Mercruiser 165 Inline 6 (1980) running a SEI SE106 Leg Questions

[mnc1960]

Hi to all, Now I am just a newbie to iboats and also have just purchased my very first Mercruiser powered craft. Now I have a couple of questions that I hope you guys can answer for me.

Details of my boat are as follows:

1980 Bertram/Caribbean Commodore 6.1m (20ft) Half Cabin Cruiser.
1979/80 Mercruiser 165hp in-line 6 GM/Chev with 2-jet Rochester Carbie
Near new SEI Marine SE106 replacement leg (Top and Bottom)

I have attached photo's of the boat:


OK, now that is done, here are my questions:

1. What sort of fuel should I run in her - Straight Unleaded or Unleaded with the additive (Old Super Petrol)?
2. Can I replace the Mercury 3 button Power Trim Control Switch on the front dashboard for a switch on the forward control lever or not?
3. Now I have a wire (2 x connectors) comming through the transom from the outerdriver unit and they are not connect to anything. What are they? Trim Unit works correctly.
4. Can I connect up a Trim Gauge to this Mercruiser unt or not. I like to see where the leg is as in up or down etc.

I know I have asked a few questions but it is my very first Mercruiser and I want to make sure everything is perfect condition before I take her out.

Anyway, Hope to hear from you guys with some good advice etc.

All the best,

 

[Fordiesel69]

Re: Mercruiser 165 Inline 6 (1980) running a SEI SE106 Leg Questions

1. Unleaded will be fine. You engine looks older than 1979/1980 by the style of valve conver decals.
2. Yes, but you need to schmatic. It should be fairly easy.
3. You gimbal ring also looks way older than 1979/1980 I do not see the trim senders that would normally be there. My guess is these wires were at some point for this.
4. If you look at the top of your trim pump, you may see a plastic hydralic line going to a device with wires. If this older style sender is still working, then yes you can hook up a trim guage.

 

[fishrdan]

Re: Mercruiser 165 Inline 6 (1980) running a SEI SE106 Leg Questions

Ford is spot on, I'll add a couple of things.

2- You will have to change the remote control to one with the trim up-down switch in the handle, but it can be done. You will loose the "trailer" function unless your remote control has the trailer button... But, on most of those old MC1 drives the limit switch or wiring is bad and someone along the way has most likely shorted the wires to cancel out the "trailer" function. (IE: hit the trim button and see if the drive raises ALL the way up.) If this has been done be aware that you could possibly raise the drive too high while the engine is running, just don't raise the drive up all the way the engine running, something like 2/3 high, not any higher... If you do switch remote controls you will need a something like a Commander 3000 or earlier, the new GenII remote controls (4000) are not compatible with the old shift cables. I have a new 4000 GenII shifter on my old 72 MC1 drive and it works fine,,, but I had to replace the shift cables.

3- Well there we go, those are for the trim limit switch wires. It's disconnected because either the switch or wiring is shot. Leave it be as it's not replaceable unless you remove and disassemble the gimble housing, plus the part is probably NLA.

4- The trim sender is a round hydraulic cylinder on the port side, mounted onto and above the transom plate, with 2 hoses and wires attached. Those are also NLA, but you could connect it to your trim gauge and see if it works. The trim sender on my old 72 still works, though it gets a bit jumpy at times.

 

[series60]

Re: Mercruiser 165 Inline 6 (1980) running a SEI SE106 Leg Questions

1. What sort of fuel should I run in her - Straight Unleaded or Unleaded with the additive (Old Super Petrol)?

Moved up to 89 octaine in my 1984 305 and she runs better at altitude.

2. Can I replace the Mercury 3 button Power Trim Control Switch on the front dashboard for a switch on the forward control lever or not?

Yes but get yourself a service manual for your model first. Check out Adults only for the correct manual. I found a used Merc control on eBay with both switches in the handle. Works well on my Alpha. Personally I still use the 3 buttons which are wired in series with the control handle switches.

