good pair of crimpers

[guido469]

There was a post a few months ago about crimpers but i cant find it. Anyone able to point me to it? thanks

 

[sbklf]

Re: good pair of crimpers

Sta-Kon pliers.
http://www.drillspot.com/products/66552/Sta-Kon_WT111M_Crimping_Plier

 

[sbklf]

Re: good pair of crimpers

Throw the crimpers away and buy a decent soldering iron and some shrink tube.

Crimp connectors introduce a different metal (usually steel) and that immediately begins the corrosion process and they WILL fail at some point, its just a matter of when.

I call BS. Steel crimp terminals? (Never seen any). Or are you talking about galvanic corrosion due to dissimilar metals? Crimp terminals (butt splices, ring terminals etc...) are copper with a tin or silver plating like marine wire. Some time the lack of strain relief at the connection will cause failure from fatigue and some failures are from crimping too tight which cuts strands in the wire but crimp connectors make for a good connection. What do you propose for the connections where you do not have a choice and must use connectors (gauges, switches, terminal blocks)?

Open connections that are subject to getting wet just don't hold up. I would agree solder and heat shrink tube makes for a good connection and have done it many times myself. However, unless you use shrink tube that has the sealant inside, even the seal with heat shrink tube alone is not the best. My method has evolved to a combination of the two; in areas that will not be submerged I use non insulated butt splices then solder (without flux since some flux is acid based) and then heat shrink. On connections that get dunked like trailer wiring, I put a couple coats of liquid electrical tape on the joint and heat shrink over that before the last coat cures. The liquid tape oozes out the ends and makes for a pretty good seal.

The best way to preserve a connection is to keep it dry.

 

[bruceb58]

Re: good pair of crimpers

Crimp only is best. If you use good a quality crimper and good quality connections, you don't need or want to solder.

I also use a Sta-kon

They are pricey but can be picked up on E-Bay in the $60 or $70 range used
http://www.oelsales.com/product.cfm/142/

Here is a good blog from another site
http://www.sailnet.com/forums/gear-...or-vs-3m-heat-shrink-adhesive-connectors.html

 

[bruceb58]

Re: good pair of crimpers

Crimp connectors introduce a different metal (usually steel) and that immediately begins the corrosion process and they WILL fail at some point, its just a matter of when.

I think you are quite confused. The metal is always tinned copper. Yes it looks like silver but that is the tinning on top of the copper.

 

[bruceb58]

Re: good pair of crimpers

There is a reason a soldered connection is not allowed in the aviation, boat and automotive market. It is becuase a soldered connection can eventually break because the solder forms a rigid connection. The picture you show shows a corroded spade connector. The connection part is the one that is giving the problem. The actual crimped connection to the wire is not.

I can't even begin to count the times I've had to find electrical issues and in the end it was a corroded crimped connector.

True if the person that does the crimp doesn't use the proper tool or connector. i have seen some equally poor solder jobs.

 

[achris]

Re: good pair of crimpers

I work in the offshore oil and gas industry. I work specifically on ROVs (underwater robots). For ALL our underwater connections we solder, heatshrink, then use a form of 'liquid tape' called Scotchcoat, then self-amalgamating tape, then normal plastic tape, and I like to finally finish with adhesive lined heat shrink over the lot.... I've seen these joints at over 1000m (3000') and with 120V and NEVER leak.

On my boat? For instrumentation I use heatshrink over crimps. For wet areas I use solder and double heat shrink....

Chris.........

 

[Fl_Richard]

Re: good pair of crimpers

I MUST agree with Bruce here.

Sealed heat shrink and a crimp will outlast a solder joint every time in wet or dry environments. Think of all the people who cant solder well or first timers coupled with the need to precisely seal the connection and I bet every time the crimp will win. Even with crappy crimpers (crimping pliers) the glue will hold the connection together. With good crimpers and a lighter you can make a connection that will practically outlive the wire.

 

[funk6294]

Re: good pair of crimpers

Like a set of these???

http://www.lowes.com/pd_30891-72068-KP1022D_4294821046_4294937087?productId=3128535&pl=1&currentURL=/pl_Wire%2BStrippers,%2BCrimpers%2B_4294821046_4294937087_

 

[Fl_Richard]

Re: good pair of crimpers

Perfect! - Works on wire down to about 10 - lower than that big bucks for specialty crimps

 

[bruceb58]

Re: good pair of crimpers

I have also been an electrical engineer for the past 28 years. Have worked automotive, military and commercial. None of the products that we have sold have EVER used solder on a connector. Basically, it is NEVER allowed.


http://www.anchoralaska.com/2003ANCORcatalog.pdf

Do you recommend soldering or crimping terminals?
ANCOR recommends crimping vs. soldering. Per ABYC standards (E-8.15.19) and (E-9.17.12.8), ?Solder
shall not be the sole means of mechanical connection in any circuit?. Further, crimping provides a solid
mechanical connection resistant to ?cold joints?, breaking under fatigue and removes strain when using
ANCOR double crimp nylon connectors.

