93 225 two stroke wont transfer oil

[mikewiggins63]

Hoping to get some clarity here since I am just throwing away money on parts that are not bad. Have read many Rodbolt posts that are very helpful. Have read my Seloc manual that is very helpful, but still chasing my tail.

225 TXRR that will transfer oil from remote tank with the manual switch that is on the side of the CDI, but not automatically when main tank oil level drops and alarm goes off. I understand the roll of the trim sender and mine was not reading on my digital gauge correctly, so I replaced it. The gauge now reads correctly but it did nothing for oil transfer.

Under the advice of my certified Yam mechanic, I also replaced the remote tank float switch after he ohmed it out and said it was not working. No change.

I am not afraid of using an ohm meter, but have no experience or confidence with it. I am fairly knowlegeable mechanically, but wiring issues are somewhat intimidating to me.

I'm sure my certified Yamaha mechanic has forgotten more than I know about this, but I also think that he has forgotten how to work on precision blend.

 

[seahorse5]

Re: 93 225 two stroke wont transfer oil

Rodbolt has typed out instructions on how to test the oil transfer system multiple times on this website. Use the search function and read them over again to learn what to troubleshoot.

In addition, here is a link to an article about the system and how it works.

http://www.bwbmag.com/output.cfm?id=942859

 

[mikewiggins63]

Re: 93 225 two stroke wont transfer oil

Thanks for the link. I have tried unsuccessfully in the past to access that link on this forum but this time it came right up. I will attempt now to ohm out the main tank float switch (s) and go from there.

Much appreciated

 

[rodbolt]

Re: 93 225 two stroke wont transfer oil

decent article, they missed a few key points.
on the 1993 the trim indicate also feeds trim angle information to the engine ECU.
make sure its getting there.
also if the SWB circuit is open you always have a yellow lamp indicate and no automatic oil transfer will occur.
what is the visual indicate on the tach?

if SWB is closed and the circuit is good and the engine tank sw3(alarm) closes you get 3 flashing bars and 180 second pump on command.

the trick with jumping the engine oil tank engine side connector is a good tip, however it WONT work on 96 and newer V6 nor ANY year model 3.1L UNLESS the engine is running.
see even magazine editors and writers dont always get it right.
watched a tech spend half a day chasing that one.
no need to ohm to much as when SWB closes,alarm on, it also sets a second pump on command in case SW2 is bad.
wont hurt and its quick.
NEVER EVER EVER pull out the switch and screen assy without FIRST draining the engine tank via the water trap.
any debris on the tank bottom will now fall into the oil pump intake.
ALWAYS retrive and replace with a new, rubber seal between the tank bottom and the screen.
can you post a picture of your digital tach>

 

[mikewiggins63]

Re: 93 225 two stroke wont transfer oil

Okay, I followed the instructions to the best of my knowledge with the ohm meter. Black lead to the black lead on disconnected main oil tank float switch and red lead to each other connection and moved the float manually. Not knowing or being comfortable with an ohm meter, I can only guess as to the information that I now have.

I think though that the switch is probably working because as I moved the switch from bottom to top, the ohm meter registered readings from about 340-1200, depending on which wire I was on. Is this how I am to interpret this info?

Thanks

 

[rodbolt]

Re: 93 225 two stroke wont transfer oil

post the wire colors on your engine switch.

 

[mikewiggins63]

Re: 93 225 two stroke wont transfer oil

Thanks Rodbolt. will post tomorrow afternoon in daylight with wire colors. To answer one of your questions, I believe SWB is working properly, at least according to digital dash gauge. Tank is full, Green light indicated on gauge.

 

[rodbolt]

Re: 93 225 two stroke wont transfer oil

only thing that controls the green lamp is SWB, NOTHING else.
when SWB is closed the green is lit, when SWB opens the yellow is lit. its one of the very very few circuits that yamaha uses an open for anything.

 

[99yam40]

Re: 93 225 two stroke wont transfer oil

Okay, I followed the instructions to the best of my knowledge with the ohm meter. Black lead to the black lead on disconnected main oil tank float switch and red lead to each other connection and moved the float manually. Not knowing or being comfortable with an ohm meter, I can only guess as to the information that I now have.

I think though that the switch is probably working because as I moved the switch from bottom to top, the ohm meter registered readings from about 340-1200, depending on which wire I was on. Is this how I am to interpret this info?

Thanks

If you touch the 2 meter leads together with the meter set on ohms it should read close to 00.0 ohms or at least a real low reading because you are shorting them together but you have some resistance in the meter leads themselves. Hopefully your meter is auto ranging or else you need to make sure you have it set to the lowest setting.
When measuring the switch when it is closed you should be reading real close to that low reading you had with the leads shorted together, when the switch is open you should be reading O.L or a real high reading.
340-1200 does not look right to me

 

[mikewiggins63]

Re: 93 225 two stroke wont transfer oil

Thanks 99yam40. I wasn't kidding when I said that my ohm meter skills , well, suck. I read the one page instructions that came with it, but it was not thorough enough.

