Force 125 Problems

[Graybunch7]

I just recently purchased a 1987 Bayliner Capri w/ Force 125 horse on the transom. Got it out just once for a full day but could'nt start motor in water, had to raise it out then start it and kind of jump it into gear so we could go, otherwise it would just die when putting shifter back into neutrul position. Then the starter gave out. One week later new starter came in and installed. New starter having trouble turning over engine, I think the battery is low so I will charge it for a day and see what happens. However, back to the running problem----somebody at a boat repair place told me to "decarbonize" my engine with a can of spray then change the spark plugs. He said that should take care of the starting and idleing problems. A tune-up in a can he said. Is this true? And any thoughts on a motor that still turns over but is to tough for a new starter and batt to turn?

 

[pnwboat]

Re: Force 125 Problems

It's a good idea to check compression to see what kind of shape the rings/cylinders are in. Low compression will affect idle quality and ease of starting. Check compression before and after "decarbonizing" the engine. Readings for each cylinder should be within 10% or so of each other.
Here is a link to an article to "decarbinize" the engine. http://www.iboats.com/bbboard/bbBoard.cgi?a=viewthread;fid=36;gtid=1035563

Carbs may need some work. Best to get a manual for directions on how to do this. They're pretty simple but it's a good idea to read how to do it properly.

As far as the starter issue....sounds like the classic bad or low battery, bad battery cable, or bad battery cable connections.

 

[Graybunch7]

Re: Force 125 Problems

I got the batt charged to full capacity and the boat starts just fine with the dog ears hooked upand the new starter installed. It might be a different story though out on the water because the engine will be submerged and then I think if it doesn't want to start then I have some kind of seal that is bad so too much water is getting in. I hope that it was just old gas the first time out and well see this week-end! Idles fine, starts fine, and runs good-----hopefully the same in open water.

 

[jerryjerry05]

Re: Force 125 Problems

Do a compression test then tell us what it is.Jerry

 

[Graybunch7]

Re: Force 125 Problems

I don't have a way to check for compression right now but there is markings from sombody else who did. top to the bottom it reads 135, 155, 155, 150, 155. I know that the first one is off so we will take care off that in a shop becuase I took it out today and it still dies in the water. then I noticed it looked like water was getting through the engine because after i ran it it had residue in the engine compartment by the carbs---water, fuel, and oil. What might I be looking at? A total rebuild or just some seals replaced? any idea how much this might cost me? In order to run the engine again i lifted it out part way then started it. Then I would gently put it in gear before it had time to cut out, with it in gear going slow was bad rough idle but going fast was ok.

 

[pnwboat]

Re: Force 125 Problems

Need to take a close look at the residue to see what it is. If it is gas/oil mixture, then you may have a float in one of the carbs that is either set too high or the needle valve is sticking or leaking. Does the primer bulb on your fuel line get hard after pumping it up? Do you see any gas leaking out of any of the carbs when you pump it up? If bulb does not get hard or gas leaking from carbs are both indicators that you have a gasket or needle valve problem in the carb(s). This would also explain problems at low speed. Again, a manual explains how to replace the needle valve/gaskets. The carbs are pretty simple, but attention to detail and cleanliness is a must when taking the carbs apart. Carb rebuild kits are cheap, $12 - $18 and includes all the parts needed.

 

[jerryjerry05]

Re: Force 125 Problems

The comp you gave was for 5 cyl. I imagine you wrote one down twice.
The first step in trouble shooting an outboard is a GOOD comp test.
But a guage a good one.
Remove all plugs and push throttle all the way forward.Hook up tester and jump 1-4 cyl and write them down. If you get more than 10-15 # difference. There is a problem.
If you have bad comp it can push fuel back thru the carbs, cause backfire,hard starting and more.
Do a comp test and get back.Old #s can't be trusted.Jerry

 

[Graybunch7]

Re: Force 125 Problems

I found today that the water pump seal has been blown out and was lodged in the water escape tube (two little holes on the back of the motor) the water pump is not working at all and the water intake is probably blocked with mud or something, which is probably why the motor keeps dying in the water. I ran it real quick and found no water coming out the two holes at all!!! I'm putting it in the shop june 4th because I don't have the proper tools to remove the lower part of the motor. The tech said it would probably cost around 300 bucks to fix it. labor will be 105 an hour and probably 50 bucks in parts. Does that sound about right? when it is in there i figure he can do a compression check as well.