3. Now I have a wire (2 x connectors) coming through the transom from the outdrive unit and they are not connected to anything. What are they? Trim Unit works correctly.

As stated: they are probably trim limit/position wires.

4. Can I connect up a Trim Gauge to this Mercruiser unit or not. I like to see where the leg is as in up or down etc.

Yes but it would be better for you to develop a "Fell" for the trim position. Additionally if you do a search here you will find most trim position indicators are, at best, marginally correct!

Hope this helps.

 

[achris]

Re: Mercruiser 165 Inline 6 (1980) running a SEI SE106 Leg Questions

Hi there,

Your rig is no later than 1972 (no gimbal housing trim position and senders). The trim limit switch is in the top of the gimbal ring and those are the wires coming through the transom (I bet they're black ).

As you have a Caribbean hull it will like to ride high in the bow. I would be putting a 'water reversing kit' on the manifold before you crack it. And I don't see a spare fan belt tied off on the front engine mount. I'd put a spare (2 if it were me) on there. And I also don't see a trim ram continuity kit installed. You need that to stop the trim rams from corroding.... Especially in the Southern Ocean.....

One more thing you really need to do... Take a drive up to Dandenong, go into Mercury Marine Australia HQ and give them all a kick in the ***** for me...

Chris........

 

[oldsub86]

Re: Mercruiser 165 Inline 6 (1980) running a SEI SE106 Leg Questions

Hi there,

Your rig is no later than 1972 (no gimbal housing trim position and senders). The trim limit switch is in the top of the gimbal ring and those are the wires coming through the transom (I bet they're black ).

What exactly are we looking for in terms of the trim limit switch etc. noted above?

As you have a Caribbean hull it will like to ride high in the bow. I would be putting a 'water reversing kit' on the manifold before you crack it. And I don't see a spare fan belt tied off on the front engine mount. I'd put a spare (2 if it were me) on there. And I also don't see a trim ram continuity kit installed. You need that to stop the trim rams from corroding.... Especially in the Southern Ocean.....

Again, would you please explain what you mean by the above?


Chris........

Randy

 

[achris]

Re: Mercruiser 165 Inline 6 (1980) running a SEI SE106 Leg Questions

What exactly are we looking for in terms of the trim limit switch etc. noted above? Randy

Trim limit switch of that vintage are NLA (No Longer Available), and there is no alternative that I know about. Most people just live without them, no big deal.

 

[mnc1960]

Re: Mercruiser 165 Inline 6 (1980) running a SEI SE106 Leg Questions

Hi to all and thanks for all of the input. Now just a few more questions OK.

1. What is a "Water Reversing Kit" and why would it need one as whenever I do reverse any of my boats it is done at a very slow walking pace.

2. Spare fan belts - How do you get them on in the first place as the front engine mount goes inbetween the arch or circle that the belt makes when all fitted corectly.

3. Now what is a trim ram continuity kit and where and how much would that cost?

Now as for the trim gauge etc, I will check it all out and I have been thinking of getting a new GEN11 4000 unit and getting the cable adaptors so I can connect the early cables to the new style connectors.

Also I am thinking about doing a complete repower of her in around 12 months time. Now the hull/transom is rated to a maximum of 200hp so I guess a mercruiser 4.3L carb - 190hp Alpha package would be best for her or would a slight over powering say to a mercruiser 4.3L MPI - 220hp Alpha package be alright? The last thing I want to do is invalidate my insurance policy on her by going to the more HP engine setup.

Anyway, thanks to all for the info and please send me more as this is the first mercruiser I have owned so it really is a totally new world and learning curve for me.

Thanks to all,

Max.

 

[achris]

Re: Mercruiser 165 Inline 6 (1980) running a SEI SE106 Leg Questions

Hi to all and thanks for all of the input. Now just a few more questions OK.

1. What is a "Water Reversing Kit" and why would it need one as whenever I do reverse any of my boats it is done at a very slow walking pace.

