selling process question

[Taxus812]

In this case, It means it has a registration number issued by the state for the boat when it was first registered. We have them on the side and they are assigned for the life of the boat. If it is a new boat or is coming from out of state there is a different set of rules.

 

[NicoPags]

How in the world does the bank protect their interest in the boat without a way to enforce the lien? And worse yet, how does a buyer know that the boat they are buying is free of liens - so that someone doesn't do what you are suggesting and then never pay it off?

I know we have different systems between countries. However here in Ontario, Can we do secured marine with no registration loans on anything under 25k. I'm a Financial Advisor with one of the big banks I've done roughly 8 Marine Loans and all secured and only had to register one of them. I think it's a crazy way but our system could be somewhat of a sister of the way in CT where as if someone decided to not pay it's just easier to write it off than the bank repo a boat and try to sell it.

 

[Taxus812]

The funny part there is a "Title" from 2002 (I have a front and back copy with ownership transferred to me and Lien listed as None) apparently it is not required. The bank holds it but I assume it is moot point. Kinda scary as a buyer.

If I let the shop sell it (which im leaning towards, no pun intended) then they take ownership presale and I wash my hands. I f I sell it I plan to have everything ready to go.

 

[muskyfins]

I guess I'm the odd one out here. I have no problem buying or selling a vehicle without a dealer/broker involved.

HOWEVER-i only deal in CA$H or wire transfer.

A few years ago, a friend of mine was selling a Harley motorcycle. He had already bought his new one, and so tranferred the insurance to it. He makes a deal with a guy over the course of a few days. They agree on a price and the man brings a cashier's check on Saturday afternoon. He loads bike onto trailer and drives away. By Monday morning, my friend deposits check only to find out later that it is no good. It had been stolen from a bank several years prior.

 

[oldjeep]

I guess I'm the odd one out here. I have no problem buying or selling a vehicle without a dealer/broker involved.

HOWEVER-i only deal in CA$H or wire transfer.

A few years ago, a friend of mine was selling a Harley motorcycle. He had already bought his new one, and so tranferred the insurance to it. He makes a deal with a guy over the course of a few days. They agree on a price and the man brings a cashier's check on Saturday afternoon. He loads bike onto trailer and drives away. By Monday morning, my friend deposits check only to find out later that it is no good. It had been stolen from a bank several years prior.

I think you are missing the point of the thread. The point is that the boat has a lien on it, which complicates things for both the seller and buyer.

 

[muskyfins]

NO, I understood the point. Several posts advocate the use of a broker for this situation. My point is that I don't feel it's necessary. Take buyer and cash to bank and get title to hand to buyer on the spot. (it may be necessary to make arrangements in advance so the bank can be prepared) If new buyer will require bank financing, the banks can work together to wire transfer the money and send the title directly from sellers bank to buyers bank. I've done this on a number of occasions.

(yes, I also understand we're seemingly passed this point since CT has no titles for boats. But if the OP is selling without a broker involved, I still suggest cash or wire transfer only)

 

[dazk14]

Since there is no Title, the loan/lien would normally be registered with the Secretary of State.

 

[bruceb58]

A few years ago, a friend of mine was selling a Harley motorcycle. He had already bought his new one, and so tranferred the insurance to it. He makes a deal with a guy over the course of a few days. They agree on a price and the man brings a cashier's check on Saturday afternoon. He loads bike onto trailer and drives away. By Monday morning, my friend deposits check only to find out later that it is no good. It had been stolen from a bank several years prior.

I accept cashiers checks but only after I have verified the cashiers check with the bank.

 

[Taxus812]

OK just summing it all up

option 1 broker - Stupid simple easy for all since there is a Lien. Negative is the broker needs to get paid

Option 2 Private Sale in CT - Safe way
Agree on price
Contact bank request that we transfer ownership at bank
Buyer brings two bank checks on for bank one for me (or wire transfer)
Bank releases lien when check clears.
I complete bill of sale(s) (boat and trailer are separate sales)
Buyer take boat home when they register the trailer
Mail any title the bank may have when\if I get it. Not required since CT is does not title boats.

Option 3 - Private Sale in CT - Std way
Agree on price
Buyer brings Bank Check or makes wire transfer
I complete bill of sale(s) (boat and trailer are separate sales)
Pay off Lien
Seller takes boat home when they register the trailer and bank check clears
Mail any title\release of Lien the bank may have when\if I get it.

 

[Taxus812]

feels more like a hostage exchange

 

[oldjeep]

OK just summing it all up


Option 2 Private Sale in CT - Safe way
Agree on price
Contact bank request that we transfer ownership at bank
Buyer brings two bank checks on for bank one for me (or wire transfer)
Bank releases lien when check clears.
I complete bill of sale(s) (boat and trailer are separate sales)
Buyer take boat home when they register the trailer
Mail any title the bank may have when\if I get it. Not required since CT is does not title boats.