Anyway, I think when I did the tests, it was set on 2000k. Didn't know any better.

I'll try again with the lowest setting this evening if I can get to it before dark. I am determined to save the oiling system on this motor even if it kills me, or more likely breaks the bank.

Thanks

 

[mikewiggins63]

Re: 93 225 two stroke wont transfer oil

Okay, here are the engine tank float switch colors you asked for rodbolt.

5 wires that run from tank switch to plug under the CDI. Black, Blue/Green, Blue/White, Blue/Red and Blue/Red again

 

[rodbolt]

Re: 93 225 two stroke wont transfer oil

ok
key on engine off. use a jumper pin to jump black to blue/green.
transfer pump should come on.
jump black to blue/white. pump should shut off.
jump black to blue red and pump should come on, alarm on and the far left bar or red lamp on.
use your ohmeter to test cotinuity from black to a good engine ground, should see less than 2 ohms.
on the V6 motors this only works on 2.6L motors older than 1995.
did you check the trim signal back to the CDI/ECU assy?

 

[mikewiggins63]

Re: 93 225 two stroke wont transfer oil

Brother you must have the patience of a saint for dealing with guys like me. I can remove and replace parts with the best of them, but asking me if I have a trim signal to the CDI is about a dogs age more experience than I have with wires on a boat motor. I could B.S. you, but that wouldn't solve a thing and my guess is you wouldn't respect me in the morning.

I will try jumping the wires as you said to see what happens with the pump.

Now, how do I test for trim signal?

 

[mikewiggins63]

Re: 93 225 two stroke wont transfer oil

Alright, this what I found. Key on and engine off, I checked for black wire ground from oil sensor plug coming from the bottom of CDI. I got about 1-2 Ohms from that when grounding to block. Normal right?

Then jumped black wire and blue/green and got nothing. The only thing that was activated when jumping from black wire was one of the blue/red wires sounded the dash alarm. All other wires/pins did nothing.

 

[rodbolt]

Re: 93 225 two stroke wont transfer oil

follow the wire from the trim switch, should be pink,orange and black.
orange is simply a 5V reference,black is a ground, pink is the pick off voltage that not only operates the trim indicator it also feeds the pick off voltage to the oil control module inside the CDI.
follow the wires from the trim switch to the bullets conectors,should be in the aft area just behind the CDI assy.
there it should change from pink to pink/black and double up.
one p/b goes to the 4 pin trim harness connector where its changed back to pink and heads towards the dash.
the other P/B goes to the CDI and is the only pink/black wire there.
KEY OFF, measure resistance with the engine fully down between the pink bullet connector and a good engine ground.
while the meter is still hooked up trim the engine about 45*. record the measurements.
now trim it back down. upnplug the CDI.

now move the lead from the bullet connector to the pin that the p/b wire goes to and repeat the test by trimming.
the two should be the same.
when you have the key on engine off do you have a green indicate on the tach?

 

[mikewiggins63]

Re: 93 225 two stroke wont transfer oil

Rodbolt. Thanks for the clear instructions on testing for trim signal to CDI. I tested with key off, engine down all the way, and all bullet connections connected at pink/black and got 13ohms in the down position.

Moved the motor up and recorded about 35 on the ohm meter. I then lowered the motor and pulled main CDI plug apart where pink/black runs. I got the same readings on meter when 13-35 when connected to female plug connection at pink/black.

The digital dash gauge arrow is above the green symbol.

Also I ohmed out main tank sw1, sw2, and sw3 and all appeared ok

 

[mikewiggins63]

Re: 93 225 two stroke wont transfer oil

My manual says that with all the steps I have taken, my problem is likely the CDI unit. Any thoughts or hail mary's

 

[noelm]

Re: 93 225 two stroke wont transfer oil

I would wait for Rodbolt to tell you how to fully test before I went out and got a new one, but in my experience (and that is limited) the last thing I would suspect on a Yamaha is an electrical failure! but in saying that, it certainly is possible.

 

[rodbolt]

Re: 93 225 two stroke wont transfer oil

best I recall I have seen 3 CDI units fail on the 2.6L motors.
I would double check everything again.

 

[mikewiggins63]

Re: 93 225 two stroke wont transfer oil

Alright, had the whole system from remote tank through wiring harness and trim sender and main tank switch retested and still shows no signal out of CDI. Since the oil control unit is in the CDI and cannot be serviced, I will decide now whether to replace CDI or premix.

Thank everybody that chimed in. Especially Rodbolt. You were very kind...

Mike

Bonita Springs, FL