An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

JamieScott

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Apr 4, 2008
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28
Hey there - a bit of a long story but it will give you a background this post.

I've hit that stage in life where my wife and I had a baby about 16 months ago and suddenly my dream of having a boat to just get out on the water for a bit of fishing and pottering around has seemed to grow stronger (maybe it's the need to escape every now and again)

Here in Australia twice a year you are allowed to throw your general household garbage out at the side of the road and the council come around to pick it up. Before they do it's kind of a free for all and you can help yourself to anything that you want. This is a dangerous time for anyone who's a bit of a horder as you nearly crash your car while driving along and keeping one eye on the kerb to see what's being thrown out.

I had a joke with some mates that it would be fun to have a challenge to see who could build a boat with some form of motor just from junk found in the council pickup. A few days later while driving along I saw an infatable tender lying there and so pulled in to have a quick look. Apart from a couple of patches where there's some pin holes she seemed good to go so in the back of the car it went. I brought some oars and within a couple of days had her out on the water! Excellent!

Now here's where the outboard comes in... A week later while driving along through another area where they were throwing things out I spotted an outboard motor - NO WAY!! I turned the car round and went back for a look. It's a 6HP Johnson Seahorse 6R 79E (1979 I'm guessing??). It had the complete engine inside but was missing the bottom section with the prop, water pump and drive shaft. Then on the other side of the heap I spied the other bit. My wife said to me "Your not going to pick that up are you?". Silly question! So now from someone who knows a small bit about car engines I've started to try to figure out how to go about testing the thing to see why someone was going to throw it out and why they may have removed the bottom section before throwing it out.

I've had a good look on here and on other internet sites, I've got some books from the library and started to learn about outboards. I'm going to get hold of a compression tester and see what state the two cylinders are in and whether their's a strong spark but as the bottom section has been removed I'm reluctant to try to start her without any water going in.

Finally here's the question "about time!" I hear you cry.

I'm trying to find out what's missing (if anything) so that I can try to get her going again. Inside the leg of the motor there's a pipe coming down which obviously goes into the water pump once you bold it back on. Also theirs the gear selector rod which I can see goes back into the clamp and screws in place but this rod is loose in the leg and you can move it freely up and down. It's not connected at the top I can just see that it has a 90 degree bend at the top of the rod and this is not connected anywhere. Then the gear leaver/selector doesn't seem to be connected to anything in the top section of the engine. It has a small eyelet inside the engine cover where the top of the leaver is which looks like it should be connected to a cable of leaver system. (I hope this is making sense??). I've tried my hardest to see in the books and Clymer Johnson Manual that I've got some sort of diagram to show me how this linkage works but there's nothing I can find. How does this loose rod connect to the gear leaver?? Am I missing some vital part here?

I can take a few pictures and attach them to this message to show you exactly what I mean if that would help.

Thanks for taking the time to read and any help would great!

Jamie
 

JamieScott

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Apr 4, 2008
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Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

Thanks Marc

I had thought that may be a possibility. I was thinking that if I could attach a small pipe to the water pipe going up into the leg then maybe I could just use a normal hose to push water into the engine so I can at least try to start it.

I'm going to try to get hold of a compression tester to see what that's like at least.

Jamie
 

Gary H NC

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Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

It should slide into the shift linkage directly below the carbs.Then a small bolt threads in to hold it in place.Usually get to it from the port side of the motor with a 1/4 inch drive extension with a swivel adapter and socket.
I think thats how most of the curved shift rods connect.Some models have a type of pin that holds it in place.
Some of our Johnson guys should give more detail.
 

jay_merrill

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Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

Part #65, which is the upper shift rod, connects to part #24, the shift rod lever and bushing. That part connect to part #19, which is the gearshift handle, and is held in palce with parts #25 and #26, which are the lever to handle screw and washer.

You may be having trouble trying to figure out how to refasten the shift rod because the only way to access it is to pull the powerhead from the exhaust housing assembly (part #1) and reach the shift handle from the inside of that part, from the top.

I think the first thing that I would do with this motor, however, is to make sure that the pistons/crankshaft are not frozen. Often times this is the problem that makes people throw an outboard away. Try rotating the flywheel by hand by turning it in a clockwise direction when looking from the top of the motor. If it moves you can then go to other checks and repairs. If you decide to move forward, my next advice is for you to put the Clymer manual on the shelf and find an OMC repair manual. The Clymer books try to cover so many models and years that they are practically useless.

