1988 Crusiers Yachts Esprit 3370

[Sodus Jerk]

I am considering buying this boat

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Crui...ats?hash=item4149461551&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245

Can I get an informed opinion on the price? Does anyone know this boat?

Thanks

 

[Bondo]

Re: 1988 Crusiers Yachts Esprit 3370

Ayuh,... The ad says Twin I/Os,... Yet never mentions Who's I/Os....

That would concern Me...

 

[Grand Larsony]

Re: 1988 Crusiers Yachts Esprit 3370

I have personally inspected this boat and took it on a brief sea trial with the owner. It is located on Cayuga Lake, NY (if I recall the location right - but I know it was this exact boat).

Condition is excellent for this vintage and the hard top is really nice. Canvas is perfect as are fabrics and vinyl. Has new twin bed in place of original mid-cabin convertable couch, but it works pretty well with the interior and would be a great nap spot. Also good if you & wife like to sleep separately sometimes. Overall interior condition is 9 out of 10.

Engine room is clean and orderly. Ignition has been upgraded to electronic. Saw no issues here whatsoever. Hull & topsides are better than very good.

The problem is... it's got the wrong motors and ya can't do much about that!!! Should have 454's IMHO. Really, it's a total dog. Took FOREVER to get on plane and didn't like to stay up there without trim tabs. Had just three aboard.

The other problem (for us) was the transom entry. Lack of a true walk-thru killed the deal as we have large dogs and no way am I lifting them in and out all the time. Wouldn't work for elderly guests either.

If those concerns aren't a problem for you then this is a really nice boat. The owner was a good guy, and he seemed to do all the right things to keep this vessel in ship-shape condition. Honestly, it was one of the nicest boats we've seen and I got all the right vibes... except for the smaller motors.

Now, a word of caution if you like late-80's Cruisers. There is another Cruisers 3370 boat in the Rochester area that has "EVERYTHING NEW" blah-blah-blah and he advertises it as a "yacht". It's been on CL on and off for a while now.

I have on good authority that this is the same boat that was sold in Hilton area last year, after the guy gave up the restore due to back pain, and it's a complete POS. Was either in a Florida hurricane or a sinker of some type. Was covered in mud and had serious mold infestation. My boat guy said STAY AWAY FROM THIS GARBAGE. At minimum, ask yourself "Why is everything so new?" See what the seller says... and ask your surveyor to go over it very carefully (if you even get to that point).

Good luck !!!!

Just m $.02. Send me a note if you'd like to correspond directly.

Best Regards.

 

[jaxnjil]

Re: 1988 Crusiers Yachts Esprit 3370

nice review; not often some one asks about a boat and gets the answers you are able to provide.

 

[Grand Larsony]

Re: 1988 Crusiers Yachts Esprit 3370

I sent you a PM (Private Message). Let me know if you have any other questions... and having spent the past two years looking at boats in this size\age\price class I have a pretty good idea of the Upstate NY marketplace right now.

It's a GREAT time to buy !!!

 

[tmh]

Re: 1988 Crusiers Yachts Esprit 3370

Ayuh,... The ad says Twin I/Os,... Yet never mentions Who's I/Os....

That would concern Me...

I'd think it has inboards, not I/O's so not an issue most likely.

Power could be an issue as has been stated - it's a big boat.

 

[tmh]

Re: 1988 Crusiers Yachts Esprit 3370

Now, a word of caution if you like late-80's Cruisers. There is another Cruisers 3370 boat in the Rochester area that has "EVERYTHING NEW" blah-blah-blah and he advertises it as a "yacht". It's been on CL on and off for a while now.

I have on good authority that this is the same boat that was sold in Hilton area last year, after the guy gave up the restore due to back pain, and it's a complete POS. Was either in a Florida hurricane or a sinker of some type. Was covered in mud and had serious mold infestation. My boat guy said STAY AWAY FROM THIS GARBAGE. At minimum, ask yourself "Why is everything so new?" See what the seller says... and ask your surveyor to go over it very carefully (if you even get to that point).
Best Regards.

Larsony, the boat you refer to here belongs to ME. I do not want to jump the thread or advertise my boat here, but I can't let your VERY uninformed info go unchallenged. This is a Coast Guard documented vessel and I have a complete history report on the boat. It is completely FALSE that the boat was a "sinker". It is in VG condition and has the 454 mercruisers appropriate for the boat - LIKE NEW.

Your "boat guy", as I am sure you know, has a VERY spotty reputation around town. I am sure he hates me as I choose not to put up with his antics - I can't get into it more here except to say he and I did not agree on how he deals with people and his charges. I will mention no names but we both know who it is. He may be your friend or something - fine, hang with whomever you'd like... just leave my boat out of it.