Typically the bank would require that you pay the lien since you are the responsible party

Contact bank request that we transfer ownership at bank
Buyer does wire transfer to your account
You do wire transfer to bank once their wire transfer clears (in minutes while you are there)
Bank releases lien

That is the process that occurs when you buy a boat from a private party with a loan, but in reverse

Bank funds loan by wire transfer into loan holders account
Money is wired from loan holders account to sellers account (or they can create a cashiers check)


In any event, ask your lien holder how their particular process works so that you are able to describe it to any potential buyers.

 

[smokeonthewater]

You DO NOT have the legal right to sell this boat before paying off the lien.... If you do so you violate the contract you signed with the bank and are subject to prosecution..... Paying off the lien after the sale MAY keep the bank from pressing charges BUT you WOULD be GUILTY none the less....

The ONLY legal way to sell this boat is to satisfy the lien before transferring ownership.... If you do it yourself that means either the buyer would have to trust you with the money (maybe they are foolish enough) OR all 3 parties buyer, seller, and lender need to meet to complete transaction...

Honestly, why not just keep the boat..... have it shipped and put it in storage till you get settled.. surely that would cost less than the survey and 15% cut with the broker.

 

[Taxus812]

ok option 3 should be modified to be

Option 3 - Private Sale in CT - Std way
Agree on price
Buyer brings Bank Checks made to bank for payoff of lien and rest to me or makes wire transfer
I complete bill of sale(s) (boat and trailer are separate sales)
Pay off Lien and get release of lien
Seller takes boat home when they register the trailer
Mail any title paperwork the bank may have when

Honestly the bank told me to get payment and they will send a release of lien.

 

[tpenfield]

Good intentions will not be punished. . . This whole thing is making my head hurt

 

[muskyfins]

Good intentions will not be punished. . . This whole thing is making my head hurt

I thought it was "no good deed goes unpunished"

 

[tpenfield]

I thought it was "no good deed goes unpunished"

That is the common saying, of course, it means that good deeds get punished . . . .

 

[Taxus812]

Honestly, why not just keep the boat..... have it shipped and put it in storage till you get settled.. surely that would cost less than the survey and 15% cut with the broker.

Oh boy now you asked for it a long winded story

I don't want to sell it. I really like my boat (so does my wife).it is everything I want. It was heartbreaking to uncover it and start it up last week. If I sell it I will likely shed a tear. However fact is, it is in the perfect condition to sell it now. Everything is in working order. brand new prop. new covers, all the servicing is up to date. There is even a full tank of treated fuel and oil.

The housing market is horrible we have to get the house in top condition to break even. Our cost to live in CT is very high and with my wife disabled things get tight now. Not having a loan to pay will have an impact. (Honestly keeping up on the boats maintenance will be hard to do with everything else going on anyway). The right course is to sell the boat, work on debt and sell the house. Do anything I can to bring the total cost to live down as much as possible. We plan to move near family in the Tampa area. I'm a vet so I can still get a home loan with little no down payment. I would keep my CT pay even in Florida since I am a remote worker.


Some day when things stabilize I can buy another one.

 

[JoLin]

ok option 3 should be modified to be

Option 3 - Private Sale in CT - Std way
Agree on price
Buyer brings Bank Checks made to bank for payoff of lien and rest to me or makes wire transfer
I complete bill of sale(s) (boat and trailer are separate sales)
Pay off Lien and get release of lien
Seller takes boat home when they register the trailer
Mail any title paperwork the bank may have when

Honestly the bank told me to get payment and they will send a release of lien.

As I posted previously, I bought a boat under similar circumstances. The buyer should be able to get a satisfaction letter on the spot from the loan officer at the bank. In my case, the lienholder was in a different state. I personally coordinated with the loan officer by phone. I wired the money and she faxed over the letter. All I'm saying is that, as the buyer, I didn't want the seller to handle any money earmarked for the bank. Maybe I was nitpicking, but that was MY $10K going to a third party. I never let it out of my sight.

My .02

 

[Taxus812]

First I want to thank you all for your help. I has been very helpful


I now have spoken with the DMV, all of you as buyers and now the Bank (again). I have my ducks in a row.

Legally I am fine to take full payment for the boat then pay the lien. There is no issue with order whether they pay me or, split the payment. the intent is to pay the lien. (If I don't pay the lien or stop payment on the loan then it another issue, with both the bank and the buyer). In CT there is no Titling for boats but it will show up as having a lien at the DMV. The bank files the lien at something called the UCC with the state.

If I take cash or wire transfer and the bank will release the lien on the spot and provide a release of lien. If payment is a check or bank check it will not release until funds clear.

Soooooooooo

it is all what makes the buyer comfortable.
If they want to wait for the lien release they don't have to

The simplest process is
Disclose I have a loan that will need to paid
Agree on price
Next steps can be at the same time at the bank or over a week

Buyer brings Bank Checks made to bank for payoff of lien and rest to me, or makes wire transfer ,or pays me in full. it doesn't matter its the buyers choice. I will suggest the first
I complete bill of sale(s) (boat and trailer are separate sales)
Pay off Lien and get release of lien and provide it to the buyer​

Seller takes boat home when they register the trailer


Once again I appreciate the help. By having the process down I can make it a better sale for the buyer.

 

[dazk14]

As I indicated, the UCC is filed with the Secretary of State in CT.