Winterizing: Outdrive In A Tub Of "Red Pop"?

[SEMIJim]

Good Day,

Hope this doesn't come-across as beating a dead horse , but...

We have a new-to-us (as of last July) 18' power-boat with a 4.3L V6 (4 bbl) MerCruiser with Alpha 1 outdrive. We're in S.E. Michigan and it's That Time Of Year again .

We also own a 30' Pearson P30 sailboat, which has the venerable Atomic 4.

To winterize the A4, I remove the thermostat, pinch-off the bypass, move the raw water intake to a bucket full of "red pop" (I use the lower-temp-rated purple stuff, to be safe), fire up the engine, wait until The Admiral sees purple coming out the exhaust, and fog the engine to a stop. Then I open the four block and manifold drain plugs.

Easy.

Now the MerCruiser has no convenient raw water intake hose with which I can duplicate that process, and muffs don't strike me as being 100% effective. I've read every thread I can find on the subject of winterizing these beasts. (Yes, incl. your's, Don S.) Taking it all in, it seems to me the most thorough method would be:

1. Drain as much water as possible, wire-out the holes, re-install the plugs
2. Plant the outdrive in a big bucket of "red pop"
3. Fire her up and let her run until she's been at operating temperature for a bit, ensuring the thermostat has cycled several times
4. Fog the engine to a stop
5. Remove the drain plugs again
6. Store the "red pop" for next fall

It seems to me this procedure would be the one most likely to get as much water out of the system as possible and make sure any areas not inclined to drain fully would have any water displaced by anti-freeze. As an added bonus: It'll probably cost you only a gallon or so of replacement anti-freeze each fall. As another added bonus: Now the oil's nice and warmed-up for the oil change.

Comments?

 

[Bt Doctur]

Re: Winterizing: Outdrive In A Tub Of "Red Pop"?

Considering the drive should be remove for proper service, it really should be done. Once the motor has been fogged untill it stalls, remove block and manifold drains, probe to make sure it does drain .reinstall drains, remove large hose from top of therm housing (other end goes to the eng circ pump) and pour the A/F into the block untill it comes out the top, reinstall hose, remove both manifold hoses and do the same thing untill it comes out the back of the boat.

 

[scipper77]

Re: Winterizing: Outdrive In A Tub Of "Red Pop"?

overkill in my opinion (not necessarily a bad thing). I fog->drain block ->disconnect hoses and pour "pop" into them -> drain "pop".

If you have solid brass plugs going into your steel manifolds at the top of the motor I would leave them in for winter (after draining). The first year I winterized I left them out and the rust that formed made the thread unusable. I had to borrow a NPT tap and make new threads.

All the other plugs on my motor are brass wing nuts into a brass housing, where the brass housing goes into the block. Just remove the wing nuts and leave them out for those plugs.

Don't forget to drain the power steering cooler (if you have P/S).

 

[JustJason]

Re: Winterizing: Outdrive In A Tub Of "Red Pop"?

Your order is a little off... Do this instead

1. fire up the engine and let it run for 5 minutes.
2. change the engine oil and filter
3. fire it up again and make sure your lube job isn't leaking
4. fog the motor until it shuts down or you turn the key off
5. drain the engine and manifolds, use a small screw driver to make sure the openings aren't clogged.
6. pull off the top of the big hose that connects to the water pump, pull any hoses that go to the manifolds, and if you have a power steering cooler, pull that hose as well and drain it.
7. I don't know what "red pop" is. But I use -100F blue antifreeze from mercruiser. Alot of the minus 50 stuff is pink. But I would leave the block just drained if I was not using -100F. With the drain plugs still out, spash a little antifreeze down the hoses untill it comes out the drain holes, keep pouring until it comes out the same color it pretty much goes in as. You will use approx 1/4 gallon for this if you got all the water out. Same procedeure for the manifolds.
8. put all your drain plugs back in. Fill the block via the big hose on the waterpump. Fill the manifolds with via the appropriate hoses. Put all your hoses back on and tighten up the clamps
9. coat everything with anti corrosion spray
10. your done... now on to the drive

 

[Lou C]

Re: Winterizing: Outdrive In A Tub Of "Red Pop"?

I do it pretty much the same way as BtDr and Jason do.....just to clarify one point...some 4.3s have a drain on the intake manifold...square plug that should be removed...and as far as the big hose on the front water circulation pump...remove it at BOTH ends (bottom too) because depending on the angle of the boat it can hold a lot of water...after it all drains...reconnect this hose at the bottom..(water pump end)...then start filling the engine thru this hose till you see a little come out the block drains...then get some marine grease if you have metal drain plugs and put some grease on em...replace the plugs and fill the engine till AF comes out the thermo housing...do the same with the manifolds....and also fill the raw water intake hose till it comes out the drive water intakes....

it's very important to make sure water comes out of EACH drain and use a screw to poke openings to free them of rust...