Also, please stop posting lies about my boat on Craigslist. Anyone is free to ask "why so much new" and I will tell them "because it needed updating or to be replaced". This boat had a VERY nice hull and structure and now has a totally new interior and fully rebuilt engines to go along with it. I never saw the old engines - maybe they WERE total crap - I have no idea nor do i care what WAS in there. I have shown the boat twice recently and both buyers were very impressed. One is sending me an offer so it may be a mute point. However, i am not taking much off asking so we'll see.

As for advertising it as a "yacht" - it IS a Yacht Certified vessel. It certainly qualifies to be called a "yacht" but really what does that matter?

Please stop commenting on hear-say from a non-trustworthy source.

 

[Grand Larsony]

Re: 1988 Crusiers Yachts Esprit 3370

Not even worth arguing the boat guy... and anyone can search CL R&R in Rochester, NY for "marine". You'll see one wacky compliaint, followed by testimonial after testimonial from customers who have nothing but the HIGHEST regard for the "boat guy" in question. This is all completely unsolicited, and many of the posters chose to list their real names and contact information (pretty unusual for CL, huh?). Not one other person said anything negative.

Whatever, man... Whatever. Post the certified marine surveyor's report and whatever it is you call a "complete history report".

 

[tmh]

Re: 1988 Crusiers Yachts Esprit 3370

Not even worth arguing the boat guy... and anyone can search CL R&R in Rochester, NY for "marine". You'll see one wacky compliaint, followed by testimonial after testimonial from customers who have nothing but the HIGHEST regard for the "boat guy" in question. This is all completely unsolicited, and many of the posters chose to list their real names and contact information (pretty unusual for CL, huh?). Not one other person said anything negative.

Whatever, man... Whatever. Post the certified marine surveyor's report and whatever it is you call a "complete history report".

Larsony, why would I post a report here - I'm not selling the boat on this site. not even sure what you mean by "post the report" - it's 4 pages long, not exactly forum material. If you don't even know what a boat history report is then I can't understand how you would even think to say someone else's boat is "a sinker"! Didn't you know such events were reportable events and would be discoverable by any buyer? I ALWAYS check prior to a boat (or any vehicle) purchase just to be sure. The hull is close to PERFECT so obviously no hurricane damage. Again

Again, I am telling you straight out that you have extreme mis-information from an individual with an axe to grind. You may even BE that person, I have no idea nor do i care. Whatever the reason for this, you may be costing me and my family cold hard cash on the honest sale of my boat. I just can't have that. You are bordering on harrasment, which is not legal. I highly suggest you stop it.

To the OP who asked about the boat in the finger lakes..... IF it's in the condition stated here, then it's a great boat for most purposes. However, I totally agree with Larsony about the shortcomings for certain people or uses. Maybe you could change props to help get on plane with the small block engines, but they are definately not best for this boat IF you plan to cruise distances. For puttering around, fishing, hanging out, etc. it's fine.

Also, as Larsony said, it is not the easiest boat to get on/off so not great for elderly (or large dogs I guess). However, the cabin layout makes it seem huge so great for staying on.

That specific boat on eBay has been for sale for some time at a higher price I think. He's come down due to the horrible selling environment for boats and it is a fine price IF that's the boat you want.

 

[Grand Larsony]

Re: 1988 Crusiers Yachts Esprit 3370

Ok, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt here and man-up to my statements, admitting I am not in posession of direct evidence to contradict you. Only second-hand information from a source I really do trust (as do many of my fellow boaters in the area) and my own experience dealing with the prior owner (apparently, just before you, last season, when it was a basket case).

My comments were intended in a helpful way (to potential buyers, such as the OP). If your boat is indeed as you say, I'm sure you'll have no trouble selling. It's certainly noble to restore a boat and try to sell it for a fair price, and for that -- if this is the case -- I applaud your hard work and dedication.

Good luck and I'll not bother you again in this forum nor any other venue.

Best regards.

 

[Sodus Jerk]

Re: 1988 Crusiers Yachts Esprit 3370

Ok, well, that's a lot of help.

Grand Larsony, thanks for the info on the Ebay boat. It is obvious you get very involved with the boats in and near Rochester. However, I did not understand why you attacked your fellow boat owner ... especially when I had not asked about his boat. It was almost like you were using your extensive answer to my inquiry as a means of introducing your real point, attacking that boat seller. I was glad you retracted your hearsay accusations.

You did manage to talk me out of bidding on the Ebay boat. It may be a fine vessel, but I prefer better get up and go.

You also got me interested in the boat you lambasted. I like the Cruisers, and that boat has the right engines. And brand new. The fact that the interior is new is also a bonus. I will take your advice and have a survey done if I get serious, but I must say, It looks good.

