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Please help, 2 stroke NS18 problems

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  • #16
    You're welcome R3zrunn3n,

    Been there regarding the fuel connector's o'rings and spark plugs with hidden issues, first one drove me crazy for some time until tested a brand new fuel line. Yep yours is a M18E2 model with the older fuel filter version.


    Click image for larger version  Name:	Tohatsu 18-1.JPG Views:	2 Size:	101.0 KB ID:	10712062

    Newer one is much larger as seen on posted pic, works much better and clogs less with polluted fuel. If not that costly, change it comes complete. It's part 3B7-022300 (Fuel Filter Assy) Check that both plug's caps internal plug contacts are in mint shinny condition for top electrical contact.

    PD: Don't forget the new spark plugs...LOL!!

    Happy Boating
    Last edited by Sea Rider; March 11th, 2019, 06:55 AM.


    Sea Rider 320, 380 Sibs, 450 Rib, 2 Strokes Tohatsu 5,18 & 30 HP Proud Smokers

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    • #17
      Originally posted by pvanv View Post
      That should be an NS18E2. Beware that some of those Attwood tanks (which don't have any conventional vent) have a perssure/vacuum type cap can which can jam; If it does that, the tank will collapse under vacuum as you run, and then the motor will "run out of gas" and stall, especially at high speeds.
      pvanv Thanks man! Holy cow that sounds EXACTLY what my issue is.. as wide open throttle it'll just lose all power, like its running out of gas, or some restriction but it'll stay on, just acts really strange.. then shut it off, pump it, start over etc etc.. really frustrating.. I noticed there was some "leaking" in my attwood by the gauge and fuel connection.. im wondering if it was the gas tank all along !!!!!!! -__- that's so annoying. Thank you so much for that info, i'll switch gas tanks, i'd hate to lose all my gas capacity by switching to the tohatsu gas tank 3.3gallon, the 6.6 gallon wouldnt fit.. but at least the connections would be solid and i think it vents okay... again, thank you!

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      • #18
        Probably all the trouble is related to using a non Tohatsu fuel tank. I use a 3.3 Gal Tohatsu fuel tank with a 18 HP and can go boating for hours at 3/4 throttle. For extended boating usually carry 2-1 Gal containers, just in case...

        Happy Boating


        Sea Rider 320, 380 Sibs, 450 Rib, 2 Strokes Tohatsu 5,18 & 30 HP Proud Smokers

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by R3zrunn3n View Post

          pvanv Thanks man! Holy cow that sounds EXACTLY what my issue is.. as wide open throttle it'll just lose all power, like its running out of gas, or some restriction but it'll stay on, just acts really strange.. then shut it off, pump it, start over etc etc.. really frustrating.. I noticed there was some "leaking" in my attwood by the gauge and fuel connection.. im wondering if it was the gas tank all along !!!!!!! -__- that's so annoying. Thank you so much for that info, i'll switch gas tanks, i'd hate to lose all my gas capacity by switching to the tohatsu gas tank 3.3gallon, the 6.6 gallon wouldnt fit.. but at least the connections would be solid and i think it vents okay... again, thank you!
          You can unlock the fuel cap a half turn to see if that vents OK. If so, you have a bad cap.
          Paul
          Buffalo NY USA

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          • #20
            Originally posted by pvanv View Post
            That should be an NS18E2. Beware that some of those Attwood tanks (which don't have any conventional vent) have a perssure/vacuum type cap can which can jam; If it does that, the tank will collapse under vacuum as you run, and then the motor will "run out of gas" and stall, especially at high speeds.
            pvanv I can't thank you enough - that's exactly what my problem sounds like.. so, I've been reading into this since you brought it up and it seems like companies and the EPA work against each other which ultimately leaves us with ventless gas tanks from the 2011 zero-emissions policy.. which leads to the question, how the hell do you vent this Atwood gas tank? or what are some other solutions the experienced folks use? I like the attwood because its exactly 20" and fits perfect in my jon boat spot. I'm looking at one way valves, vents i can maybe install at the top of my gas tank? drilling a hole is cool and all but what about the water coming in? I need to install a water/fuel seperator as well I guess..

            thank you again, seriously it's been a big eye opener!

