ended up buying a rebuilt VB from Franz Marine.

 

[59Hustler]

View attachment 383067
Mine had this style held in by snap rings.....harder to get out. Never did get the check valves apart.....totally destroyed them. Lol. Ended up buying a rebuilt VB from Franz Marine.

Mine has the circlip style.
On another T@T question .
Where does the trailer lock go? I assume it fits in one of the manual tilt holes but it has two rods on one side.
I am building one because I can't see paying $180 for a 5/16" rod. Every other OB I have owned has had a flip down at the motor head.
I bought the motor used and it did not have the trailer lock which wasn't a real issue for me as my boat is a pontoon and sits high on the trailer. Also I live on the lake and the boat normally resides at my dock, but working on the T@T has required me to support it in the lifted position. also zebra muscles have recently invaded my lake so I need to keep it out of the water. Right now I am using a pry bar that I slip between the cowling and the mount. which is a PIA and I am sure not that good for the OB.

 

[topgun3690]

Never used a trailer lock on mine. But it does have a built in tilt-lock on the port side stern bracket.....according to this parts diagram for your engine it should have one also. Just raise the engine all the way up and the lock engages and holds it up. Not to be used for trailering though.....if it not on there somebody may have removed it. Not really necessary if you have a good T&T system, but comes in handy to hold the engine up. Part #45 in the diagram. Force part#F85541-1 on ebay for $10.

 

[59Hustler]

Never used a trailer lock on mine. But it does have a built in tilt-lock on the port side stern bracket.....according to this parts diagram for your engine it should have one also. Just raise the engine all the way up and the lock engages and holds it up. Not to be used for trailering though.....if it not on there somebody may have removed it. Not really necessary if you have a good T&T system, but comes in handy to hold the engine up. Part #45 in the diagram. Force part#F85541-1 on ebay for $10.View attachment 383070View attachment 383069

Thanks!
# 4 is what I am making, part no 45 might be more of what I can use. I will order it, but I will continue making part no.4 I just need to know how far apart the two prongs on the port side are. this is the part they want between $100 and 180 IBoats wants $180.

 

[topgun3690]

Tilt-lock on my 85......I guess yours is not on there? Might need part #10 also...tilt stop pivot.....part#F85350-1
Actually, it shows 2 #10's and maybe a #11.....depending on what is already on there or not.....

 

[topgun3690]

I just need to know how far apart the two prongs on the port side are.

You could measure the distance between 2 holes on the stern bracket.....2 non adjacent holes....if that is where those prongs insert.

 

[59Hustler]

Tilt-lock on my 85......I guess yours is not on there? Might need part #10 also...tilt stop pivot.....part#F85350-1
Actually, it shows 2 #10's and maybe a #11.....depending on what is already on there or not.....

Yeah! mine has none of that mechanism The bolt holes are there to install it. That is what I get for a $200 motor 4 years ago. It has always started first turn of the key, and 150 psi compression. LOL

 

[topgun3690]

200 bucks for a runner with good compression.....caint beat that, brother....