200 1998 oceanpro lost power

[daselbee]

Re: 200 1998 oceanpro lost power

Your suspicions are well founded.
If I could pester you a little more.
Does the firing mark go in order 1-2-3......
round the flywheel CCW?
What is the firing order?

Motor turns clockwise, so TDC for #2 should be 60 degrees counterclockwise on the top of the flywheel from the mark for TDC for #1. And so on for the rest.

Yes firing order is 1-2-3-4-5-6.

 

[interd0g]

Re: 200 1998 oceanpro lost power

OK on that. Thanks - I can now see how to do it.
I can't wait to find out what's really going on here.
I will keep the board posted.

 

[SparkieBoat]

Re: 200 1998 oceanpro lost power

I am curious to know what happens. Has the motor ever been run hot? or anything else significant begin the low power problem?? also while running the motor at WOT do a visual on all carbs.you are looking for the same spray pattern on all carbs..get someone else to drive..LOL..also check to make sure the reeds are sealing, if you notice fuel splashing out of one or more of your carbs,,could be a stuck reed. is all of your linkage ok?? anything broken or loose?? Is the timing advance lever moving in sync with the carb linkage?? it would be odd for your timing to be off on only one cylinder..but possible if a power pack was shorted or something. also are your wires going from power pack to coils in the proper order?? I think blue stripe is on top then green, I am not sure, but I will check mine tomorrow. they should be the same on both sides anyway. just trying to cover all the bases.

 

[interd0g]

Re: 200 1998 oceanpro lost power

Following all these suggestions I eliminated some things.
For the cylinder which seemed not to be pulling it's weight I interchanged coils with a good one - no change.
Then I put in a spare p/pack I had lying around. No change except after that
It would sometimes stall when idling with a 'kick back' in the reverse direction.

I'm sure I could never get the flywheel off but this one has a lot of holes around the periphery and looking in there I see what looks like a ring of things attached to the inner rim ( magnets?) but with a gap of 1 - 1/2 inches with no things.
This is in line with some suggestions which have been made here and elsewhere.

Can this be the dreaded detached magnet scenario?

I have got someone coming tomorrow who may be able to remove the fly.
Does this mean a new fly and collateral damage in there?

 

[daselbee]

Re: 200 1998 oceanpro lost power

You are not supposed to have 1.5 inches of gap on the inner rim of the flywheel where the magnets are attached. There is a small gap between each magnet, maybe 1/4 inch or so, but not 1.5 inches. Maybe one magnet is missing.

Tons of posts here on flywheel removal...read em.

 

[interd0g]

Re: 200 1998 oceanpro lost power

Thanks - I found a lot of advice on flywheels.
Just one more thing.......I found an item 'magnet replacement kit' 0584304 on several sites but the entries don't have a description or picture.
Does any one know what's included in this kit?
I also saw a kit 35R which had stuff but NO MAGNETS ....... I think fixing clips.
I have to import everything. Its very slow and the duty and shipping are enormous.
So I always worry about getting it right first time.

 

[jonesg]

Re: 200 1998 oceanpro lost power

probably hi temp slow epoxy.

 

[dingbat]

Re: 200 1998 oceanpro lost power

We chased symptoms very similar to yours except my intermittent miss on #5 didn't start until you got over 5K rpm.

Removed the flywheel to take a look underneath. Nothing found. Put the motor back together and the miss moved to the #2 cylinder. Removed the flywheel, reinstalled and the miss moved back to #5. Nothing wrong with the flywheel that we could find. Picked up a used flywheel. Fixed the problem, what ever it was.

 

[interd0g]

Re: 200 1998 oceanpro lost power

Yes. I wish I had known you could SEE the magnets without removing the flywheel. I got around to seriously looking only after trying everything else.
I my case you can easily see the gap where one magnet used to be. Must have caused a mess thrashing around in there. I can't get a puller here in less than a month so I have to get some one to get it off for me.
Its the downside of living in "paradise"!

 

[SparkieBoat]

Re: 200 1998 oceanpro lost power

yours have the 5 bolts on top right?? No puller needed. Get a buddy to get on one side and you on the other and carefully pry it up..it is mostly only the magnets that hold it after the bolts are out.

