BIL Wiped Out

[SS MAYFLOAT]

My BIL has been living with his girlfriend for the last 15 years. He is in his mid 60's. She had opened up 4 credit cards in his name & SSN. Of course she maxed them out and denies it. She also started last April of 07 writting checks from his account almost amounting to $13,000. Plus all of the money he uses to run his concession business is gone as well. He kept about $5,000 to start up his trailers when the season starts.

He has made the neccessary police reports. They finally got back with him and said that they can go after the credit card identy theft, but as for the checking account, he won't be able to get any of that back. This is the part that I don't understand. The bank that he did business at did not have her signature on record. However for the past 10 years or so, he did have her write checks for his mortgage and utilities. The bank never questioned the endorsements of the checks that she signed.

My bank caught a bad endorsement that my wife signed prior to her being added to my account. Two other friends of mine from other banks said that they encountered the same thing. My question is why did this bank not check out why the endorsements did not ressemble the one on his signature card?

The police and the bank said since he authorized her to sign (even though there is nothing in writting that authorizes her to do so) checks, that they can't do anything. This has me confused somewhat.

I have a company credit card that I'm authorized to use,,,,,so if I'm authorized to use the card, then shouldn't I be allowed to use it for whatever I want to get? According to the way my BIL's bank account is treated, I should be able to get what I want with the credit card since I was authorized to use it. If I did, I know I would be fired and arrested for unauthorized use.

She even wrote checks to her crack dealer and he is still in operation. The police know who and where he is, but seem to do nothing about it. They say that they can't get the evidence that they need to get him.

On a good note, his homeowners insurance has identy protection, but it won't cover his checking account. With his age and being wiped out has torn him apart. Yes of course he kicked her out. The night he told her he knew what was going on,,,,,she tried to commit suicide by taking over 40 pills. Luck had it that they got her to the hospital in time to save her.

BTW, before he met her,,,,,,,she was on probation for,,,,,,,,,writting bad checks and misuse of credit cards.......DUH!


I posted this thinking someone may be able to shed a bit of light our way. Thanks........SS

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: BIL Wiped Out

actually he is lucky, my father got in the same situation. ended up murdered. we found out early enough, my sister was on all his accounts, and was able to save about 1/2 his wealth, to another account. the crack Wh__e, bilked him out of his social security every month. then would tell the dealer that he would pay them. they know who murdered him. but, don't have enough to prosecute.

 

[SpinnerBait_Nut]

Re: BIL Wiped Out

Sorry to hear SS and TD.
SS, sometime in the past he has told the bank, not in writing, but verbal that it was ok for her to write checks.
Maybe just to the places you state, but still, he said it was alright.
Don't know for sure, but that sounds like what has went on.
If not, the bank is in the wrong.

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: BIL Wiped Out

Whether he let her sign checks before the situation or not, the bank would not have examined the signatures unless the checks were written for over $10,000. I have had a major bank clear a $7,500 check that I did not sign at all, but my assistant mistakenly mailed to a vendor with whom I was in a dispute. Other than firing my assistant (which I didn't do because she was not in the habit of making such mistakes), there wasn't really anything that I could have done.

As to the matter of the woman using your BIL's money fraudulently, I'm not sure that I would take the cop's word in regard to not being able to do anything about it. Your BIL may have allowed her to sign to pay legitimate bills, but he certainly never intended for her to buy crack with the money. Seems to me that would constitute theft. I don't see it as being any different than leaving $1,000 in cash on the dresser within your secured home, telling someone that they may take $300 of it only to pay bills, and then having them steal the rest.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: BIL Wiped Out

it's one of the problems of co-habitating.

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: BIL Wiped Out

Yup ... and why the only one I co-habitate with is my 2-1/2 year old son. Then again, its a good thing he's just a cool little bugger 'cause he sure does "get" a lot of my money!

 

[Bob_VT]

Re: BIL Wiped Out

Rock and a hard place! The checking thing is tough since it was "past practice" and accepted as such.

My advice is simple..... lesson learned ....... move on and do not dwell on it. It is not good to let crap like that build and ruin his health at 60.

I know it sounds cold but I think he should recover and move on. It sounds as if the girlfiend is on a bad road anyway and I believe in karma.... what goes around....comes around.

