opinions on late 80's bayliners? I hear they have some issues

[mickyryan]

if its over 5 yrs old and outside its rotted
grass or ferns growing out of carpet? there is ya sign
no cover and upholstery rotten its probably rotted
if the first thing they say is its got a solid floor .... might be rotted
I just assume every boat about 5 yrs or older might be rotted that way when and if it isn't I'm pleasantly surprised.

 

[Scott Danforth]

^ thanks ondarvr. question. How would I know that that boat has good stringers, deck etc and won't need a rebuild? It doesn't say the year so it might be from the 80's or even earlier. I guess I'm just confused about how one might be able to tell that that boat won't need a rebuild, but other boats near portland that look just as nice are likely to be rotted. What gives that one away as not likely to be rotted, just for my own education?
thanks!!

if it was stored outside = bad
if it was stored with the plug in it = bad
if there are signs of mildew and mold (or moss) = bad
if it was washed every trip, dried off with a towel, plug pulled and stored in a garage = better chance it may be good

just out of curiosity, why are you so hung up on boats from the 80's?

with a 10k budget you can buy boats at least 15-20 years newer

 

[ezmobee]

can I ask, what is the difference between a chieftain and an islander? They look very similar to me spec-wise

Typically same hull. Islander has a short stubby cabin with more deck space, Chieftain has less deck space but a larger cabin.

 

[littlebunker]

@ezmobee: thanks!

@scottdanforth: gotcha. re: 80's boats: I don't prefer 80's boats. I was just happened to be looking at an 80's bayliner, and then since we were all talking about 80's boats, I was wondering about the construction techniques so I could be more informed next time I happened to be looking at an 80's boat

At this point, I'm thinking more like a aluminum as has been suggested here. Problem I'm seeing is that most aluminums either tend to be out of my price range, OR they tend to be older and so they don't have a v hull.

I would love some recommendations of boats to keep my eye out for, but around here, it kinda seems like most of the boats between 5 and 10k are from the 80s or even 70s. The ones that aren't tend to be more for like lake waterskiing (they're really low and sporty) but I'm looking for something more to do saltwater fishing.
that being said, there are a number of boats that don't list a year and maybe those are all newer. But most of the ones I see with years are from the 80s so I wonder if part of me didn't just figure that that's what 5-10k gets you?

 

[EricT71]

One big thing to remember when you are buying any used boat- you need to check out the owner almost as much as the boat. It is mentioned in the sticky. Things that are good signs- they have owned the boat for a long time or better yet, they are the only owner it has had. How do they conduct themselves, do they speak about the boat as if they care about it? Can they provide service records? Can they account for where and how it was stored? How do they take care of their house, yard, car, etc?

I personally would not buy a used boat from a dealer or lot that would not put me in direct contact with the former owner.

I do not think it is impossible to find an older used boat in great shape, but you have to put the time in doing your homework, research, and some luck helps too. It's like anything else, you get out what you put in.

 

[tpenfield]

It is always nice to have an understanding of the previous owner and the boat's overall history when buying a used boat. Even with that amount of diligence though, you can still end up with a boat needing significant work. Look at Baylinerchuck 's current thread for example.

I think some of the tech tools (moisture meters, IR cameras, etc) can help in finding that 25 year old diamond in the rough, but without such, it can be really hard for someone without a lot of boat buying experience to tell.

 

[jkust]

A boat from the 80's or 90's could have gone through ten owners by now. At that point it's up to me to do my diligence and assume the worst and work backwards. On a five or ten year old boat or a special circumstances situation, sure I pay attention to the owner.

 

[littlebunker]

cool, thanks. I'm going to look into aluminums. I'm going to look at starcrafts but any other 20-25 feet v hull aluminums I should be keeping my eyes out for? thanks

 

[mickyryan]

not to start that fight up but why aluminum? I would take a 20 yr old fiberglass over aluminum but then I fear thousands of rivets and electrolysis

 

[littlebunker]

Well, I guess I just don't trust myself yet to look at a boat and to be able to tell if it's rotted or not. Aluminum seems like there's not much to rot, and if it is rotted, it seems like an easier and quicker fix. with fiberglass, if I get something rotted, it looks like I'll have to pull up the floor, and then spend a week grinding out the stringers, and then another week, cleaning it, and then another week glassing new stringers in, and then another week putting in the floor before I can use it again. Aluminum seems like.... nothing really that can rot below decks. If things are rotted, it will either be the deck or the transom. If transom, kind of seems like it's a fairly quick (like weekend) replacement, and if decks, same thing. Don't need to wait for glass to dry, don't need to mess with stringers, seems easier for a novice.

