Hi all.
Thomas from Sweden here. I turn to you you guys in US because I guess that the knowledgebase is broader "there" than here in Europe.
Background:
I bought a 5 m (sorry for using metric system
) with an 1978 Mercury 80 hp outboard. I did the classical misstake to trust the guy who sold it plus only teststarted it on land. He said that it works fine in water but could be a bit "crancky" when it was warm. This was OK I though because 2 strokes needs TLC now and then.
I put into water and started it up. When I put in the gear it died instantly. I restarted again and it died instantly. I continue until the battery was finished then I took up the boat at trailed it home.
One might think now - why not give the boat back and get the money back but I have been seraching for this boat for so long so I felt that I will do a look over first and then take decision.
"Look over" - problem/issues found.
- Wrong sparks - fixed
- Hole in the diaphram (fuel pump) - fixed
- Misaligned butterflies in carbs - fixed
- Dry and broken fuel lines - fixed (all hoses)
- Bad impeller - fixed. (during measurements the temp is between 45 - 55 C depending on where I measure)
- Water coming into cylinder 3 and 4 - fixed. (A worn down exhaust plate - no leakage anymore)
- Dirt in tank - fixed (A new tank).
- Poor primer bulb - fixed
- Dirt in fuel filter - fixed.
Other info:
- All coils are measured and within spec.
- Realinged the Timing pointer to .464. At idle the timing is at 2-3 degrees BTDC
- Readjusted the max advance to 26 BTDC (spec 27 but it is safer to be on the "lower" side)
- Compression is measured: Cylinder 1 = 121 PSI (8,6 bar), Cylinder 2 = 131 psi (9 bar), Cylinder 3 = 130 psi (9 bar), Cylinder 4 = 127 psi (8.8 bar).
- The primer bulb get rock solid after 3-4 pumps. No leakage.
- Readjusted the trigger screw so it is within spec before first carb pick up.
- Set the idle screws according to spec (i.e a bit "fater" mixture on idle. NOTE! I have not installed the RPM gauge yet)
- The carbs are cleaned; pick apart, soak in gasoline, ultrasonic cleaning drying with pressurized air and reinstalled).
- In N there is no problem to rotate the propellar.
- The gear engages nice and easy FWD and REV
Things that I cannot check/do yet:
- Still waiting for my RPM gauge. So I cannot set the correct idle rpm. At the moment only by listening (fingerspitzgephul)
- Tune idle settings in water (because it dies when in gear at idle)
Other notes:
- When I use the MerControl the thrttle lever raises slowly the more I move the throttle/gear lever. Eventually the throttle/gear lever stops and I need to push down the throttle lever to continue.
- The prop has small damages here and there and will be replaced if I solve my issues.
So here I am. I have been around in Swedish/european forums and Youtube but I do not get any longer now.
I can run the boat/motor by first engage the gear and then neutral and restart then it works. I guess it depends on that the boat have some fwd momentum from the first trial. Same if I first use my electrical motor and give the boat some momentum fdw then it works.
Then it runs like a charm, with one exeption which I address soon. All from idle up to WOT. No problems - it goes through the whole curve without any hesitations and I reach 30-32 knots. I can run it on low speed for 15 min without any tendency to blogg or missfire. It is very responsive on throttle.
BUT if I go down to idle it starts to blogg and eventual stop if you do not go to N, after 10-20 sec. But it is no problem to have it on idle without gear.
I have tested to set the idle rpm "high" and "low" and then turn each individual idle speed needles in 1/10 step. From lean to very very rich mixture (so far that the engine eventual cannot be started).
I have played with the trigger screw but all with same result - it dies when I put in gear. One note though. The more I turn out the idle screws the longer the propellar revs before stop i.e it feels "better" from the dying perspective the fater I make the mixture until it does not start. If I have "normal" setting it starts very easy but the more I turn out the needles the harder it gets to start. Eventually i need to use the choke.
If I move the advance arm slowly the rev go up which it should. i can not find any position that it starts to show any sign of a fault from 2 BTDC - 28 BTDC.
I have a small youtube vid here (the idle rpm is a bit high): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4evkl7kQRw4&t=1s
Suggestions I have gotten so far to test is:
- Check the airneedles so they are not "drilled" to a bigger diameter by previous owner (some do that in Sweden when they have problem)
- Some tuning issue gear/throttle cable at the MerControl. Question? When you put in gear - should the throttle cable also move a bit so you change the pre advance to compensate for the "load" from the prop?
- Air leakage at the intake at the cylinder/carb interface (i.e poor gasket between carb/cylinder).
- Still dirt in the carbs - why? because some people think that if it gets "stronger" when I turn out the idle needles then that is an indication on fuel shortage at idle?
So! I am sure that there must be some guys out there in your great land - the home of mercury that would react like - Ahhh! I have seen this before - that can give me suggestions
I am a hobby repair guy on my cars and I have never been beaten before in my life but now I am starting to feel "beaten" by a "simple" 2 -stroke
I can always buy a new engine but I belive in recycling but outermost - I like old engines and it fits designwise perfect for my boat plus that I am still skeptical towards japanese engines (no pun intended to you who disagree)
Take care.