Good fixing and make frequent use of this site for questions and advice - there are a lot of very knowledgeable folks here!
 

tashasdaddy

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51,019
Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

yes, you can attach a hose to the water tube, with low pressure, and start the motor. the shift rod in the lower unit should move freely up and down. i believe, up shifts to forward, center neutral, down reverse. move the rod, and turn the prop shaft and the drive shaft should turn.
 

JamieScott

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Apr 4, 2008
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28
Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

Hey again

Thanks for the responses so far - really helpfull.

I've spun the flywheel by hand as you suggested Jay and it seems that it's not siezed as the pistons move freely. There's a strong spark in both the plugs when you crank it over with them earthed to the body and the plugs are fairly new and look clean. Looking into the Cylinders they look oily as expected rather than burned out or milky. I still need to get a compression tester to get an idea of that side but just putting my finger over the plug holes it feels like it's got compression of some sort and maybe equal on both cylinders (Impossible to tell from this I know!). I'm going to get hold of the tester ASAP.

I'm also going to borrow a fuel tank and fuel line from a friend and try getting some water into the top section as Tashasdaddy said would be possible to get it started and see what happens.

The reason for not just bolting the bottom section on and doing this is that I don't want to go to any major work without being sure first that it's worth it. Having said that no matter what ends up being a problem I'm still keen to go ahead and fix it as I'm excited to learn how it all works and how to service it at the same time.

Thanks Gary for the info on where the rod goes - now that I know it seems logical and I should have spotted that in the first place!
Thanks Jay for the detailed description as to how it all goes together. It looks like you're right and when I want to put it all back together I will have to pull off the powerhead. Is that a difficult thing to do?? I'm going to follow your advice and ditch the Clymer manual - it did seem quite all over the place!

I've also done as you said Tashasdaddy and tried to change the gears by hand. That seems to work fine FWD, REV and NEU so that's not jammed up either.

I will get back to you again no doubt with more questions once I've had a go at starting it up and carried out a compression test.

Thanks again!!
Jamie
 

wavrider

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Nov 26, 2007
Messages
543
Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

If you got spark, compression, and can getthe carb to deliver fuel to the cylinders, that little engine is going to run.

The compression check will tell you alot about the engine, but if it is low compression dont worry to much, may be a head gasket, or carbon.

Let us know how it goes, sounds like a nice challenge build a boat from the garbage? Post pics if you can.
 

Theoutdoorsman

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Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

Here's a service manual on eBay for your outboard. Dirt cheep!!!!

http://cgi.ebay.com/Johnson-1979-6H...ZWD1VQQ_trksidZp1638.m118.l1247QQcmdZViewItem

And just to give you an idea what you've picked up from the garbage, take a look at this!!!

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1979...023QQitemZ360039352760QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW

Like Gary, I'm almost certain the screw for the shift rod linkage can be inserted without having to remove the powerhead. It's a little tricky to get to, but it should be possible. You may need to remove the carbs, but what the heck, you'll probably want to rebuild them anyhow, I would. Be patient with getting it to shift correctly. It may take several attempts at lowering the foot,adjusting, and re-installing to get it right. They are rather tricky at times. If I'm not mistaken, they thread into the foot. And the hight of the shift rod is adjusted via threading it in and out of the foot until you find that sweet spot where it shifts correctly. Nice thread. Hope the compression checks out ok for you. I'd like to see you get this dinosaur up and running!!! If you do, be sure and do a decarb just to be safe. A new water pump will be high on your list as well. Good luck!!!! ........... ALAN
 

wbeaton

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Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

I'm with waverider. If it feels like it has compression it will probably run. Check out the coils. Even if it has spark they might be shot. Here is a photo of a set of bad coils from a 1972 Johnson 6 hp I just happen to be working on today.

If you plan to fix it anyway then I suggest you go buy a new impeller, cork gasket and o-ring for the lower crankcase seal that sits on top of the driveshaft and put it back together. You will need those parts eventually anyway. Clean the carb, file and set the points and then try to fire it up. Post back with any questions.

Personally, I wouldn't bother trying to run it without the lower unit on. Its a waste of time. A compression test will tell you if there is a problem with the powerhead. That motor can run with compression down to 60 psi.
 

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wbeaton

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Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

I'd like to see you get this dinasour up and running!!! If you do, be sure and do a decarb just to be safe.

