1986 Evinrude 225 VRO power loss

[Checkmateboy]

I purchased a boat late last season with an 86 225 VRO Evinrude. The original owner had not used the boat last season but said it ran great the season before. I can't seem to get over 4000 rpm out of it! (not the prop) The engine starts and seems to run great, just seems to have the power of a 70 hp or so. Even at full throttle it seems smooth with no issues except the power loss. Compression is good. I replaced both power packs and this did help some, I replaced spark plugs although they were all a nice tan color. The first time I opened the throttle it run up over 5500 for a short time then fell right back to 4000, where it has been since. I don't know much about the VRO system, but would this be a good start? I thought about rebuilding it just because? Any suggestions would be greatly apprieciated!

 

[moderator1]

Re: 1986 Evinrude 225 VRO power loss

Checkmateboy, Moving to Outbaords.

 

[round2it]

Re: 1986 Evinrude 225 VRO power loss

How fresh was the fuel stored in the boat? Was it stored with fuel stabilizer? To eliminate the fuel, try a portable 6 gal tank with fresh fuel, without oil unless you premix. I don't think you do or you wouldn't have the VRO question I guess. Right off the bat, i wouldn't suspect the VRO. Are you getting oil to the plugs? Does it smoke? <br /><br />I would suspect fuel or carbs first. <br /><br />It might be time to rebuild, replace or remove the vro for peace of mind. The new units are called OMS, Oil Metering System. It keeps a constant 50 to 1 ratio of oil/fuel at idle or WOT.

 

[Checkmateboy]

Re: 1986 Evinrude 225 VRO power loss

Thanks for the suggestion round2it. Sorry I forgot to mention I cleaned the carbs, and replaced all fuel. I have also used up 2-3 tanks of gas out on the lake trying to get it running. It also seems to be getting its oil, smokes some during idle, and I have ran it WO throttle for a distance and shut if off before idle down to see what the plugs look like and they look a nice tan. To me it seems as if the fuel pump is only pumping half of what the engine requires of fuel but my experience with auto's tells me it should cut out at some point, but does not. Any other idea's would be greatly appreciated?

 

[Reel Pole-tential]

Re: 1986 Evinrude 225 VRO power loss

I HAVE AN 87 225, HAD A SIMULAR PROBLEM. Mine had an intermitant Coil (one dead cylinder will not let you go above 4300 2 3900 and 3 3000) check the coils and the reverse switch diod. If you look on the left side of the engine you should see a little cut out switch attached to likage. This switch cuts the power to 3 cyds when you put it in reverse (problem plaged) and they get stuck some times or the diod goes bad with them leaking energy that was intended for the coils back to the battery...hope this help some...

 

[Joe Reeves]

Re: 1986 Evinrude 225 VRO power loss

Checkmate.... The VRO's when they first came into existence had no warning system, later they added a warning system which consisted of three (3) wires leading from the rear portion of the VRO pump. Unfortunately this three wire system would give a false warning at times.<br /><br />The VRO was then up[dated to a four wire warning system and even that (the VRO) has been improved many times since. Bottom line... if your VRO has only three (3) wires, have the newer type (4 wire) VRO installed.<br /><br />Regardless of what problem you have, first check the compression. It should be in the range of 100+ psi and even on all cylinders. On that model you'll need to have all the spark plugs installed except the cylinder you're checking at the time. Then check the spark, it should jump a 7/16" gap on all cylinders with a strong blue flame.<br /><br />The spark plugs should be Champion QL77JC4 plugs, set at .040 .<br /><br />The stator assy (under the flywheel) is a dual purpose item. The smaller coils pertain to the 35amp charging system. The larger two black coils are the beginning of the ignition system. Due to the extreme heat generated at that area, those black coils will, in time, melt down. This causes a voltage drop to the powerpack and results in faulty ignition. You may be able to see the coils melting down simply be glancing under the flywheel, but usually it's only obvious when the flywheel is remover. Flywheel nut torque is 145 foot pounds.<br /><br />Keep in mind that it's always possible that you've missed something in the carbs, or that a fuel line may be deteriorating, allowing debris to enter the clean carbs. Let us know what you find.

 

[jim dozier]

Re: 1986 Evinrude 225 VRO power loss

I don't know what the problem is but it doesn't sound like you would want to run it alot (you said 2 or 3 tanks) until you fix it. If its a lean cylinder or a dead one that can't be good. Good luck.

 

[Checkmateboy]

Re: 1986 Evinrude 225 VRO power loss

Thanks everyone for your advise! These suggestions are very helpful. I think I am going to replace the stator for sure just because! Its getting old and could very well be a contributor to my issue. <br />R. Jake can you tell me how to test the switch diod? Is it expensive and could I remove it all together? Thinking is it really necessary to cut power to 3 cly. for reverse!<br />I have another question that might be right up Joe Reeves alley since he worked with the VRO's. Joe, how much affect do the VRO's have with the ignition. Meaning can they control spark by retarding the ignition when they think there is an issue? Also is the fuel pump incorporated in the VRO or is it separate? Many people have said to eliminate the VRO, install a high performance fuel pump and mix the gas. Does anyone have advise on this subject?