 

[baxtr]

Re: Force 125 Problems

most expensive tool needed to remove your lower unit is a $30 repair manual + your time.

 

[gregmsr]

Re: Force 125 Problems

graybunch, don't pay 300$ for this. Go to Wallyworld and get a cheap 3/8 socket set and do it yourself. We can walk you through this.

 

[Graybunch7]

Re: Force 125 Problems

I went down to the repair shop that I WAS going to take it to. They said its pretty easy to drop the gear box and check the water pump so i did----pretty sure its bad, the dam thing wont turn at all!!! And also gonna get a new exaust boot with spacer and spring. then after that it should be ok but i will still get to the compression eventually. New water pump kit-75, new boot and spring-25. a hundred bucks and I'm doin it myself!!YEAH!!! I AM ALL THAT IS MAN!!!! ok ill shut up now..

 

[NFA]

Re: Force 125 Problems

Good for you Gray! I love tinkering around on my Force, when possible. I'm no mechanic at all, but there's something about outboards where I enjoy looking around and see what I can do to improve the performance, etc.

My next personal challenge is a carb clean. My carbs are "okay" right now, but cleaning them out only takes a little while and is quite easy. I've got the manual, just need the time and parts.

 

[Graybunch7]

Re: Force 125 Problems

Ok, I took it out this week-end and guess what----------The sucker ran fine!!!!!!!!!!!!! It was just dying when I put the motor in the water because of the exuast leak coming from the rubber boot that was torn. Thank the maker's of duct tape!! SO-- the real replacement part will be here this coming friday and then I will be done messing with this thing for now. New starter, new water-pump, and new exuast boot. next project, getting a comp gauge and checking the compression.

 

[Graybunch7]

Re: Force 125 Problems

Does anyone know how the exuast boot is assembled? The spacer goes where? i'm guessing towards the exit hole but I don't want to mess things up.

 

[azlakes]

Re: Force 125 Problems

Does anyone know how the exuast boot is assembled? The spacer goes where? i'm guessing towards the exit hole but I don't want to mess things up.

Hiya Gray-

Here is a conversation I had with Frank on this topic. This may shed some light. I have not replaced mine so if you can say where you got yours from be most appreciated. Hope this helps you.

Question. There is a rubber boot between the lower leg housing and two water pump spurt holes that has a leak and small drip. Its held on by a metal squeeze ring and thats it. Is it easy to replace and ok to run with a small drip until replaced? Any tricks to get this on when I buy a new one?

Thanks for any tips!

If it has a hole and is leaking then you want to replace it because it is the idle relief . when the engine is sitting low in the water, exhaust gases pass through it. If the leak gets bad, the exhaust will stall the engine with the hood on. With it off, the engine will run normally.
However, if it is leaking where it enters the rear shroud, then it might just be mis-aligned. It is spring loaded inside and that is what holds it firmly in the tapered seat. Reach down and wiggel it back in. The end of the plug is tapered to match the seat.
If you need to replace it and can't get the clamp off with a pliers, then you will need to remove the rear shroud to get to the clamp. Six screws on the front of the shroud and usually six inside the engine. When I replace the bellows, I use a plastic zip tie or a stainless screw clamp--much better than original.

Oh, yeah. before you buy a bellows, check the old one. Inside the tapered end is a plastic sleeve that the internal spring bears against. Sometimes the sleeve distorts ,not allowing the bellows to seat.

 

[Graybunch7]

Re: Force 125 Problems

Thank you -----that answers all my questions

 

[Graybunch7]

Re: Force 125 Problems

I put in a new bellows is it called? I've been calling it an exaust boot. Anyways, I put the new one in and it leaks water into the compartment there a little bit. The water comes from where the spacer rides against the motor shroud. It seemed to taper off a bit after running it a couple of minutes, is this normal for the new parts to "seat into place" after some use? If it doesn't completly seal up do I need to use some kind of caulk or something? Or does the small trickle of water inside that area not affect the running of the motor? Please put my mind at ease!