Aaarg! New probs for Johnson 130 OceanPro!

[trobinson017]

Dang! My Johnson 130 Oceanpro has yet another problem! I posted a month or so ago that the tilt/trim got stuck in the full-up position for about 2 weeks. I finally got that fixed. In that process I wound up draining the batteries (1 starter and 1 deep cycle in parallel with 1-both-2 switch). I tried recharging with my old charger a couple times but that didn't work. I bought a new charger with digital readout, step-down charging, float charging, etc. and charged up both. I also checked electrolyte, topped off, removed and cleaned/scrubbed battery cables and coated in dielectric grease.

Now when I try to start it the starter pinion pops up and engages the flywheel but it doesn't have enough power to turn it. It may turn once or twice slowly then stops but as long as I have the key turned the starter motor continues to run, the pinion just doesn't turn easily. This is with the battery switch set to "both". Also, when I turn the key off the starter pinion remains engaged with the flywheel. It doesn't drop back down. I sprayed the starter pinion and the exposed spring that pops it up with CRC 6-56 lube but that didn't help. I also made sure the solenoid switch was set to the Run position. It just seems the starter might be bound up internally. I don't know a thing about them so any help would be much appreciated. It's been 2 months since I've had my boat out because of these one-after-another problems.

Thanks!

trob

 

[trobinson017]

Re: Aaarg! New probs for Johnson 130 OceanPro!

I forgot to mention that the motor started just fine before the tilt stuck. Never had any issues with the starter. Could something have gotten hosed up with the starter because of the tilt issue???

trob

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Aaarg! New probs for Johnson 130 OceanPro!

90% of starter problems are bad connections. remove and clean both ends of the battery cables, so that they are shiney, also the cable from the solenoid to starter. check for nicks in the cables. and make sure the connectors are on the wire good. the cable tend to corrode from the inside out, if nicked, corroded wires, and connections, heat up and cause resistance to the follow of electricity, thus the starter doesn't get enough. you can also take jumper cable pos battery post to large post on starter. with a good connection, the engine should spin. then if the starter is good clean everything and retest. then trouble shoot solenoid. starters can be rebuit at a starter/alternator shop, much cheaper than a new one.

also have the battery load tested at the auto parts store, free, i've had new batteries go bad

 

[trobinson017]

Re: Aaarg! New probs for Johnson 130 OceanPro!

Thanks for the info, Tash. I just now got out there and removed all the battery cables from the battery end, not from the switch yet. I can tell already that the cables should be replaced. I also checked the cable from the solenoid to the starter which looks in great shape. Went ahead and and shined them up then coated them in vaseline.

One question I have is that the deep cycle battery cable (#2) just connects to the screw post on the battery. It doesn't connect to a large clamp fitting that can then attach to the large post on the battery, which is how the starter battery (#1) is wired up. Does it matter? I can't find anything online to tell me if that's as good as using a post clamp. Not sure if I'm explaining it well but you sound pretty knowledgable so I figure you'll understand what I'm describing. If not, I can post pics.

I'm about to run out and get new cables so a quick reply would be greatly appreciated. Actually, any reply would be appreciated!

Thanks!

trob

 

[HighTrim]

Re: Aaarg! New probs for Johnson 130 OceanPro!

If you have wing nuts, they are a no no, if you do use them, make sure to tighten them with pliers, not hand tight. It is always better to have ratchet connectors for any wiring on the battery.

Do you have, and are able to use, a multi meter? Voltage drop testing can quickly isolate faulty wiring or components of the ignition system.

 

[HighTrim]

Re: Aaarg! New probs for Johnson 130 OceanPro!

Noticed you left, so will post the details

First set your meter to the 20 volt scale

Put your POS voltmeter lead on the battery POS terminal and the voltmeter NEG lead on the large incoming solenoid/battery terminal post and give her juice. If the meter reads more than .3 volts, the battery cable is bad, corroded or you have a faulty connection (loose).

Next, connect the POS lead to the incoming large solenoid post and the NEG lead to the outgoing large solenoid post while giving her juice. If the voltmeter reads greater than .2 volts, the solenoid is bad, corroded or has a faulty connection.

Next, connect the POS lead to the outgoing large solenoid post and the negative voltmeter lead to the starter positive post and give her juice. A reading of over .2 volts indicates faulty wiring between the solenoid and the starter.

Finally, connect the NEG lead to the NEG battery post and the POS lead to the engine block and crank the engine. A reading greater than .3 volts indicates a faulty negative cable, corrosion or a faulty connection.