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by Sea Rider View Post
              Probably all the trouble is related to using a non Tohatsu fuel tank. I use a 3.3 Gal Tohatsu fuel tank with a 18 HP and can go boating for hours at 3/4 throttle. For extended boating usually carry 2-1 Gal containers, just in case...

              Happy Boating
              dude, thanks again for helping with the model #.. it seems the NS18-E2 or the M18-E2 is the same thing and parts all match my motor which has been SOOOOOOOOO helpful in locating parts. Really thank you for that, it's been driving me up the wall the past 2 years.

              Question, yesterday I chipped a tiny tiny tiny piece from the small jet where the flat head part is on top, ill try to take a picture of it today.. is it a "big deal", or as long as the jet holes are fine, i'm good?

              this gas tank thing is driving me nuts -_-

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              • #22
                Keep in mind that you are seeing symptoms of either fuel starvation or overheating electronics. A better tank and hose may fix it. Maybe not.
                Paul
                Buffalo NY USA

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by pvanv View Post
                  Keep in mind that you are seeing symptoms of either fuel starvation or overheating electronics. A better tank and hose may fix it. Maybe not.
                  thanks man - yesterday I received a new Attwood tank (same one that can have pressure issues.. I was thinking to drill a tiny hold in the cap piece that's "under" the main cap piece, if that makes sense to help with pressure/venting.. if that doesn't work.. what do most ppl do to address the gas venting? install one on the top part of the tank?

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                  • #24
                    First see if there is a malfunction. Unlock the cap a half turn to vent. If that fixes it, you have a bad cap, and can either replace it or modify it as needed.
                    Paul
                    Buffalo NY USA

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      As long as the broken upper part of the jet will let you remove it, it's OK using it that way. Yep, both NS and M 18 versions are same OB. Just curious, why buy a second Altwood tank and not an original OEM one which should be available without the pressure relief system found on newer fuel tanks.

                      To discard having fuel related restrictions, turn cap half turn out as suggested by Paul, disconnect carb's hose from fuel filter, place a container. With bulb's arrow pointing upwards prime bulb several times and check if the fuel flow is smooth with no restriction or hesitation whatsoever. Filter inside tank and fuel filter must be immaculate clean to achieve that cond.

                      Before going any further troubleshooting the electrical system, need to have the fuel system working spot on. Report your findings...

                      Happy Boating


                      Sea Rider 320, 380 Sibs, 450 Rib, 2 Strokes Tohatsu 5,18 & 30 HP Proud Smokers

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Sea Rider View Post
                        As long as the broken upper part of the jet will let you remove it, it's OK using it that way. Yep, both NS and M 18 versions are same OB. Just curious, why buy a second Altwood tank and not an original OEM one which should be available without the pressure relief system found on newer fuel tanks.

                        To discard having fuel related restrictions, turn cap half turn out as suggested by Paul, disconnect carb's hose from fuel filter, place a container. With bulb's arrow pointing upwards prime bulb several times and check if the fuel flow is smooth with no restriction or hesitation whatsoever. Filter inside tank and fuel filter must be immaculate clean to achieve that cond.

                        Before going any further troubleshooting the electrical system, need to have the fuel system working spot on. Report your findings...

                        Happy Boating
                        Sea Rider Real annoying answer actually man, I have exactly 20" between the transom support beams on my boat, the attwood is exactly 20" and is 6 gallons. If I do the OEM 6.6 gallon, it's 22".. it won't fit

                        I saw those 5-8$ gas tank vents - probably just buyone, drill a hole, install, seal. But definitely do what you said and thanks for that advice, i'll give that a try today when I get home and report back. Just cleaned the fuel filter yesterday..

                        Another big problem I found last night.. my lower unit? IS ABSOLUTELY LOCKED TIGHT! I cannot get it to come off, took off all 4 bolts/& PIN, and tried everything I could w/ my buddy and we couldn't get it... one thing after another

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                        • #27
                          A pity that you're experiencing such bad bummers in a row with that nice 18 OB. If you have removed the lower 4 bolts and pulled out the locking pin, the OB has the drive shaft seized against the lower crankshaft which is quite normal once the grease on top of the drive shaft has dried and hardened over time.

