Smart Tabs or Hydrofoil?

[illbreakthat]

I went out on my second ride with my boat today and had the life scared out of myself!! I got the boat moving up to speed and then even though the water was like glass it started boucing and I almost lost control. I pulled back on the throttle and regained it but it did give me a bit of a scare. Now I know now that its called propoising, and have done some reading. Now with out fanboy's and really smart remarks I am serious about finding out what would work best for my situation. The boat is a 1997 Larson Flyer 166 with a 1996 Johnson 90hp Ocean Runner. The weight of the boat is 1080 no fuel no gear, again please no flame wars.

Thank You in advance.

I have added a picture although it doesnt show the transom out of water but I can get one for tommorow during the day time.

 

[Texasmark]

Re: Smart Tabs or Hydrofoil?

Quick answer for me, in looking at you pic (pic worth 1000 words) would be that you have a very short, fat, wetted hull with a lot of hp driving it and one would expect that to be tricky.

I think a whale's tail would get in your way once you learned how to drive your boat.....once having gotten used to it. I'd go for tabs, not necessarily Smart Tabs as I don't know if they are a fixed tab or a dash controllable tab. I'd opt for the dash controllable type so that you can use them when you want them and when you are going for the checkered flag, you can tuck them up and they won't add any drag to your performance.

My 2c,
Mark

 

[Texasmark]

Re: Smart Tabs or Hydrofoil?

Was just thinking while on another thread: You said the boat is a 1997. What have the owners of the boat since new been using to stabilize the boat? If nothing, pretty well says that you need to give yourself time to learn your boat and then you may be happy with it and not have to fool with anything. Just a thought. Additionally you said it is a 1997 Larson "FLYER"....any connotations there? Grin

Mark

 

[lprizman]

Re: Smart Tabs or Hydrofoil?

take a pic of your stern out of the water and send it to john@nauticusinc.com,,,let him advise you on the tabs,,,,I would go with the tabs first as a rule,,,other wise foil as a last resort.
best of luck!!!

 

[nlain]

Re: Smart Tabs or Hydrofoil?

I agree with lprizman and my vote would be the Smart Tabs over the foil, I have them and they are great. I had a foil on my old boat, never did like it and eventually removed it. I will say to run your boat, learn how it responds to trim, rough water, speed, then see what you want to do. Too much trim could have caused your porpoising problem. The Smart Tabs are active all the time due to the gas cylinders.

 

[Texasmark]

Re: Smart Tabs or Hydrofoil?

The Smart Tabs are active all the time due to the gas cylinders.

Well I guess that answers that. I assume they have a sealed piston that is spring or pneumatically loaded, manually adjustable and you set how much lift you want....or drag. Maybe the right choice for normal boating. I guess the real answer is to try both, Smart and the dash mounted remotely controlled to see which suits your boating habits best.....course that's obviously out of the question..........so, to iterate what I previously said, I'd learn your boat and then decide if you need any help or not....I'd think engine height, the right prop, the right trim angle for the speed/conditions can go a long way to make that little sucker a HOT DOG, once you get used to it and learn what it likes and when.

Mark

 

['78 Crusader]

Re: Smart Tabs or Hydrofoil?

Once you learn how to drive a boat and you still have issues, I'd use the Smart Tabs over a Hydrofoil anyday....... Engine mounted foils are a waste of money and mask the true problem.

 

[illbreakthat]

Re: Smart Tabs or Hydrofoil?

Excellent answers and I thank you all for your input. I am going to head out next week for a few days and do some learning with it, I am almost thinking I bought the wrong style of boat maybe but with enough practice I should be able to learn it. I dont run in any kind of heavy waters just mostly small shallow lakes, which I may stick to till I get more used to the boat. From the answers you all have provided me I am going to lean towards getting the Tabs but I am looking at the automatic set that kick in and do the job for me. But I will take a picture tommorow morning and post it as well.

Again Thanks for the imput guys it is a real help.

 

[BiggerDee]

Re: Smart Tabs or Hydrofoil?

Hope this info helps...

I have a 2011 Tahoe Q7i (20' 6") with the 5.0 V-8 (heavy engine!). I took my boat out twice with passengers, and pretty much had to run the entire time with the trim all the way down to prevent severe porpoising. Without reading any reviews first (yes, I know...stupid), I bought the no holes to drill, bolt on Stingray Hydrofoil (Yes, VERY stupid!!). It didn't help much and although it didn't fall off like it does for almost everyone, A big check broke out of the plastic on the second trip, so it probably woldn't have lasted through the third. Of course pretty much everyone on the boards sings the praise of Smart Tabs. Unless you find an install on an identical boat, you still wonder if they are going to really help that much. I bought the SX-80 tabs for my Tahoe since I had the heavy engine (SX-60 probably would work on my boat with the v-6, but I knew that I needed to up it a notch). As painful as it was to drill into my 3 week old boat, I did, and I am VERY happy that I did. I took the boat with the Tabs out for the first time Sunday, and the chop was about 2 feet (Freshwater). WOW!!!! What a difference!! We would have been beat to death without the tabs, but with them, the ride was fine at 32MPH. In protected water with less wind, I could run full out. Instead of having the motor trimmed all the way down to make the V-hull do it's job, I was able to trim normally! This was on the "Start here and adjust as needed" basic setting for the tabs. It's really an entirely new boat, it's so shockingly different. I am truly a believer, and Nauticus can add my name to the list of thrilled customers. The install video is on their website. Watch it a couple of times before you install. It's not hard at all, but take your time and you'll be fine. Don't hesitate to buy and install the tabs. I have been driving boats for about 35 years now and although I've never used Smart Tabs before, I can't imagine not having them now. You won't be disappointed! Call or e-mail them and get their recommendation for the right model/size, install them, and then prepare to be amazed!

