V4 1987 Looper Low Compression & Backfire In One Cylinder

Riley C

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Dec 23, 2018
Messages
239
I wouldnt bother about changing spark plugs, unless you have spare coin to chase up a 50/50 chance.
Id put your 900 solely down to the thermostats being out. I need to idle mine up around that until its warm then i put down the warm up idle lever and she drops right down .
Correct you dont need a timing light on the bottom end as its all done by as low as you can get it before conking out (when shes warmed up!)
I would be a bit wary about high your top end is, if you can do with not hitting 90kph id adjust the max timing advance in a bit until you can make sure using Joe Reeves method that you arent sorching your pistons.
Also do check your steering system as if something gives way at that speed its really serious. I always wear the lanyard line for that reason (it kills the ignition instantly). I know down here in Aus and NZ we havent had any high profile recent tragedies but in the Uk and elsewhere many people have being maimed/killed by steering system failure.
Not wanting to sound like a stick in the mud, but when ive check all mine over and wear the lanyard line then im definitely in the best head space when out there

Hi BOS,

happy new year! I appreciate your comments, I have ordered two thermos. Hopefully this sorts a few issues also. So hard to get new car by kits local also, still searching.

Steering wise it’s pulley cable system, stiff and directional I guess. More reliable we will see. There are no stands or anything loose.

Thanks so much for this information too. I have learnt so much more than just referencing Seloc.
 

Bosunsmate

Admiral
Joined
Apr 7, 2012
Messages
6,129
Happy New Year too, although i see in Sydney they say its now only 2018.
Id add an impeller to the list if no ones told you to do that yet, check the gear oil and then you a pretty much set for years of boating. I havent touched my motor since i rejoined the crank case halves years ago and shes a 1982. I just flush well after use and spray crc over her to stop any surface corrosion spreading into the electrics etc etc.
Mines rope and pulleys too, 60hp. I did the powerhead on my mates 1983 90hp about 5 years ago. She had worse cylinder gouges than yours and shes going strong.
50/1 and keep the fuel nice and clean so no blocking of one carb and she should go for donkey years. I think my mate put an inline two stroke filter in his fuel line. Mine being only two cylinder id notice if it was down on one cylinder but with those bigger motors you may not know you have a carb blockage on just one carb til too late.

Where are you actually boating, are you up inland rivers, or into the Tasman/Coral Sea? Im out into the Pacific with home port being the Bay of Islands
And do post how you get on with the thermostats, hopefully someone removed them due to not knowing that was a bad idea rather than some hail mary idea to reduce water pressure through the engine to stop a leak or something perhaps in the gasket faces

Anyway have a good run out on the water
 

Riley C

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Dec 23, 2018
Messages
239
Happy New Year too, although i see in Sydney they say its now only 2018.
Id add an impeller to the list if no ones told you to do that yet, check the gear oil and then you a pretty much set for years of boating. I havent touched my motor since i rejoined the crank case halves years ago and shes a 1982. I just flush well after use and spray crc over her to stop any surface corrosion spreading into the electrics etc etc.
Mines rope and pulleys too, 60hp. I did the powerhead on my mates 1983 90hp about 5 years ago. She had worse cylinder gouges than yours and shes going strong.
50/1 and keep the fuel nice and clean so no blocking of one carb and she should go for donkey years. I think my mate put an inline two stroke filter in his fuel line. Mine being only two cylinder id notice if it was down on one cylinder but with those bigger motors you may not know you have a carb blockage on just one carb til too late.

Where are you actually boating, are you up inland rivers, or into the Tasman/Coral Sea? Im out into the Pacific with home port being the Bay of Islands
And do post how you get on with the thermostats, hopefully someone removed them due to not knowing that was a bad idea rather than some hail mary idea to reduce water pressure through the engine to stop a leak or something perhaps in the gasket faces

Anyway have a good run out on the water

Hi Bos,

Last night pulled the entire carb system apart. Cleaned every needle, float etc and blew it all down. Each rubber gasket sealed with o ring lube and paper gaskets cleaned down. Half completed a Lync & Sync, bnut had to wait to get fully in the water.

So the following has now been done on this engine.