 

[achris]

Re: good pair of crimpers

I have been an electronics tech on ROVs for the past 19 years, and a computer engineer for the 10 years before that (also 3 years as a marine dealer in amongst it) and soldering is the recommended method, if you can solder properly.

Bruce... You quoted the ??? whatever.. as saying that a mechanical joint was preferred over soldering... I will tell you straight, it appears you don't know how to solder properly.

A proper solder joint is a mechanical joint first... Anyone who just puts 2 bits of wire next to each other and solders them doesn't know how to solder.... I can assure you, that PROPER solder joints DO NOT fatigue and fall apart....

End of discussion!

Chris.......

Edit: Just had a look at your link.... Doh! Of course ANCOR are going to recommend crimping.... They sell crimps!!!

I have also been an electrical engineer for the past 28 years. Have worked automotive, military and commercial. None of the products that we have sold have EVER used solder on a connector. Basically, it is NEVER allowed.

That's funny... because the guy who taught me to solder was ex-air force, and that's ALL they were allowed to use....

 

[made in china]

Re: good pair of crimpers

I suggest using Sta-Kon or Klein tools.

Almost any tools at Lowe's or HD is Chinese made, especially Greenlee. Spend a little more money on American made tools.

For me (previously ASE auto mechanic, FAA electronics tech and now Traffic Signal tech) I would go ahead and use either crimp or solder. BUT, you must use good quality wire and connectors. Match the proper terminal size to the wire and application. Also, with either crimp or solder, finish the job with ADHESIVE LINED heat shrink. What you want is to avoid any moisture entry.
Just like the guy who works on ROV's (under water) we also use 3M Scothkote to prevent water entry in Traffic Signal wiring. Water entry is bad, even if you have a great solder job, water will wick in between the insulation and wire conductor and some form of corrosion will begin. With copper wire, green crystals will grow, and we've had wire break way back in the insulation from this wicking corrosion.
You just want to keep water out. Adhesive lined heat shrink, properly sized and applied is a good, fast and relatively low cost way to make a water tight connection in a boat. Remember, also use good connectors. We use T&B and Sta-Kon, both are either made in Japan or USA and are very good quality.

 

[rjwoodrome]

Re: good pair of crimpers

Lots of ways to complete a task.
Found a solderless connector with an antioxidizer agent and also had a heat shrink skirt too. best thing is they are quick and reliable.
now im no engineer. but these things work great. for average applications, and are available at your local electrical supplier. always try to buy American made if at all possable.

 

[bruceb58]

Re: good pair of crimpers

Bruce... You quoted the ??? whatever.. as saying that a mechanical joint was preferred over soldering... I will tell you straight, it appears you don't know how to solder properly.

I solder very well as a matter of fact. Most of my recent experience is soldering under a microscope with 0.5mm pitch components but done my fair share of soldering through the years on all types of applications.

The problem is in a high vibration environment. If you don't have vibrations, its not an issue. Problem is the solder wicks up the wire and creates a rigid joint that can break over time if it receives enough vibration.

I have tons of experience with soldering in the manufacturing environmnet so I am very familiar with what can and does go wrong. Did a lot of vib testing of missiles on the bellys of F-15s to see what comes loose!

 

[achris]

Re: good pair of crimpers

.... Problem is the solder wicks up the wire and creates a rigid joint that can break over time if it receives enough vibration.....

And a crimp isn't a rigid joint??? I haven't seen one I can bend yet...

I've seen more 'cold' joints from crimps than I have from solder....

 

[bruceb58]

Re: good pair of crimpers

If you have a connection where the wire has the solder wicked up it, the wire becomes the weakest link.

 

[dingbat]

Re: good pair of crimpers

Regardless of what makes a better connection, the American Boat & Yacht Council demands a specific method of attachment. Anything other than specified is regarded as out of compliance and is subject to recall and or / loss of your ABYC manufacturing certification.

ABYC develops safety standards for the design, construction, equipage, maintenance, and repair of small craft and their systems. The development of uniform standards is the basis for industry-wide comparisons of products and performance. As a result of strong industry support, ABYC's standards program is a viable alternative to further development of mandatory government regulation of the marine industry.

In lawsuits involving product liability, ABYC standards are a reliable and authoritative reference for evaluation issues of design, construction, maintenance, and product performance.

 

[jimg984]

Re: good pair of crimpers

i gonna use some BIG black wire nuts

 

[klicknative]

Re: good pair of crimpers

Beldon makes good crimpers, avalabile at NAPA. Kliens are realy good, Sears and Home Depot carries them.