 

[External Combustion]

Re: BIL Wiped Out

SS: Your BIL had ten years to dispute her signature as being authorized and did not. Writing checks from the same account and cohabitating equals common law marriage in many states. I don't have a clue if his is one of them, but if it is things can get worse.

At your age you know that it is not PC to lock up women. Even if they commit murder, the bleeding hearts argue that prison will be "hard on the children". Her addiction will work for her if and I do say IF she ever goes to trial.

My SIL is one of those that does the same. The only reason she has ever spent time behind bars was she was caught kiting checks stolen from a state appelate judge. Equal justice for all huh? Now she is out continuing her lifestyle.

Unfortunately your BIL is paying the price for not taking care of the details of his business. If he had, he would have gotten her into rehab or protected his future from the ravages that addiction visits on everyone around the user.

 

[flashback]

Re: BIL Wiped Out

Sorry to hear this, but that being said, there ain't many 60+ year old crack heads around, I'd bet she was half his age...He should of seen it coming...

 

[Haut Medoc]

Re: BIL Wiped Out

He screwed up.......
Should have been keeping an eye on his account balance.....
The only way for him to get that money back would be if he could prove she stole it & have the courts order restitution....
Ain't gonna happen.....​

 

[SS MAYFLOAT]

Re: BIL Wiped Out

He didn't know that he was cleaned out on his checking account until the bank notified him of being overdrawn. According to his check book his balance should have been about $15,000. She kept a false balance and wrote checks to herself from the back of the check book. She always made it a point to get the mail before him.

One thing he has going for him is his two rental houses and the apartment above his house. The hard part is going to be coming up with the start up costs for his concession trailers. Ooops,,,,should say trailer. The one was for her to run.

He bought her a car a few years ago and a small camper trailer. The camper was mostly used when they would go out of town for concessions. The detective had contacted her and suggested that she should voluntairly sign them over. That hasn't been done yet. He could use the car, his Dodge truck is costing him a lot to drive.

TD, my niece is worried that they might come after him. We don't know if she owes him money or not. So my niece paid to have security cameras put in his house and hers too. His girlfriend and her sister has made death threats to the niece for butting in. I know it sure is a mess and a sticky situation.

 

[Haut Medoc]

Re: BIL Wiped Out

Tape those death threats if possible, it is a felony, esp. over the phone.....
It is a sad situation, & I feel for him, but you can go to any bank & check your balance through the ATM.....
The getting the mail excuse does not fly, IMHO.......
This is an expensive lesson to say the least.....
What about the fraud charges from the ID theft?......
That should be enough to lock her up, at least temporarily.....​

 

[SpinnerBait_Nut]

Re: BIL Wiped Out

Whether he let her sign checks before the situation or not, the bank would not have examined the signatures unless the checks were written for over $10,000. I have had a major bank clear a $7,500 check that I did not sign at all, but my assistant mistakenly mailed to a vendor with whom I was in a dispute. Other than firing my assistant (which I didn't do because she was not in the habit of making such mistakes), there wasn't really anything that I could have done.

As to the matter of the woman using your BIL's money fraudulently, I'm not sure that I would take the cop's word in regard to not being able to do anything about it. Your BIL may have allowed her to sign to pay legitimate bills, but he certainly never intended for her to buy crack with the money. Seems to me that would constitute theft. I don't see it as being any different than leaving $1,000 in cash on the dresser within your secured home, telling someone that they may take $300 of it only to pay bills, and then having them steal the rest.

Maybe your bank would not check, but let someone other than myself go in and try to cash a check that is on my account and not signed by me, and I get a call, don't matter how much it is for.
That includes the wife also which I have told the bank that she can.
Some banks just make it more personal than others.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: BIL Wiped Out

did he smoke. the one my dad was involved with would pack his pipe for him, occasionally, and you know she slipped an little something into it. kept him off keel just enough. he had. had a minor stroke, and at first we thought it was effects of the stroke.

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: BIL Wiped Out

True that some banks do a better job. The bank that I was dealing with was Hibernia National Bank, now Capital One. At the time, Hibernia was only a statewide bank but it had a lot of branches. What they told me was that, in the course of processing checks deposited in other banks, they didn't check signatures for any check under $10,000. From what I understand, that is actually a common practice in the banking industry.