 

[Joe Reeves]

Re: 1986 Evinrude 225 VRO power loss

Checkmate.... The diode that's been mentioned is actually a shift cutout switch which is attached to the shift linkage on the starboard (right) side of the engine right at the point where the linkage goes under the intake manifold.<br /><br />The purpose of the switch is to momentarily interupt the ignition (so quickly that you'll never notice it) so that the engine can be shifted "out of gear".... either gear. Without that cutout switch, it is very possible that you could encounter a situation whereas you could not get the engine out of gear unless you shut it down (not a good idea). Note that if that switch was bad, you would not be able to obtain the 4000 rpm you mention.<br /><br />The VRO is a dual purpose pump, drawing and pumping both gasoline and oil. It has absolutely nothing to do with the timing, spark control etc etc.

 

[EGalvTex]

Re: 1986 Evinrude 225 VRO power loss

Checkmate, did you rebuild your carbs or just clean them. I have an 88 150 VRO that had a very similar problem. The carbs (3) had to be thouroughly cleaned and rebuilt before the engine would develop any horsepower. There are several ports that can easily remain clogged with varnish although the rest of the carb appears clean. Good Luck !

 

[Reel Pole-tential]

Re: 1986 Evinrude 225 VRO power loss

You can cut the wires to the cyd cut out switch, but I dont recommend it, you can tear up you lower unit if you have to slam into reverse for some reason, thats why the invented it. There are 2 types of switches used, one has an inline diod, the other has a remote one, Its hard to explain just how to get to the remote one. Just follow the wires from the switch and reattach the new switch...goes up to the Power pack (port side)<br />Not all that hard..just sounds like you have an intermitant power loss. Does you Tach dance on you?? could be your rectifier/regulator as well, if it is you need to change that fast.<br /><br />90 % of the problems I have encountered on mine have been electrical...thats why Im leaning towards that area.

 

[Reel Pole-tential]

Re: 1986 Evinrude 225 VRO power loss

Oh, and get rid of that darn VRO and pre-mix, I have seen way to many of those fail and the owner being left with just a hunk of metal....really pre-mix at about 40-1 is perfect. 50 to one is needed if you run WOT all the time, but 40 to one is great for cruise...

 

[Checkmateboy]

Re: 1986 Evinrude 225 VRO power loss

I have a couple more questions for you guys who have removed your VRO. Have you continued to use the fuel pump of the VRO? Or have you found a pump replacement that works great?<br />Has anyone replaced the VRO with a different system of some sort that worked good?

 

[rudeafrican]

Re: 1986 Evinrude 225 VRO power loss

I have to question the post by R. Jake in connection with the VRO and fuel ratios: <br /><br /> ", I have seen way to many of those fail and the owner being left with just a hunk of metal...."<br />-----------------------------------------------<br /><br />I doubt very much if u've personally seen this very much, many of the professional, reputable OMC techs who post on this site and do this for a living will dispute the fact. It has been stated here many times that the number 1 reason for seizing up pistons etc is dirty carb causing a lean condition.<br /><br />"pre-mix at about 40-1 is perfect. 50 to one is needed if you run WOT all the time, but 40 to one is great for cruise..."<br />-------------------------------------------------<br /><br />By mixing 40 -1 you are running way to much oil for cruising conditions ie 40 parts of fuel to 1 part of oil. You'll start getting carbon build-up very quickly. 50 -1 is more fuel, less oil and you recommend this for W.O.T, doesn't make sense.<br /><br />50 - 1 is factory recommended for this motor, I would stick with it.<br /><br /> There is a lot of hype/hysteria about to VRO or not to VRO with a lot of people having wide ranging views on this topic. Checkmate should research the topic and make up his own mind. I run 12 year old rudes with vro without any hassles. Just do my maintanance regularly. After filling my tanks 3 or 4 times there is no ways I'm gonna know what oil ratio I have.<br /><br />Just my 2 cents worth<br /><br />

 

[Joe Reeves]

Re: 1986 Evinrude 225 VRO power loss

Checkmate.... The folowing may be of some interest to you.<br /><br />(VRO Pump Conversion To Straight Fuel Pump)<br /><br />You can convert the VRO pump into a straight fuel pump, eliminating the oil tank and VRO pump warning system, but retain the overheat warning setup by doing the following:<br /><br />1 - Cut and plug the oil line at the engine so that the oil side of the VRO pump will not draw air into its system. Trace the wires from the back of the VRO to its rubber plug (electrical plug) and disconnect it.<br /><br />2 - Trace the two wires from the oil tank to the engine, disconnect those two wires, then remove them and the oil tank.<br /><br />3 - Mix the 50/1 oil in the proper amount with whatever quanity fuel you have. Disconnect the fuel line at the engine. Pump the fuel primer bulb until fuel exits that hose with the tint of whatever oil you used. Reconnect the fuel hose.<br /><br />That's it. If you want to test the heat warning system to ease your mind, have the key in the on position, then ground out the tan heat sensor wire that you'll find protruding from the cylinder head. The warning horn should sound off.

 

[Checkmateboy]

Re: 1986 Evinrude 225 VRO power loss

Thanks to all for your help, controversial yes, but very helpful with opening up my thinking. Hats off to the site owners!