1. New water pump kit
2. Lower Gear Oil
3. Plugs & Leads
4. Decarb
5. Pulled down cleaned reeds with new gaskets
6. Total pull down of carbs and cleaned.
7. New inline fuel filter with new lines and new eastener water sep fuel filter at tank.
8. New vacuum fuel pump and flushed fuel tank.
9. New Thermostats and gaskets
10. New Head Gaskets

I got it on the Brisbane River which is where I have been running a lot other than the Tweed. Mostly will run around the Moreton bay areas and get up to freshwater lakes.

Launching today it fired up well. We tied her to the pontoon and started to adjust the idler screw. I found the throttle shaft to be loose to both timing lkink and carb cam. The conk/knock stops a little (Or knock in less revolutions) when I move time one into fixed position. I know from the carb link side I'm sweet as the valve and roller are all in line.

The knock is at its worst at 2k and is gone by 3k. It is working so much better though. At 900 in gear there is no suff, just the slight mean to conk. It is a lot smother in acceleration, and speeds are gained alot quicker.

The thermos are definitely better, Our max temp was 140f like the thermo set. I believe they have helped the idle by bringing the temp up like you say. This I think made the best gain. The tell tale outlet is running so much better in neutral also. When I was flushing I didn't need to get in the boat to touch throttle, the water stream was not a drizzle any more.

I think the previous owner mechanic was a half wit and tried modding the engine to being more performance or something...

I'm almost there with the tune but don't think myself personally cant get much better than it is without timing light and better/confident know how. What do you guys think????

My wife said apparently I have spent $2800 on the repair to this boat. I fell over and really question how it's that much when I didn't buy big expensive items.

However, in addition to the above I guess I have done more:

1. Dry out, inject glycol and resin inject transom. some rot around bung had to rid of.
2. New battery and anchor
3. Fibreglass repairs and flow coat areas.
4. Install ports etc and general maintenance

Bloody hell it adds up!

Thanks again!
Riley
 
Last edited:

Riley C

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Dec 23, 2018
Messages
239
Happy New Year too, although i see in Sydney they say its now only 2018.
Id add an impeller to the list if no ones told you to do that yet, check the gear oil and then you a pretty much set for years of boating. I havent touched my motor since i rejoined the crank case halves years ago and shes a 1982. I just flush well after use and spray crc over her to stop any surface corrosion spreading into the electrics etc etc.
Mines rope and pulleys too, 60hp. I did the powerhead on my mates 1983 90hp about 5 years ago. She had worse cylinder gouges than yours and shes going strong.
50/1 and keep the fuel nice and clean so no blocking of one carb and she should go for donkey years. I think my mate put an inline two stroke filter in his fuel line. Mine being only two cylinder id notice if it was down on one cylinder but with those bigger motors you may not know you have a carb blockage on just one carb til too late.

Where are you actually boating, are you up inland rivers, or into the Tasman/Coral Sea? Im out into the Pacific with home port being the Bay of Islands
And do post how you get on with the thermostats, hopefully someone removed them due to not knowing that was a bad idea rather than some hail mary idea to reduce water pressure through the engine to stop a leak or something perhaps in the gasket faces

Anyway have a good run out on the water

Also Bos,

you have done work on engine and boats in general. You're a good friend for doing that work on your mates motor.

Thanks again for all your help!
 

Faztbullet

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Mar 2, 2008
Messages
15,620
Is the water control valve still attached to t-stat housing??? T-stats and poppets wont work without it.
 

Bosunsmate

Admiral
Joined
Apr 7, 2012
Messages
6,129
I would of thought itd get up above 60 degs- more to like 70degs but if the thermostats say 60 then thats that then but also take note of what FBullet says.
Im not sure what to make of the knock. If you had a timing light you might be able to see if somethings going wrong there. A playing up powerpack may do that but more often its mechanical. Post a video if you think listening to it on acceleration and at idle may give clues to some of us on here.
Haha looks like you might have to get two signatures on everything you purchase soon.
Oh wow those are great boating areas, i know them both, zooming up and down the Brisbane River and then stopping off at one of those riverside bars along the way must be great times. With the regulations ive seen in Aussie, im not sure theyd let you hit 90kph in the river though, youd have those water-rats with sirens after you
 

Riley C

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Dec 23, 2018
Messages
239
Is the water control valve still attached to t-stat housing??? T-stats and poppets wont work without it.