What a tight and gossipy little community you Irondequoit bay boaters are. Not only was I able to find the other 3370, I found plenty of boat owners who knew your mechanic. I must say that the opinions of him varied greatly. In a previous post, you admitted that "Others have had mixed experiences with Mike but he's ok by me". That is what I found. Several said that they would never deal with him again due to a bad experience.

This and the fact that you seem to be overly involved in other people's boats lead me to believe that you are either connected to that marine shop, or you are just plain too involved in other people's stuff. I hate to be so critical after your advice, but I was more put off by your un-called-for, unrequested, and rumor based tirade. Several of the boaters said "Doug is someone who attends all the open houses in the neighborhood just to see what his neighbors have". I am sure that the people who you talk into a "Sea Trial" would be hesitant to do so if they knew you were just "overly curious".

Again, I feel bad dissing you after you went above and beyond to help me, but after hearing what your fellow boaters said, and what you said in your private message to me, I think you just like to act as the local expert and you hate to see TMH cut into your territory.

Nonetheless, thanks to all for your input.

 

[tmh]

Re: 1988 Crusiers Yachts Esprit 3370

Ok, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt here and man-up to my statements, admitting I am not in posession of direct evidence to contradict you. Only second-hand information from a source I really do trust (as do many of my fellow boaters in the area) and my own experience dealing with the prior owner (apparently, just before you, last season, when it was a basket case).

My comments were intended in a helpful way (to potential buyers, such as the OP). If your boat is indeed as you say, I'm sure you'll have no trouble selling. It's certainly noble to restore a boat and try to sell it for a fair price, and for that -- if this is the case -- I applaud your hard work and dedication.

Good luck and I'll not bother you again in this forum nor any other venue.

Best regards.

I appreciate the stand-up reply. I do not dispute the fact that the previous owner was NOT a knowledgeable boat owner, although he spent nearly $25k on the boat... then didn't finish the job, which I did. The boat was never in bad condition, just had both engines out for rebuild and purchase of all new "trimmings".

None of that makes any difference now as the engines are barely broken in, run like tops and produce plenty of power.

 

[Grand Larsony]

Re: 1988 Crusiers Yachts Esprit 3370

Apologies to the forum if this has become a three-way conversation - but in the interests of full disclosure I'd like to try to cap this off. I like this forum but it's frustrating when there is no end to the story...

First, I have no interest in any marine business, in either of these boats, or in anything remotely related to anyone here. I'm just an area boater who responded to a request for information on a boat I happened to look at. I then, perhaps foolishly, included information on another boat that I thought the OP may come across given that it's in the same area and is a very similar craft. I hope, with reflection, we can understand why this was included in my first post.

As regards this second boat, I stated what I had heard, that it should be surveyed, and said where my information came from and told him to "ask the seller" for more information. I've been chastised by the owner of this boat, and perhaps rightly so, and have tried to make amends here in the forum.

I've never been to any open house ever. Not one. Nor have I even looked at a boat that I wasn't potentially interested in actually buying. Nor have I ever pulled the 'free boat ride' thing on anyone. Not sure where these comments came from, but in the age we now live in I guess anything is possible.

In the PM referenced above, from me to Soda Jerk, I provided additional information in hope he, as a buyer, might find it useful. The message is copied below with some specifics removed for obvious reasons. Having no idea what Soda Jerk's level of experience is with regard to boat buying, and given his request for help, this was provided for only the most sincere of reasons. Obviously, this strategy is geared to benefit a buyer and it's one I've used to my advantage in the past. The PM has nothing to do with TMH's boat whatsoever.

I have also provided similar information for sellers (when asked). This advice may also seem "biased" if it were to be looked at by a potential buyer.

This is the real disconnect here... Buyer vs. Seller. Buyers and sellers have competing interests, which is completely normal. We are, after all, having this discussion in an anonoymous on-line forum and you can take it or leave it, take it for what it's worth, etc. It's just a forum where people can share information. In the end, you always need to see the boat. You always need to have it surveyed. Sellers must price right and have it in good condition. Everything else doesn't matter -- it's just opinion.

As you can see, my opinion didn't deter Soda Jerk from his interest in TMH's boat. This demonstrates my point pretty well I think.


**** PM from me to Soda Jerk (provided for full disclosure) ****

Hey man. I've personally seen that boat and posted what I recall. Let me know if you have any other quesitons.

As for price I didn't want to put my thoughts directly in the forum... He was pretty overpriced earlier this year (another reason we weren't interested) but it looks like he's getting more realistic now.

I'd do this:

1. See the boat. Inspect it very carefully and have a preliminary sea trial. If that goes well...

2. Draw up a pre-purchase contract (I can send you the one I made up for my purchase this summer, it worked really well). Any offer will be conditional on professional survey and formal sea trial but it get's the two of you on the same page regarding price. Push for him to cover winterization and storage if possible.

