Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

[fisherguy123]

Re: Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

The wife says she doesnt want to get into the boat now.....

and do you think that this BOO BOO could be convinsingly faked....ha, ha .......sorry ,just making a bit of humour out of a bad incident .

 

[Badweed]

Re: Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

Ok, so here are some pictures.

I started tapering the crack from the inside when I did the damage the other day.

So what do you guys think?

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

Gel paste alone for any repair will eventually fail. You need to spray it ( to encapsulate from water intrution ).

Myself I would

1. prep the cut area about 6" around the cut. ( inside )
2. Die grind the cut inside to bevel the hard edge off.
3. fill the cut with "mohair" ( poly resin,cabosil and shaved up chopped mat ).
4. without delay lam with 1 layer of 1.5 oz mat and 2-3 layers of 1708.
5. after cured goto the outside and bevel-grind approx. 3-4 " around cut ( you should have a smoth surface now because the crack is allready filled with mohair from the inside ).
6. lam the outside with 3-4 layers of 1.5 oz mat.
7. sand/fair.
8. fill pinholes with poly glazing putty ( do not use the putty to fill lows ).
9. final sand/fair with 80 grit on repair.
10. prep area around repair with 180-220 grit.
11. spray gel-coat with preval sprayer.
12. wetsand and buff.

Good as new.

YD.

PS. Remember that my suggestions or opinions are how I do them. Its not my boat and have the peace of mind knowing when the job is done its done right for the life of the boat ( untill the guy hits the next channel marker ).

Trust this guy..he know what he's talking about....

YD.

 

[Badweed]

Re: Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

Ok, cool.

Can you explain what you mean by die grind?

Thanks

Steve

 

[Badweed]

Re: Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

also, can i use west system colloidal silica in my poly?

 

[Greg Mrozinski]

Re: Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

Bad,

You don't need to make more of this then what it is. What Opps said originally is all you need to do. Poly or epoxy it is up to you but poly works better when you go to gel coat the outside. Clean off on the inside about 6-7" on each side of the slit, fill with peanut butter mix, then lay 3-4 layers of 1708 on the inside. When everything is set finish with the cosmetic repair on the out side - sand the gel back some and then re gel the surface. Sand and buff out. Done!

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

dont worry bud.......it happens to all of us. even pros go thru the hull some times.

unless you are using epoxy with the rest of the boat.....i wouldnt use it....you cant gelcoat over it.

use a structural peanut butter........mix your resin and mekp first......then milled fibers an 1/4 inch chopped strand till its thick.....(milled fibers at minimum 50 percent)
fill the gash and glass over it from the inside........then gell putty it from the out.

easy repair....dont sweat it

cheers
oops

Even oops will agree after seeing the pics that the repair is IN and OUT.

Greg ... " Bad,

You don't need to make more of this then what it is. What Opps said originally is all you need to do. Poly or epoxy it is up to you but poly works better when you go to gel coat the outside. Clean off on the inside about 6-7" on each side of the slit, fill with peanut butter mix, then lay 3-4 layers of 1708 on the inside. When everything is set finish with the cosmetic repair on the out side - sand the gel back some and then re gel the surface. Sand and buff out. Done! "

This repair needs more than that IMO !!

Badweed...Dont smoke that stuff..

YOU NEED I/O REPAIRS .....

This is why I get Pi**ed off ....

There is no other way ......NONE ! And if Anyone tells you otherwise..They are not schooled in the art of Fiberglass..Its just Snake-oil..

Trust YD.

YD.

 

[Greg Mrozinski]

Re: Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

YD,

That's why we have this forum - to share ideas, options and opinions. Why are you getting pi**ed off?? I respect your opinion. I told him to do basically what you told him minus a few layers of CSM on the outside. This is not an ocean going yacht and the area needing repair is not in a critically stressful place in the hull. No wonder the OP's head is probably spinning. Keep it simple. If Badweed wants to weigh all of the opinions presented and take a little from each then fine. It's his boat, he can do whatever he wants to do. Relax!

And by the way, I would not put words in Opps' mouth.

 

[Badweed]

Re: Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

Hey guys,

I appreciate all of your replies. Greg hit the nail on the head as far as my mental status, my head is spinning and I'm freaking out just a little bit. I really wish I hadn't gone through. My life would be much simpler.

But again, I've read a lot about fiberglassing and have finished laying in the stringer on the other side of the boat. I'm looking for some help from people who have done this kind of repair.

Again, thank you all very much.

Steve

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

Im not getting PO'd .. I was saying Why I get PO'd..

OP's head should be spinning !! ( this is not your typical "oh I cut through" ) ..Its not a simple repair ..

3' long is a hole..and a structural repair period.

If anyone has a better repair schedule for this repair then please suggest..

YD.

 

[Badweed]

Re: Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

What do you think about using bondo instead of making the PB mixture for that first layer to fill the crack. That's essentially what bondo is right....resin with milled fibers. I have it on hand although I havent used it and it would save me the time of ordering some.

 

[1fishbone]

Re: Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

Badweed, look at the responses, the YD doesn't take things lightly, his post are spot on...I happened to post the same thing within minutes, I don't type very fast!

No, it's not an ocean going yacht, but this boat rides on a trailer, IMHO as critical as an 'ocean going yacht' If you don't fix 'in-n-out' this area is prone to crack, then it will be harder to fix RIGHT.

This is not something you can't handle, you can fiberglass, you can read the good advice, and you can decide what needs to be done.

As for A LOT of forum advice, you have to read 'through' the garbage...like the guy that swears by Vaseline to polish his boat, or the other guy that replaced his ignition switch and just 'twisted and taped' his ignition wires and now has a problem...read around that junk and the answers are usually here!