Is that the wire going into the side near the thermostat? If so yes it's there. Temp never went above 140f
 

Riley C

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Dec 23, 2018
Messages
239
I would of thought itd get up above 60 degs- more to like 70degs but if the thermostats say 60 then thats that then but also take note of what FBullet says.
Im not sure what to make of the knock. If you had a timing light you might be able to see if somethings going wrong there. A playing up powerpack may do that but more often its mechanical. Post a video if you think listening to it on acceleration and at idle may give clues to some of us on here.
Haha looks like you might have to get two signatures on everything you purchase soon.
Oh wow those are great boating areas, i know them both, zooming up and down the Brisbane River and then stopping off at one of those riverside bars along the way must be great times. With the regulations ive seen in Aussie, im not sure theyd let you hit 90kph in the river though, youd have those water-rats with sirens after you


I'm taking her out on the water tomorrow. I will get a video on and upload. I think you blokes will be onto it straight away.

It's so weird it's exactly like a conking mower but goes when up the revs. It's more prevalent in gear under load at that low rev. Neutral it barely does it other than 900rpm, acceleration is smoother in neutral too....

Yeah I have to pull up on the spending or loose a limb.

Yeah cant say I will be doing that speed alot.
 

Faztbullet

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Mar 2, 2008
Messages
15,620
No that wire is overheat sensor.. The water control valve holds the poppet/t-stat housing(salt shaker) in place with water pressure from impeller. This allows t-stats to bleed water thru head, as RPM increase the throttle linkage closes decreasing flow to poppet/t-stat covers and allows them to unseat at RPM. Below is pic of a valve.
 

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Riley C

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Dec 23, 2018
Messages
239
No that wire is overheat sensor.. The water control valve holds the poppet/t-stat housing(salt shaker) in place with water pressure from impeller. This allows t-stats to bleed water thru head, as RPM increase the throttle linkage closes decreasing flow to poppet/t-stat covers and allows them to unseat at RPM. Below is pic of a valve.

Nope that is definitely not there. Damn

i see that hose would connect to bottom of the head.

far out this sucks. I got to find that part then??
 

Riley C

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Dec 23, 2018
Messages
239
No that wire is overheat sensor.. The water control valve holds the poppet/t-stat housing(salt shaker) in place with water pressure from impeller. This allows t-stats to bleed water thru head, as RPM increase the throttle linkage closes decreasing flow to poppet/t-stat covers and allows them to unseat at RPM. Below is pic of a valve.

This is the photos.
 

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Riley C

Petty Officer 1st Class
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Messages
239
Perhaps it is not a 1987 powerhead that you have.

Would it be older? All the decal and serial points to 87. What do I do take the thermostats out until I source a control valve?

this boat is all bad news
 

Riley C

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Dec 23, 2018
Messages
239
What is your model #? serial means nothing on an OMC.

E140TLCUA

The other thing is now with the thermos in the sparks have stopped fouling.

Can I not just bypass and not have the control valve?
 

Bosunsmate

Admiral
Joined
Apr 7, 2012
Messages
6,129
Would it be older? All the decal and serial points to 87. What do I do take the thermostats out until I source a control valve?

this boat is all bad news

Boats are always bad news until they come right, ive never met one that hasnt come right apart from a suzuki, but fixing their crankshafts is a long story.
Post a few photos of the rear and your thermostat set up
 

Bosunsmate

Admiral
Joined
Apr 7, 2012
Messages
6,129
E140TLCUA

The other thing is now with the thermos in the sparks have stopped fouling.

Can I not just bypass and not have the control valve?

Seems to me a spring might do the work of the control valve but i dont know enough to comment 100% on that on someone elses motor and money
 

Riley C

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Dec 23, 2018
Messages
239
Is the serial # of the power head the same as the serial # on the midsection ?

There is no serial on the mid section. Got the model number from the plug and sent it through to Downes Marine/Evinrude. They said it's 87 and gave me the E140TLCUA.

Below is the power photos
 

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Riley C

Petty Officer 1st Class
Joined
Dec 23, 2018
Messages
239
Seems to me a spring might do the work of the control valve but i dont know enough to comment 100% on that on someone elses motor and money

Bos,

I just uploaded some pics. See what you think.

Can I just leave the thermos in for now???
 
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