Nothing to do with the boat going in reverse. Have a read HERE

2. Spare fan belts - How do you get them on in the first place as the front engine mount goes in between the arch or circle that the belt makes when all fitted correctly.

You need to take the weight of the engine off the front mount. Then remove the bolts holding the spacer in (near the alternator) and then you can slip the spare belts in.

3. Now what is a trim ram continuity kit and where and how much would that cost?

A couple of stainless steel wire clips that ground the trim rams to the rest of the drive. The part number is 24-86687A1, but it is no longer available from Mercury Best go to your local friendly Merc dealer and see if he has any kicking around out the back....

Now as for the trim gauge etc, I will check it all out and I have been thinking of getting a new GEN11 4000 unit and getting the cable adaptors so I can connect the early cables to the new style connectors.

When I had my 165, I tried for years to get the trim gauge to work. The gauge worked fine, the sender, not so... So, good luck on that one.....

The new 4000 series control need new cables too. The adaptors are for the engine end. I had one (4000 series control box) in my boat when I put the new (2006) engine in. It lasted one trip before I threw it out (literally!) and put the old one back in. You have the older "MerControl", keep it! It has a box to rest the heel of your hand and means you're not up and down on the throttle as the boat pitches and rolls. The new controls only have that poxxy lever sticking out of the panel and nothing for your hand to 'reference' against. Hateful things!!!

Also I am thinking about doing a complete repower of her in around 12 months time. Now the hull/transom is rated to a maximum of 200hp so I guess a mercruiser 4.3L carb - 190hp Alpha package would be best for her or would a slight over powering say to a mercruiser 4.3L MPI - 220hp Alpha package be alright? The last thing I want to do is invalidate my insurance policy on her by going to the more HP engine setup.

If you really like the boat, and think the repower is worth it, I would look very seriously at about a 150hp diesel. That's what I will be doing next time I'm up for a new engine. If you must go Mercruiser, then in that hull I would put the 190....

Anyway, thanks to all for the info and please send me more as this is the first mercruiser I have owned so it really is a totally new world and learning curve for me.

Here's a link to the service manual for your engine and drive.... http://www.4shared.com/document/3AHpVLYw/Service_Manual_02.html

Enjoy.....

 

[Fishermark]

Re: Mercruiser 165 Inline 6 (1980) running a SEI SE106 Leg Questions

When Chris wrote that post a few years ago, it convinced me to do the same thing. Here's what mine looked like after doing the modification:

And here's a diagram I drew to help explain it. (I'm a visual learner! ):

 

[John3]

Re: Mercruiser 165 Inline 6 (1980) running a SEI SE106 Leg Questions

2. Spare fan belts - How do you get them on in the first place as the front engine mount goes inbetween the arch or circle that the belt makes when all fitted corectly.

I've got the same setup. I jacked up the front of the motor (Be careful to distribute the load where the jack meets the hull or you can damage your boat.) removed the front mount, replaced the belt and also put a spare in place for when the new belt broke. Wouldn't you know after a couple of years the new one did break. So I used the spare. Now I have a Bell Automotive "Emergency Fan Belt" SKU-22-5-00320-8 in my junk, oops spare parts box. I don't think it can be run at high engine speed because of the metal link, but hopefully it'll get me home.
Guess I should jackup the motor again and do it right.
PS As I recall I lifted the motor by putting the top of the jack under the fan belt pully that attaches to the crank shaft. Again, distribute the weight so as not to damage the pully.

 

[fishrdan]

Re: Mercruiser 165 Inline 6 (1980) running a SEI SE106 Leg Questions

I jacked up the front of the motor,,,removed the front mount,

Don't completely remove the front mount or you could throw off the engine alignment. Just remove the little spacer by the alternator, this will allow the belt to be strung around the pulleys. (Wire tie a spare belt out of the way while the spacer is out.)

If I had the front mount completely off the engine I would check the engine alignment, the alignment could be off now, might be OK too..... (IE: poor engine alignment can chew up the engine coupler, PITA repair.)