 

[1fishbone]

Re: Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

What do you think about using bondo instead of making the PB mixture for that first layer to fill the crack. That's essentially what bondo is right....resin with milled fibers. I have it on hand although I havent used it and it would save me the time of ordering some.

Bondo is for fixing imperfections...NOT for structural repair, it will just crack....under all the layers!

What OPPS and I recommended is MAKE your own, resin, cut up strands and mix, add hardener...no big deal. Whether it's epoxy or poly...same thing

 

[Badweed]

Re: Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

Ok, cool. Is there any other products I can use for the mohair instead of buying and mixing my own. My car buddy gave me some resin with what I thought was short hair contained in the product. Came in a gallon can with a squeeze tube for the hardener.

Also, I have 10 gallons of laminating resin at home....would you use this or would you buy some structure lay-up resin?

 

[1fishbone]

Re: Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

What he gave you for a car, I have used it ...on a fiberglass car!
One name it is known by is Tiger Hair, yes, it smells like poly resin, but no, I wouldn't use it here.
What ever you're using on the stringers, as long as it doesn't have wax in it.

Just use a scissors and cut up some strands of your stringer cloth scraps.

 

[Greg Mrozinski]

Re: Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

Bad,

First off take a deep breath and exhale.

Okay, this is fully repairable damage to your hull. So, no worries. Don't let the bantering about here on this forum disturb you. YD is an expert on yacht repair and knows what he is talking about. He will always give you the absolute nth degree of repair advise because of his expertise. We are all basically telling you the same thing so don't let your unfamiliarity with using fiberglass, resin and "PB" mixes overwhelm you. The reason why some of us are giving you a slightly different approach is because of your lack of familiarity in doing this stuff. Once you get in there and start working on this it is a fast learning curve. So just get in there and start messing with it.

What are your plans for the outside of the boat? Are going to paint or keep the gel coat? Since this slice is on the underside of the boat you need not worry too much at this point about making the bottom look like new. As you gain experience you can always come back and clean, fair, grind re-gel coat, etc.

At this point I would go ahead and grind out on the inside, fill the slice with PB/Mohair mix and lay up several layers of 1708. After that, move on to your stringers and decking. When you get to the outside work then finish the underside of that hull slice.

 

[Badweed]

Re: Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

Ya, at this point I pretty much want it structural. Like you said Greg, my plan was to come back to it when I'm done with the inside glassing and fix it then.....hopefully when I have more experience.

I tapered the inside of the slice this morning and am ready to go as soon as I heat up the shop. The side of the crack that is closest to the middle of the boat likes to flex upwards when left alone so I'm going to put some bracing in a couple spots while the glass cures.

So for the mohair I can just cut up my matting into small pieces? Anything else I can add to the resin to thicken it up some more...or is cab-o-sil the only alternative.

Again, thank you very, very much for all your replies. I know I can fix it, I just don't want it leaking or breaking apart after I go to all this trouble to fix the boat.

BTW, I have been looking at used boats on craigslist. Not really the season, but everything in my price range is 15 to 20 years old and I keep thinking, the devil I know is better than the devil i don't.

 

[ondarvr]

Re: Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

Badweed

Don't stress over this repair, while somewhat long (3') it is pretty easy and straight forward as far as glass work goes.

Grind the inside and taper the edges of the cut out a couple of inches, but grind a much larger area past the taper.

If the hull is flexing or not lining up correctly (This happens sometimes), use a piece of wood and lay it on the outside and screw through the hull from the inside and going into the wood, this will pull the two sides of the cut into alignment. You may need to get creative if its bad, but you'll get it.

A piece of tape on the outside of the cut will keep resin from dripping out.

Glass the inside starting with a layer of mat and then a layer of stitched or woven glass (1708 or roving). You need to build it up at least as thick as the original hull thickness, slightly thicker is fine. The tapered area will be lower than the surrounding surface after you've glassed it, build it up so its even. This can be done right from the start by laying strips in the "V" or as the last step, but I like doing it first.

Pull off the tape (and wood if you needed it) and grind the outside an inch or so away from the cut and fill it with a layer or two of mat, then use gel coat as the finish.

On a short cut or crack glassing on the outside wouldn't be as important, but on a long cut like this there may be some flexing along the cut line. If its only been glassed on the inside, the gel coat and putty repair on the outside may crack again due to the flexing. If you tapered it all the way down to the gel coat from the inside, the chance of cracking would be less, but the added laminate needs to be thicker right at (over) the cut to fill the tapered surface. If it you don't do this the hull on each side of the cut will have a double thickness of glass (the original hull thickness, plus what you added), but right over the cut itself it will only be as thick as the glass you added. This will focus the stress (flex) on the thinner portion of the laminate and that?s where it will do all of the flexing, which can crack the cosmetic repair on the outside.

This would be the method with Polyester, with epoxy just skip the mat, its not needed. You?ll also need to finish the outside with something different because gel coat doesn?t bond all that well to epoxy. Either product will work well and have no issues.

This isn?t much different than what?s already been recommended, just a few reasons added for why the recommendations were made.



I wouldn?t worry at all about the repair after you?re done, it will be just fine.

 

[Greg Mrozinski]

Re: Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

Sounds like a plan my friend.

You can use talcum power also. Some folks even use flour. It will just thicken like the cabosil does. The strength comes from the chopped fibers. Just make sure you fully fill the slice and leave no air bubbles under the 1708.

 

[ondarvr]

Re: Frak.....cut through my hull with a reciprocating saw

I was typing while you were posting, so I didn't see your last one until until I hit submit.