                          Try to separe the lower leg from middle leg banging gently with a hard rubber mallet at both middle sides of the AV plate, once with a small clearance insert 2 wooden/plastic wedges and make their way in banging constantly till the lower leg is dropped. Clean the shaft's splines with Acrylic Thinner, Carb Cleaner, once dry apply a light coat of marine grease, assemble back after whatever work was done on the lower tail.

                          Prime the fuel bulb as suggested to check the fuel flow, be aware than running any OB on muffs, barrel at idle without load is not same as when running under load throughout the whole throttle range. If with existing fuel or electrical related issues, OB will miss hard when under load at speed...

                          Happy Boating


                          Sea Rider 320, 380 Sibs, 450 Rib, 2 Strokes Tohatsu 5,18 & 30 HP Proud Smokers

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Sea Rider View Post
                            A pity that you're experiencing such bad bummers in a row with that nice 18 OB. If you have removed the lower 4 bolts and pulled out the locking pin, the OB has the drive shaft seized against the lower crankshaft which is quite normal once the grease on top of the drive shaft has dried and hardened over time.

                            Try to separe the lower leg from middle leg banging gently with a hard rubber mallet at both middle sides of the AV plate, once with a small clearance insert 2 wooden/plastic wedges and make their way in banging constantly till the lower leg is dropped. Clean the shaft's splines with Acrylic Thinner, Carb Cleaner, once dry apply a light coat of marine grease, assemble back after whatever work was done on the lower tail.

                            Prime the fuel bulb as suggested to check the fuel flow, be aware than running any OB on muffs, barrel at idle without load is not same as when running under load throughout the whole throttle range. If with existing fuel or electrical related issues, OB will miss hard when under load at speed...

                            Happy Boating
                            yeah it is a bummer bro. but I won't give up on her, shes clean & I personally think she just needs some TLC and she'll be great for years to come. Plus it's awesome knowledge I'm learning..
                            I guess i'll keep banging on it, I read somewhere it's not "favorable" and I can create problems if I do that? you know anything about that? I see no other way - some said try using a vehicle jack and put it between the boat and LU.. worth a shot.

                            Good to know bout the load! had no idea, I didn't know there was too much "electrical" in the motor besides the push to start portion of it.

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                            • #29
                              Place a wooden block on top middle AV plate and bang harder on it. Have never used a jack before nor shims as always maintain the upper shaft's splines well greased, the lower leg literally falls down when all related parts that secures them to the middle leg are removed. LOL!!

                              This is the drive shaft's splines, the ones that seized onto the lower crakshaft...

                              Click image for larger version  Name:	Drive Shatft Splines.jpg Views:	1 Size:	162.3 KB ID:	10713106

                              Paul will certainly know if your case which of both methods works best to use. Assume that want to disassemble the lower leg to have a look at the impeller ? The 2 strokes Tohatsu 18 HP it's my favorite, you'll love that horse when finally runs strong...

                              The electrical system consists of 3 parts and all work in decrease order, starts at the flywheel with the Exciter Coil which connects to the CD to provide power to the Ignition Coil which produces the spark at the tip of the spark plug. Are simple electric and electronic compact parts compared to oldie engines..

                              Happy Boating
                              Last edited by Sea Rider; March 14th, 2019, 04:00 PM.


                              Sea Rider 320, 380 Sibs, 450 Rib, 2 Strokes Tohatsu 5,18 & 30 HP Proud Smokers

                              Comment


                              • #30
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                                I'll have to try that.. I just got done beating the crap out of it and try to put a flathead screwdriver on the tip of the LU but no luck.. does that mean if it's seized up it wont run? or it's seized up enough to just not let the LU off? basically will the rest of my maintenance be okay enough to at least start her up?

                                I won't give up, but now I think I should probably get the LU Gasket Kit...yeah?

                                Thanks Sea Rider for your experiece and help
                                pvanv thanks for all your help!

                                this LU completely ruined my plan and excitement -_-

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