 

[interd0g]

Re: 200 1998 oceanpro lost power

Negativo on that. No bolts on this model. Three threaded holes for a puller.
From accounts on this board this is a desperate pull. Hardened pro's have taken weeks to pull this type flywheel.
Scouring the island for a suitable puller.
Likewise the special bolts. Chandleries here have a few fastenings but no special grade bolts.
Three "mechanics" so far have looked and left, never to return.
So I may end up importing a puller from one supplier, bolts form another and then after getting it off, importing whatever is broken in there.
This show will run and run.
Anyone know the exact bolt and thread type on the 1998 Oceanpro 200 B200TXECM? flywheel? Any online store for bolts like that?
The book does not specify.
On the positive side I can see exactly why one cylinder does not fire.

 

[interd0g]

Re: 200 1998 oceanpro lost power

I found a 'universal puller ' model 781 on a couple of sites. Anyone used one of these?
I also saw an interesting item- magnet mounting kit comprising 6 lokks like plasitc clips with screws 35 RK
Snyone used?

 

[SparkieBoat]

Re: 200 1998 oceanpro lost power

this is the one I use, I think I had to get the grade 8 bolts separately even though it did come with a good selection of bolts.
http://search.harborfreight.com/cpisearch/web/search.do?keyword=harmonic+puller&Submit=Go

 

[interd0g]

Re: 200 1998 oceanpro lost power

Latest episode - I found a guy who said he could get my flywheel off and who actually showed up.
He didn't have a 1 7/16 wrench or 5/16 x24 screws but luckily , earlier that morning I had found and bought the last three 5/16 X 24's on the island, anticipating the problem. ( I've lived here a long long time).
I had a 1 7/16 but only the plumbers box wrench type.
He got the nut off with screwdriver and mallet while I was off buying him a beer.
The fly came off easily
Anyhow, all the magnets were loose, hanging there by there own powers of attraction. One was found on the pole piece of the stator.Two were chipped.
Once loose ,they all bunched up together with no gaps around the flywheel inner, leaving the one large gap I had seen from outside.
Surprisingly under the circumstances it ran pretty well in this condition except with one cylinder not firing, the wot power was drastically reduced.
Charging and timing were still OK. The stator poles show a bit of rust here and there bit no scratches or dings.
I'm thinking of using those clips on the magnets this time to avoid this happening again.

 

[jonesg]

Re: 200 1998 oceanpro lost power

Good to see you got it figured out.

 

[interd0g]

Re: 200 1998 oceanpro lost power

Thanks all for the help. I re-attached all the loose magnets and think it was a good job. i verified the right pole ends by looking for the mark at the corners and confirmed with a compass. Spacing was exact. Put it back on. Low power!.
much the same.
I did a few checks - strong strong sparks, idle timing ( i now have a light) but not wot timing. The Reeves method doesn't work with my light for some reason.
Its an old one with direct connection to a spark lead.. The view doesn't make any senses when cranking, but works fine when running.
Try hanging over the back with timing light in the open Atlantic with a strong trade wind!
I have a new p/pack in there.
I am going to recheck more carefully tomorrow.
Dingbat - how did you figure out #5 was misfiring at high rpm??????

 

[dingbat]

Re: 200 1998 oceanpro lost power

Dingbat - how did you figure out #5 was misfiring at high rpm??????

Had a spark test "tree". Ran it in the tank with the lights out.

 

[interd0g]

Re: 200 1998 oceanpro lost power

Sorry dingbat - not familiar with a spark test tree.
I would like a way to quickly test for a spark without keep stopping the engine and moving cables or removing pugs.
There must be something like a small neon bulb or something you could hold there leaving everything connected.
I think i may have a new problem and the loose misplaced magnets were the original problem.
I had changed the p/pack during this whole thing.
On retesting everything I had no spark on #1. I eased off the p/pack to take a look at the mess of cables and connector under there and - the problem moved to #4. So I re made all the connectors over again, tight and with a little vaseline and i think I have all 6 now - sea trial tomorrow.

 

[interd0g]

Re: 200 1998 oceanpro lost power

If anyone has seen this to the end, here is the final installment!
The magnet WAS the problem.
Unfortunately during the job when I changed out the p/pack, the connectors didn't mate well and I once again lost one cylinder .The exact cylinder changed around in an intermittent way.
With a cylinder out, the sea trial was exactly like before.
I re mated the connectors with a little vaseline and now all seems well.
Thanks again to all involved.

 

[SparkieBoat]

Re: 200 1998 oceanpro lost power

good news...glad to hear you solved your problem...outboard motor repair can really get frustrating sometimes..I have almost seen every possible thing that could go wrong with an outboard now..but I am sure I will soon run across a new one too. It really becomes a problem when you've got more than 1 thing wrong or have something arbitrary happen like a bad plug connection. Happy boating and dont catch all the fish in the sea save some for me.