/T
Thomas from Sweden here. I turn to you you guys in US because I guess that the knowledgebase is broader "there" than here in Europe.
Background:
I bought a 5 m (sorry for using metric system
) with an 1978 Mercury 80 hp outboard. I did the classical misstake to trust the guy who sold it plus only teststarted it on land. He said that it works fine in water but could be a bit "crancky" when it was warm. This was OK I though because 2 strokes needs TLC now and then.I put into water and started it up. When I put in the gear it died instantly. I restarted again and it died instantly. I continue until the battery was finished then I took up the boat at trailed it home.
One might think now - why not give the boat back and get the money back but I have been seraching for this boat for so long so I felt that I will do a look over first and then take decision.
"Look over" - problem/issues found.
- Wrong sparks - fixed
- Hole in the diaphram (fuel pump) - fixed
- Misaligned butterflies in carbs - fixed
- Dry and broken fuel lines - fixed (all hoses)
- Bad impeller - fixed. (during measurements the temp is between 45 - 55 C depending on where I measure)
- Water coming into cylinder 3 and 4 - fixed. (A worn down exhaust plate - no leakage anymore)
- Dirt in tank - fixed (A new tank).
- Poor primer bulb - fixed
- Dirt in fuel filter - fixed.
Other info:
- All coils are measured and within spec.
- Realinged the Timing pointer to .464. At idle the timing is at 2-3 degrees BTDC
- Readjusted the max advance to 26 BTDC (spec 27 but it is safer to be on the "lower" side)
- Compression is measured: Cylinder 1 = 121 PSI (8,6 bar), Cylinder 2 = 131 psi (9 bar), Cylinder 3 = 130 psi (9 bar), Cylinder 4 = 127 psi (8.8 bar).
- The primer bulb get rock solid after 3-4 pumps. No leakage.
- Readjusted the trigger screw so it is within spec before first carb pick up.
- Set the idle screws according to spec (i.e a bit "fater" mixture on idle. NOTE! I have not installed the RPM gauge yet)
- The carbs are cleaned; pick apart, soak in gasoline, ultrasonic cleaning drying with pressurized air and reinstalled).
- In N there is no problem to rotate the propellar.
- The gear engages nice and easy FWD and REV
Things that I cannot check/do yet:
- Still waiting for my RPM gauge. So I cannot set the correct idle rpm. At the moment only by listening (fingerspitzgephul)
- Tune idle settings in water (because it dies when in gear at idle)
Other notes:
- When I use the MerControl the thrttle lever raises slowly the more I move the throttle/gear lever. Eventually the throttle/gear lever stops and I need to push down the throttle lever to continue.
- The prop has small damages here and there and will be replaced if I solve my issues.
So here I am. I have been around in Swedish/european forums and Youtube but I do not get any longer now.
I can run the boat/motor by first engage the gear and then neutral and restart then it works. I guess it depends on that the boat have some fwd momentum from the first trial. Same if I first use my electrical motor and give the boat some momentum fdw then it works.
Then it runs like a charm, with one exeption which I address soon. All from idle up to WOT. No problems - it goes through the whole curve without any hesitations and I reach 30-32 knots. I can run it on low speed for 15 min without any tendency to blogg or missfire. It is very responsive on throttle.
BUT if I go down to idle it starts to blogg and eventual stop if you do not go to N, after 10-20 sec. But it is no problem to have it on idle without gear.
I have tested to set the idle rpm "high" and "low" and then turn each individual idle speed needles in 1/10 step. From lean to very very rich mixture (so far that the engine eventual cannot be started).
I have played with the trigger screw but all with same result - it dies when I put in gear. One note though. The more I turn out the idle screws the longer the propellar revs before stop i.e it feels "better" from the dying perspective the fater I make the mixture until it does not start. If I have "normal" setting it starts very easy but the more I turn out the needles the harder it gets to start. Eventually i need to use the choke.
If I move the advance arm slowly the rev go up which it should. i can not find any position that it starts to show any sign of a fault from 2 BTDC - 28 BTDC.
I have a small youtube vid here (the idle rpm is a bit high): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4evkl7kQRw4&t=1s
Suggestions I have gotten so far to test is:
- Check the airneedles so they are not "drilled" to a bigger diameter by previous owner (some do that in Sweden when they have problem)
- Some tuning issue gear/throttle cable at the MerControl. Question? When you put in gear - should the throttle cable also move a bit so you change the pre advance to compensate for the "load" from the prop?
- Air leakage at the intake at the cylinder/carb interface (i.e poor gasket between carb/cylinder).
- Still dirt in the carbs - why? because some people think that if it gets "stronger" when I turn out the idle needles then that is an indication on fuel shortage at idle?
So! I am sure that there must be some guys out there in your great land - the home of mercury that would react like - Ahhh! I have seen this before - that can give me suggestions
I am a hobby repair guy on my cars and I have never been beaten before in my life but now I am starting to feel "beaten" by a "simple" 2 -stroke
I can always buy a new engine but I belive in recycling but outermost - I like old engines and it fits designwise perfect for my boat plus that I am still skeptical towards japanese engines (no pun intended to you who disagree
)Take care.
/T