Good luck!

 

[illbreakthat]

Re: Smart Tabs or Hydrofoil?

View attachment 111235 So here is the back of the boat but I dont think I can fit the tabs back there cause of the ladder?

 

[nlain]

Re: Smart Tabs or Hydrofoil?

Attachment will not work.

 

[zagger]

Re: Smart Tabs or Hydrofoil?

Hope you don't take it the wrong way but it might be that you need to learn to drive it better. You mentioned water was like glass so that itself would suggest the boat was not trimmed correctly, weight distribution might have been wrong etc. Just haw fast were you going and was it an up/down bow movement or chine walk that you experienced. As others said foil will only help to get out of the hole and can actually make steering harder at faster speed. Installing speed brakes (tabs- I know I'll get flamed for the remark ) should be the last resort. It would be better if you posted more information like number passengers, weight distribution speed/rpm prop type and size. All these could give better clues as to why it was behaving in the way it did. Good luck.

 

[Kaplooi]

Re: Smart Tabs or Hydrofoil?

It would be better if you posted more information like number passengers, weight distribution speed/rpm prop type and size.

+1 on more information. I'm assuming the motor has hydraulic trim? If you were trimmed all the way down (in) on flat water and had serious porpoising you have other problems that tabs or fins is only going to mask. You should be able to get just about any powerboat to porpoise badly with incorrect trim. The more important skill is to learn how to proactively trim to the optimal point where you're just about to porpoise but don't. That lets you run with as much of the boat out of the water as possible without bouncing, which gives the best ride and fuel economy at a given speed.

 

[illbreakthat]

Re: Smart Tabs or Hydrofoil?

I was alone, standard safety gear (with some fishing stuff) RPM was around the 4300-4700 range Speedo is down right now but on GPS it was sitting at around 35 MPH, Prop pitch is a 17 standard 3 blade aluminum. I have had at one time the engine up to around 5200 RPM and felt fast and had no troubles but even setting it at the same trim spot on the gauge I could not find that sweet spot again. I am not going to get discouraged and just sell it to buy a new mountain bike. I am determined to get this settled so next season I can go out with confidence in me and my boat.

No Kaplooi with the motor all the way in it runs fine and drives ok but stays at a max of about 4200 - 4400 RPM, but sounds like I am overworking the motor.

 

[109jb]

Re: Smart Tabs or Hydrofoil?

When underway you trim by feel. You can trim while underway in case you didn't know this. Too far in (down) and the nose will plow real low in the water. Too far out (up) and you get the bow too high and porpoising starts. All the boats I have owned or driven seem to like to be trimmed to where the spray from the chine is right about under the driver's butt. using the trim gauge is an approximation only and on a outboard powered boat is just about useless in my opinion. You can turn your head and see the motor position.

 

[Mi duckdown]

Re: Smart Tabs or Hydrofoil?

I think you are in a learning curve. Practice with your trim postion at different speeds, before going out a buy something you don't need.
Differnt speeds call for differnt trim settings.

 

[zagger]

Re: Smart Tabs or Hydrofoil?

I agree ^^^ as well as different water conditions. One setting that worked yesterday may not work today. The rpm range you reported tells me that you are having difficulty trimming the boat or there is something going on with the prop/engine. Where 200/300 rpm difference at WOT could be attributed to conditions 1000 rpm difference is another story. I would suggest to spend more time at the helm before buying aftermarket stuff. You will also find out that sometime you have to trim out little more and give it more throttle before she stops to bounce, all depends on speed bumps the road has to offer that day.

 

[jbacc11]

Re: Smart Tabs or Hydrofoil?

illbreakthat, what did you end up doing? I have a Larson 1996 Larson Flyer 166 with a Johnson 112 on it. It took me a bit to get used to driving it compared to may last boat that I had for 7 years but wanted to know if you made any changes to the boat or just changed how you drove it.

 

[aspeck]

Re: Smart Tabs or Hydrofoil?

Jbacc11, this is an old, archived thread. Please read the sticky about rules for posting. Threads that have been inactive for 90 days or more should remain inactive unless opened by the OP. if you have a question, please start your own thread. Thank-you.