 

[mike165]

Re: Mercruiser 165 Inline 6 (1980) running a SEI SE106 Leg Questions

Hey Max,welcome plenty of info on the 165's here,I'm in wagga with a 165 on a 20' tri hull.i had the early gimbal on with the sender in the hydralic line in side the transom,i picked up a blown 470 with an mc1 drive which has the sender and limits outside.The motor runs well just put rings,bearing and an oil pump in, ran 10 hours last week end at Talbingo

 

[oldsub86]

Re: Mercruiser 165 Inline 6 (1980) running a SEI SE106 Leg Questions

Trim limit switch of that vintage are NLA (No Longer Available), and there is no alternative that I know about. Most people just live without them, no big deal.

I understand that part. What does it look like? IE - where exactly is it?

 

[mike165]

Re: Mercruiser 165 Inline 6 (1980) running a SEI SE106 Leg Questions

I understand that part. What does it look like? IE - where exactly is it?

On the RHS at the top of the plate inside the transom

 

[achris]

Re: Mercruiser 165 Inline 6 (1980) running a SEI SE106 Leg Questions

On the RHS at the top of the plate inside the transom

That's the trim gauge sender, not the trim limit switch. The trim limit switch is located in the top of the gimbal ring, inside a rubber boot that runs along the top of the bell housing. With the leg trimmed all the way down you'll see a line on the top of the bell housing where the paint is rubbed off. That's where the limit switch runs.

Don S posted up a great picture with all the parts labelled so we are all using the right terminology and nobody is confused (yeah, like it doesn't still happen ) I'll do a search and see if I can find it and edit in a link here for you.....

Chris......
Edit: Here is the link to the post about terminology. Scroll down a bit to see it all.... http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=288430&p=2437200&viewfull=1#post2437200

If you have Manual #2, then on page 27, Section 6A you'll see all you need about the switch and where it hides out...

 

[mnc1960]

Re: Mercruiser 165 Inline 6 (1980) running a SEI SE106 Leg Questions

Hey guys and thanks so much for all of the help, guidance etc. Now, Don s and achris, Thanks guys and I have downloaded the #2 Manual (Absolute Gold) - Thanks. Also to everyone else for their help and photo's etc.

Now for good news, I have sorted out why the forward controls were stiff as - Needed new Throttle cable so have orded one, the selector cables are new and work and select like a dream.

Also found out that the engine is a 1972 model but contacted the original owner and found out quite a few things about this boat. So here goes - Owned boat since 1978, took it out of the water for resto in 2008 and completed most of the resto in 2010 and that includes all internals of engine have been done as well as the leg but not the gimbal etc as her was getting close to running out of the $$$ but had new bearings, boot etc fitted. Since then the boat has only done 60hrs as he also replaced the hrs gauge when the motor and leg were done so he could keep track of the running-in and servicing etc. Guess I will have to follow the running proceedures etc for both the engine and the leg also the leg is still covered by a thre years warranty .

At the moment I am replacing the original sounder with my Garmin 570s unit and the original Marine CB with a new VHF DSC Unit. Still a lot of work to go but I feel it is worth it as I love the feel and character that she has got.

Here are some more pic's of her:

View attachment 119847View attachment 119848View attachment 119849View attachment 119850View attachment 119851

Thanks to all, Max.

 

[achris]

Re: Mercruiser 165 Inline 6 (1980) running a SEI SE106 Leg Questions

...Also found out that the engine is a 1972 model ....

Then you need manual 1. http://www.4shared.com/document/ozc1_97A/Service_Manual_01.html

 

[mnc1960]

Re: Mercruiser 165 Inline 6 (1980) running a SEI SE106 Leg Questions

Thanks once again achris.

Max.

 

[frank246]

Re: Mercruiser 165 Inline 6 (1980) running a SEI SE106 Leg Questions

If you still gonna use a trim switch on the control lever be sure that your trim pump has 2 solenoids (up and down).. the control lever switch wont like the higher amps if you have a trim pump with only the up-solenoid.