 

[trobinson017]

UPDATE: Aaarg! New probs for Johnson 130 OceanPro!

UPDATE: Aaarg! New probs for Johnson 130 OceanPro!

Tash and HighTrim,

I have my motor running now. Thanks to both of you for your advice. Here's what I did:

- disconnected both batteries from both ends (one at battery, one at battery switch).

- Rebuilt starter battery cable by cutting off corroded/rusted end and putting on new lug and attached a new terminal clamp. The cable I uncovered for the new lug was very bright and clean (no corrosion). The other end (switch) was very clean.

- removed cable from starter to solenoid.

- used a dremel sander to polish all cable ends. Replaced all cables and coated with vaseline.

- Used my new charger to charge up both batteries.

Now, after doing all that I tried starting the motor. The starter pinion popped up and struggled to spin, just as it did before the above fixes. This time though, I kept the key turned for a longer time (never exceeding 15 seconds) and finally the starter sped up to normal speed to turn the flywheel and the engine started. I let it run for awhile but then a big storm blew in and I had to stop and clean up everything. That was last night. Today I tried to start it and same thing; the starter struggled to get going but keeping the key turned longer it finally spun up and started the motor. I let it run about 8 minutes then stopped it. I waited 10 mins and restarted it with no problem. Another storm blew in and so I stopped everything and the engine sat for about an hour during the storm. After the storm I went out and restarted it, no problem at all. It cranked right up with no struggle.

So, it seems to be working but I'm still concerned with the starter not spinning up to full power after the engine sits for a day. Does that point to an issue with the starter or did I not do a good enough job on the battery cables? Maybe during the tilt problem when the motor sat unused the starter just oxidized internally and it's just now breaking that stuff up and able to run?

Any further advice would be much appreciated. You guys are the best!

 

[HighTrim]

Re: Aaarg! New probs for Johnson 130 OceanPro!

It is possible the starter needs to be rebuilt, there are still some faulty wiring/connections, or the battery is faulty. Even if it charges up to 12.65 volts, have it load tested. If you do not have a load tester, many auto stores will do this for free.

Measure the voltage at the starter (+) terminal while somebody turns the key over to "start" - if you get within half a volt or so of the battery voltage(which should be 12.65 volts fully charged), the starter is faulty, and needs to be rebuilt.

Also disconnect and inspect the large red harness plug in the cowl. Clean it as best you can with electrical contact cleaner, smear some grease around the contact edges and reconnect. Now use the ignition switch to try and start the engine. If it works every time the connector was the culprit.

Now connect a single jumper cable between the POS battery terminal and directly to the large terminal on the starter. If the starter spins each time you do that, the solenoid is likely the culprit.

Connect another jumper cable to the NEG battery terminal and a good ground (bare bolt head or bracket) on the engine. Now do the same test you just did previously. If the starter now goes ok, you have a negative battery cable problem (which is common) or the solenoid is bad.

Let us know what you find, you are getting there!

 

[trobinson017]

Re: Aaarg! New probs for Johnson 130 OceanPro!

Chris,

You wrote: "Also disconnect and inspect the large red harness plug in the cowl."

I'm don't know what this is. Can you describe for me please?

Thanks!

trob

 

[wilde1j]

Re: Aaarg! New probs for Johnson 130 OceanPro!

The plug is typically on the port side in the lower cowl and is ~ 1 1/2" in diameter. Hard to miss.

 

[trobinson017]

Re: Aaarg! New probs for Johnson 130 OceanPro!

HighTrim and all,

I haven't done anything else you all have suggested just because of time and work schedule. I did go out this evening after the motor has sat for over 24 hours and started it up after only a couple cranks of the key. The starter didn't hesitate at all! I'm guessing (bad word, I know!) that the starter just got bound up while the motor was stuck in the full tilt-up position for 2 weeks. I'm going to continue to start it every day until I get the time to take her out for a spin.

I do have to say that the info on cleaning all the cable ends and such to troubleshoot the starter problem was spot-on. It led me to discover the rusted out POS cable end which I've rebuilt. I believe this was the root cause of the initial problem. Everyone else's input after that assisted in my understanding of all these types of issues and what to work on in the future to improve connectivity.

This forum continues to impress me with the expert knowledge you all have and are so ready to offer. It gives me great comfort and confidence that no matter what problems I encounter with my boat I can find help here. Thanks!!!!!!!

Trob

 

[HighTrim]

Re: Aaarg! New probs for Johnson 130 OceanPro!

Not a problem.

Hopefully now you get more boating in and less troubleshooting.

Let us know how you do. Good luck.