Presenting checks at a teller window to cash is a bit different but, at most banks, I don't think the end result would be much different. From what I have seen, most of them only verify the account balance and examine the ID of the person attempting to cash the check. If you bank at a small bank or have a long standing relationship with a particular branch of a larger bank, you might have a teller catch the signature issue, but I would think that is about your only chance. That said, there may be some banks that have a policy of looking at all signatures against a signature card. These days, those signature cards may even be digitized for viewing on a computer. I guess I need to find one of those!

I recently helped a friend fight with a bank, over about $2,000 that she lost from fraud. Someone stole an old ID card of hers (I believe it is someone who knows her) and used it to cash checks that were also stolen. What they did is to write checks "to my friend" from a checkbook that they had stolen from someone else. In this case, the teller couldn't compare the signature on the face of the check because it was from a differerent bank. They also couldn't verify the account balance for the same reason. What they did do is to check my friend's account balance and the ID that the thief had in her possesion. The bank then cashed the checks against my friend's balance as security. When the checks were returned, both because the real account holder didn't write them, and had closed the account due to the theft of his checks, my friend's bank took the lost money from her.

What is amazing to me is that the endorsement on the back of the checks does not look like my friend's signature at all, and her name was spelled wrong on all four checks involved. My friend is also 4"10" tall and has a distinctive facial feature - she is a person who is not easily mistaken for someone else. In the end, we had to fight a bit but we did get the bank to accept responsibility for the situation and pay my friend back.

I hope the BIL fights a little - he just might have some success in dealing with this.

 

[mscher]

Re: BIL Wiped Out

The police and the bank said since he authorized her to sign (even though there is nothing in writting that authorizes her to do so) checks, that they can't do anything. This has me confused somewhat.

Seems pretty clear.

He knew she was signing checks, so she was authorized, even though her signature was not on file at the bank, which is basically a technicality.

If he did not know at all, she was signing any checks, the it would be check fraud.

It stinks, but oh well. I'm sure he will land on his feet.

 

[JRJ]

Re: BIL Wiped Out

Seems like its always something. Good luck.

 

[SS MAYFLOAT]

Re: BIL Wiped Out

When looking at the past statements, its clear that (except for the last 8 months) the account had a pattern of who the checks went to. 9 years of not a single check made out to her name, only to the mortgage and utlilites. Just in the past 8 months of the account, there were 40+ checks made out to her. Most were consecutive by the day. They ranged from $200 up to $1200. Ohio did away with the common law marriage awhile back. I'm thinking he is going to need an attorney to prove she frauded him.

He had sold a house 2 years ago. That amount of money in his acount had never been touched by her until the last 8 months they were together. Just seems too obivious to me in what she was doing.

BIL is pretty much old school. He just recently got a cell phone and it is funny watching him try to use it. He won't even think about trying to use a PC. He's just an old fart set in his ways and maybe puts too much trust in those around him. Helping him out is a big problem, he refuses help from anyone. I'm sure he'll get back on his feet,,,,,,,,,quicker if he would find an old nurse

As for the threats to my niece, she is a paramedic at the fire house up the road from her dads house. His GF and her sister called the firehouse to complain about my niece. Saying stuff like she didn't have any license and her diploma was fake. They also made the threats at that time. Of course the firehouse always records all incoming calls. The sister imediately was picked up for probation violation.

 

[SgtMaj]

Re: BIL Wiped Out

IF banks checked every signature on every check, your check writing fee would be $10 per check or more. They arn't going to do that.

Since he did let her use the checking account, the bank isn't going to end up eating the debt. Though the cops could also get her on grand larsony for that... the sentencing is the same as grand theft.

 

[wildmaninal]

Re: BIL Wiped Out

Bad situation . My mother works for a bank, and has been working in a bank for 40 years give or take a few. Be interesting to see what she would half to say on this matter, she use to be a manager, now adays sense we moved to Alabama she has recently been a fill in manager for different branches what they call a "rover".

A man that replied to one of my ads about my boat motor for sale, he had a similar situation to your BIL. Apparently their care taker was given permission in the past to right out checks for groceries etc etc, well they ended up loosing there lump sum of nearly $20,000 because of this woman . I didn't know this man at all, if anything I know his truck from when I've seen it passing by the house. I sure do feel bad for him.

What gets me is how can these banks allow such transaction without approval of the check by the accounts owner. I know of a couple of similar scenarios that my mother has been in and she did not cash that check.