Dinosaur?! 1979 is nearly new. Most of my motors are 20-30 years older than that one and they run great.
 

Theoutdoorsman

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Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

Dinosaur?! 1979 is nearly new. Most of my motors are 20-30 years older than that one and they run great.

I'm pretty happy with my 1979 Evinrude 140 (dinasaour) as well........ :)
I like tinkering with older motors. They knew how to make 'em back in the day didn't they. Rugged, easy to work on, and dependable! ........ :)
 

jay_merrill

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Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

LOL at wbeaton ... I'm with you! The "newest" motor that I own is my 1972 Johnson 65hp!

Since you don't currently have a compression tester, try rotating the flywheel in a clockwise direction, paying attention to the resistence that you feel as each cylinder advances to a top dead center (TDC) position. Sometimes you can actually feel a difference in the compression for each cylinder. If you can feel a definate and easily noticed difference, chances are that one of the cylinders has a major problem.

If it looks like this motor is worth fixing though, I would definately do so - they are great little motors that are almost difficult to "kill!"
 

Gary H NC

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Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

It may have been thrown in the garbage because the lower unit was bad,you never know.
One mans junk is another mans treasure..;)
 

JamieScott

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Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

Thanks yet again guys for the help so far.

Alan - I've brought that Manual from Ebay that you sent me the link for so once it posts to OZ I can begin to do more of the work needed to get it back up and running I hope!!?? Thanks for that - also I think you're right I may have to take the Carby off to get at that linkage to re-screw the rod in place. I've had a look and that seems to be the way in. If I can't get it with the Carby off is it a lot more hasstle to take the whole powerhead?

The other thing that I've discovered is when looking down the motor leg to see where the shift rod connects I can see a loose Nut sitting just next to/slightly above the shift rod linkage - I have no idea where it's come from but it's loose in there and won't shake out past the linkage. When I take off the Carby I hope to be able to take it out from there and maybe one of you will be able to tell me where it belongs?? I can see me having to take a picture of this one!

I laughed out loud when I read the last few comments about the age of the motor. I'm a firm believer already that old cars are great as you can still do your own repairs without computer testing equipment - so having an old (ish) outboard that some of you have said is a good type/year of motor makes me happy and will be proud to get it running again (especially as someone was going to throw it out!).

The main reason for being keen to get it started without the lower section on was my excitement to see if it runs. I will try to wait but it feels a bit like Christmas come early!

I'm also now trying to find where to order the parts that I need here in Oz so I that can get the gaskets / impeller etc that I need to give it a service.

Wbeaton -Thanks for the picture of the bad coils, when/if I get a spare moment this week I will check this out.

I'll keep you posted and will get some pictures of the boat/motor up here at some point.

Jamie
 

Harker

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Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

Taking the powerhead off is about as easy as taking the lower unit off. Since the lower is already off, it is easier yet. You would need a new gasket where the powerhead sits on the midsection. I hope that whoever tossed it did it because they couldn't figure out how to get the lower unit back on.
 

jay_merrill

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Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

I think some clarification is needed in regard to the shift rod linkage. The upper shift rod connects to the end of the shift handle inside of the exhaust housing. Taking off the carburetor will only provide access to the leaf valve assembly. Behind that is the crankshaft, inside of the powerhead, not the exhaust housing. There is no way to access the upper portion of the exhaust housing from the inside of the crankcase of this motor.

The powerhead needs to come off and it really isn't very difficult to do, unless the handfull of bolts holding it in place are frozen due to corrosion.
 

Theoutdoorsman

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Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

Taking off the carburetor will only provide access to the leaf valve assembly. Behind that is the crankshaft, inside of the powerhead, not the exhaust housing. There is no way to access the upper portion of the exhaust housing from the inside of the crankcase of this motor.

With the lower carb off, will this not make access to the linkage in question easier? I'm thinking it would, but I may be wrong. They (meaning the carbs) most likely need to come off anyhow for cleaning and rebuilding. At any rate, the manual will shed more light on this. Have you gotten any compression readings yet JamieScott? I, for one, am keeping my fingers crossed for ya!!! Hard to beat a free motor, no matter the horsepower OR age!!!! Good Luck........... ALAN
 

jay_merrill

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Re: An outboard from the Garbage - but will it run again?

This is a 6hp motor - there is only one carburetor, not two. There is also no linkage to get to under the carb because it is inside of the exhaust housing.
 
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