3. Contact firstname lastname for the survey. He's a great guy and very thorough. Will cost you about $x-y00 but it's TOTALLY worth it (and you'll need it for a loan and\or insurance). Whatever he finds wrong you get a repair estimate and try to reduce your offer price, above, by those amounts.

4. After survey and sea trial, with the report and estimates in-hand, renegotiate the purchase terms with the owner. You're in the driver seat.

In the end, if you really like the boat and it surveys & sea-trials well, you should pay about $xx-yy,000 (and the owner should cover winterization and storage).

That would qualify it as a total "steal". I'd personally go as high as $XXk but only if I was REALLY SURE about everything.

My direct address is xxx@xxxxx.com if you want to discuss this further.

 

[tmh]

Re: 1988 Crusiers Yachts Esprit 3370

I think we can end this bickering now. Larsony DID try to help and provided a LOT of info that is helpful. it's unfortunate my boat was dragged into this, but to be honest IF I saw someone looking for a boat and though they might stumble on a lemon I might warn them also, maybe just not in a public forum unless I had facts to back it up. If I see his boat in the bay I MIGHT ram into him, but all in good fun! Heck, it's just a Sea Ray ... they're a dime a dozen up this way. j/k I'm cool with ending the argument and moving on.

I'm somewhat "addicted" to the local boat market so I can appreciate being "overly informed" about what's listed locally, etc. Heck, I check CL every day and I have no idea why! I have two boats and a PWC already and certainly am NOT in the market to buy one, just curious I guess.

btw, it's sad up here in the Northeast because the boating season is nearly over and we're getting a cold spell now with just a few weeks left! I wanted to be out on Lake Ontario this week, but may wind up having my boats pulled this weekend and call it a season. I got very little use out of my Cruisers YACHT this season so I may take it off the market so i can make a few trips next spring - then sell it after I've had my fun. I have too busy a family to keep it along with our skiing/tubing boat but a month or two would be fun.

Sodus, good luck in your search. Avoid any 1989 Sea Ray 300 Sundancers ....they're all overpriced junk.

OUT.

 

[Grand Larsony]

Re: 1988 Crusiers Yachts Esprit 3370

Sorry to drag this up to the top everyone (as it's mainly a three-person conversation) but I'm curious if TMH sold the boat and if the OP found a boat.

Gentlemen might you provide an update? Hope you're both happy.

 

[tmh]

Re: 1988 Crusiers Yachts Esprit 3370

Well, I thought tis thread was dead....

Although I received two decent offers for my boat just before the season ends here, I declined both as they were short of my asking price. As a matter of fact, prior to the offers, I had the opportunity to use my boat several times for entertaining clients of mine and found it very enjoyable and good for business as well! I was already leaning towards keeping the boat when the potential buyers viewed it or I think the offers would have been fine.

Now it's winterized and I miss it! I sort of doubt it will be on the market next year - I think I'll keep it for business use and occasional family use. We have an open bow sports boat for "normal" family use so the big boat is more for occasional quiet cruises and such. So, I will use it to take clients out for dinner cruises, etc. Maybe some fishing as well.

btw, as the engines were newly completely rebuilt I was still in break-in mode earlier and only "opened it up" towards fall, after the first oil change and some hours on the engine. My NEW mechanic says the engines are running "perfectly" and the oil looked great. It ran great, planed out fast and had plenty of speed. I wouldn't want to run those 454's all out for long as the gas usage would kill me! But for a minute or two....

I hope Sodus Jerk found a nice boat for himself! they sure are a great deal around here these days.

Larsony, to show no hard feelins, maybe I'll take you out for a ride next spring! You buy the beer though. Oh...wait a minute, I barely know how to handle the thing sober, yet alone after some beers. Maybe I'll hold off until I get more captain experience of a larger vessel! It's sure a lot different than a 19 footer.

 

[Grand Larsony]

Re: 1988 Crusiers Yachts Esprit 3370

Glad to hear the update -- and to know that you're happy with the situation. That's a really nice boat from what you say you've done, and it's good that it's running well.

You should keep it in the water and weekend on it with the family. Much easier to operate it, while drinking, when it's tied to the dock. Safer for everyone, too.

See you on the water and have a good winter.

 

[Sodus Jerk]

Re: 1988 Crusiers Yachts Esprit 3370

Well now isn't this a "sweet" little love fest. How nice to see a couple of boat bloggers like yourselves kiss and make up. I guess you Irondequoit Bouys just can't stay mad at each other.

Yes, I got exactly what I wanted and at the right price. I couldn't be happier.