Another factor, that wasn't mentioned but that I kind of like: aluminum seems to be much lighter towing. I have a truck, but towing cap is 3000 pounds, and a lot of 20+ foot glass boats seem much heavier than that.

I get that there are nice glass boats out there, but I can't afford new, so I'd be looking for boats from the 90s. That's 20 years old, and from what I'm gathering here, any 10+ year old boat has a high chance of being rotted. I'd rather not deal with a rotted boat



EDIT: Another thing that I just thought of: I have a rivet gun, but I don't have fiberglass equipment!

 

[ondarvr]

You under estimated the amount of time to fix a fiberglass hull.

 

[littlebunker]

^ Ha! Fair point. I was just kinda of throwing out numbers, but my point was that it takes a long time

...and that's why aluminum because I clearly know nothing about fixing fiberglass!

 

[mickyryan]

well whatever you decide good luck and we here to cheer ya on on ya restore or fixer upper or just to snicker and throw popcorn at you from afar "in good fun of course"

 

[Old Ironmaker]

I am a StarCraft guy. Superfisherman 190. I have pals that have Star Crafts as well. 1 is a 21 foot centre council Heritage, another has an Islander cuddy and 1 has a restored this year early or mid 80's 19 footer, we don't know the model. All are good solid boats from the 90's. Each and everyone has it's advantages and ride differently. Mine has a deeper V than the 21 foot Heritage but the Heritage will handle the same water conditions as mine which looks to have a deeper V design. You seem to be hung up on this "deepV" hull design. I have been in 18 foot glass boats that are not what would be considered a deep V feel to me more of a solid ride than the 21 foot Star Craft in similar conditions because it is more stable and has far less bumps and bounces because of the glass construction and sheer weight increase. I don't really understand why a seller wouldn't post or know the year of his boat, no paper work? That is sort of important.

This past winter 4 of us took a early to mid 80's 19' StarCraft down to it's bare bones and splashed it in late May. Someone had started the restoration and gave up. The boat was bought for $900.00, no trailer or engine. We didn't work on it everyday but put in at least 20 to 30 man hours per week, I want to under estimate, from November to May. A rough calculation says it all added up to about 500 to 700 man hours, probably more. Some weeks I didn't see the boat, I was the detail guy, cleaning all and everything that came off of it, railings, swim ladder,carpeting, seats, paint prep, repainted the new to the boat used outboard, things of that nature. I wasn't there to see all of the hull repairs but I do know they bought 2 boxes of rivets with 500 and each box and there was 1/3 of a box left over. That was extensive. Plus there were a few spots where small sections of the hull had to be veneered with aluminum where there were cracks, mostly where the stringers met the side of the hull. You won't know what is really needed until the floor and foam is all removed. That task was not fun. That sprayed in foam had to be removed with a butter knife in the hard to get to spots.

I won't go into a complete restoration history but the point I want to make is you don't know what you have until you start surgery. It is important to stress that if it looks good it hopefully is good. If it looks like a basket case you are into a full out resto. And time is not your enemy the budget is. After all the hull repair the boat leaks, a small leak but it leaks. Most likely the transom that looked solid as a rock. That is one reason I didn't enter it in the Star Craft Splash of the Year thread. The main reason it wasn't my boat and we/he didn't make any notes for timeline and materials used and he cheaped out on some things that just weren't done right because of a growing and it grew quickly budget. All in he has $14,000.00 CDN. I bet he could have bought a very nice newer boat for that, no I don't think I know. It really is more than that because I know I didn't charge him a dime. I just got 1/2 of a nice size Deer for my labour.

I have to ask and I'm sorry if I missed it, what conditions do you intend on boating in? We are on Lake Erie and there are times no pleasure boat is big enough. I will boat in 1 meter or less waves only if I have to. Which means when it starts kicking up unexpectedly I'm heading back to the Marina. Plus I find no fun trying to fish bobbing up and down like a cork. The conditions will dictate the design, construction, power and size of the boat you are looking for. Trailering is an important issue you mention. We can get the Islander a pal has in and out of the water in minutes when everyone does their job. The 24 foot Owens Cuddy is another matter. When it's time to crank the last 6" onto the mast everyone disappears. I wish he would get an electric winch. Plus pulling it with the 1/2 ton 4X4 you know there is a boat behind you. With the same truck you can't tell the 21 foot Star Craft is there without looking in the mirror. Oh my look at the time, my index fingers are sore too. Good luck in your search. I wish you luck. Finding an old boat is the easy part and it took me 3 years of looking every week. I found a few I wanted to buy but didn't because there was not a paper trail and I didn't let the boat or price blind me, that can happen only for the owner to have to jump through, over and under many hoops to make it legal, not worth it.