As far as AF I use -100..the -50/60 stuff slushes up at too high of a temp for me to be comfortable....I leave it in and it keeps air and corrosion causing oxygen out....

And yes remove the drive each year...check the post on the poor guy with a Cobra who didn't take it off for 7 years...he's not having fun now...I do mine every year to check for water in the bellows...check and grease the gimble...ujoints...check the drive input seal for leaking (you woudn't know this because the oil would wind up in the bellows)...I store the drive in the garage and reinstall with a new impeller in the spring....

I really don't understand the fascination people have with sucking AF up the drive....it wastes AF...gets it all over the ground...and can lead to a cracked block with a raw water cooled engine...because the thermo may not open enough to circualte the AF in the block/heads....

Sucking in AF works for engines with closed cooling....ONLY...to winterize the raw water side...not on raw water cooled sterndrives....and...no sterndrive manufacturer ever recommended using AF this way...they (OMC and Merc) recommended ONLY draining and back filling with AF....

 

[SEMIJim]

Re: Winterizing: Outdrive In A Tub Of "Red Pop"?

Thanks for the feedback, everybody.

I think I'm just going to take this bad boy to a local MerCruiser authorized dealer in the area and have them do it. I'm not comfortable with what I'm (not) seeing.

First of all: My "outdrive in a tub of antifreeze" idea won't work for me. Due to the slant of the driveway I have to raise the tongue up so high to get the boat level that I can't lower the outdrive maybe more than half-way down. So that's out, right off.

Secondly: I was just out examining the engine. I found the two block drains. They've been replaced with bronze or brass petcocks. I let the water out of the starboard one, for now, as it was only hand-tight. As for the manifold ones: I found what appear to be plugs on the manifold risers. Can't get 'em out! They're brass or bronze, they're painted-in (this is a rebuilt engine), and all they're doing is peening-over when I try to get them loose. I'm not even certain those are what I want to get out.

As for the power steering pump: I have two lines connected to it. One is definitely going back to the drive. What I assume to be the return line comes from the back, goes into a cylindrical thing in a cooling line on the port side near the bottom of the engine, then another line comes from that, back to the pump. I'm guessing that cylindrical thing is the power steering pump cooler. I see no way to drain that. In another thread, somebody mentioned a plug on the front-left side of the engine as you're facing it from inside the boat (I assume he meant starboard side), near the fuel filter, behind the serpentine belt. I see nothing anywhere near there that looks like a drain plug.

I know my way around engines, a bit. I used to street race, back in the day, and I wrenched on them all the time. But this beast has me stumped.

 

[scipper77]

Re: Winterizing: Outdrive In A Tub Of "Red Pop"?

The plugs that are peening, use a 12 point socket if you can. Any socket should work. I'm guessing the problem you had is because you were using an open ended box wrench or even worse, a crescent wrench.

The power steering cooler will have 2 small hoses on the top or side, and 2 bigger goses on the ends. The smaller hoses are for power steering fluid. Disconnect the larger hoses (water) to drain the cooler.

 

[abw]

Re: Winterizing: Outdrive In A Tub Of "Red Pop"?

I winterize a lot of boats (I own a boat repair shop in north Idaho) we don't use antifreeze. If the engine, hoses and manifolds are drained properly there is no chance of breaking due to cold weather. Also there is no chance of spilling coolant into the water table. Maybe I'm missing something but I just don't see the point of filling the cooling system with any type of liquid.
-Russ

Post Falls, ID

 

[Bondo]

Re: Winterizing: Outdrive In A Tub Of "Red Pop"?

Hope this doesn't come-across as beating a dead horse , but...

Ayuh,.... It Does, because it Is....

I winterize a lot of boats (I own a boat repair shop in north Idaho) we don't use antifreeze. If the engine, hoses and manifolds are drained properly there is no chance of breaking due to cold weather. Also there is no chance of spilling coolant into the water table. Maybe I'm missing something but I just don't see the point of filling the cooling system with any type of liquid.
-Russ

You'll find that you're in the small Majority of Us Russ,...
Those of Us who are In the business, or closely related to it, are In the Know....
We store Dry.... Air just does Not Freeze.....

 

[SEMIJim]

Re: Winterizing: Outdrive In A Tub Of "Red Pop"?

The plugs that are peening, use a 12 point socket if you can. Any socket should work. I'm guessing the problem you had is because you were using an open ended box wrench or even worse, a crescent wrench.

Yeah, an open-ended box wrench. It might be Too Late for one of the two plugs. At this point I'm not going to fool with it anymore. I'm going to let it become a professionals problem this season, before I really muck things up. (Annoys me. All they had to do when painting the damn thing was to remove those plugs, wipe the paint off, and put them back.)

The power steering cooler will have 2 small hoses on the top or side, and 2 bigger goses on the ends. The smaller hoses are for power steering fluid. Disconnect the larger hoses (water) to drain the cooler.

I think I've identified that. Thanks.