Is electronic conversion a simple drop in?

[thumpar]

Re: Is electronic conversion a simple drop in?

The instructions that come with the unit have more info than what was posted. There is a diagram for external and internal resistor coils. You will want to keep the coil wiring the same if you stay with the stock type coil, but you will need to add a 12v line to the ignitor module.

 

[renken83]

Re: Is electronic conversion a simple drop in?

So the wire itself is the resistor? The instructions that came with the unit have 3 diagrams and the one with the resistor and elec. module shows the red lead from the electronic module going to the incoming side of the resistor (shown as a box in the diagram) so that's why I thought the resistor was an actual unit, not the wire itself. This also lead me to think that the ignitor module needs 12V, not the coil.

So, if my COIL needs an external resistor and I run full 12V to it, it won't get cooked? Or is the resisance just in place so the points don't get cooked? For testing purposes, I can remove the wires from the + side of the coil and use my elec. tester to see which wire is which, correct? I don't want to connect the battery if I have things wired wrong and risk burning somethig up.

I appreciater your patience!

 

[MikDee]

Re: Is electronic conversion a simple drop in?

So the wire itself is the resistor?

Yes!

The instructions that came with the unit have 3 diagrams and the one with the resistor and elec. module shows the red lead from the electronic module going to the incoming side of the resistor (shown as a box in the diagram) so that's why I thought the resistor was an actual unit, not the wire itself. This also lead me to think that the ignitor module needs 12V, not the coil.

They both need 12volts, so just put the red wire on the (Plus+) side of the coil, Along with a 12volt switched (ign key) non resistor wire, and the starter wire (it should be 3 wires total)

So, if my COIL needs an external resistor and I run full 12V to it, it won't get cooked? Or is the resisance just in place so the points don't get cooked? For testing purposes, I can remove the wires from the + side of the coil and use my elec. tester to see which wire is which, correct? I don't want to connect the battery if I have things wired wrong and risk burning somethig up.
I appreciater your patience!

Forget about the resistor, unless your Ignitor instructions call for one. The resistor is only there to keep your points from getting cooked, thats the only reason you have that "Warning on the coil!", thats all it is, a warning not to use points without a resistor,,, Your coil will be fine to use as is, it does not need a resistor.

Many years ago cars used to have a little white ceramic ballast resistor, it's almost obsolete, it's all in the wiring now.

Yes, use your elec. meter on the wires on the Plus + side of the coil, one should be a full 12volts when cranking, and prob dead all other times, The other should be the resistor wire (ignition) and read around 6 volts or less.
Somewhere in here, there Might be the shift interrupt wires?

The other side of the coil, will feed the Dizzy, and the Tach, once you put 12volts to the Plus + side of the coil.

 

[renken83]

Re: Is electronic conversion a simple drop in?

O.k., I'm either onto something or I've burned another evening and am about to go on a drinking binge!

As MikDee pionted out, the resistor wire is indeed purple...or at least in the diagram it is! However, I do not have a purple resistor wire on the + side of the coil. There is a brown wire and a purple/yellow wire which runs to the starter motor and only cranks 12V upon starting. Back to the brown wire, it reads 10.52V with the ignition switch on. I cannot find a full 12V switched wire anywhere!!! The purple wire going to the choke also reads 10.52V. So, is 10.52V as good as it gets?

Time for a drink!!!

 

[MikDee]

Re: Is electronic conversion a simple drop in?

Ok, back to basics, only one of the wires on the coil is ignition (Run) off the key. From what you described, it's the brown wire. So, I would say that's the resistor wire (altough I thought it should be purle/yellow?). Now, on the back top of the motor is the shift cable mount, which has a microswitch in it to momentarily kill the engine as you shift, this is in the circuit between the key, & the coil. Basically it's an on/off switch, that MIGHT have a full 12volts going into it? with the brown resistor wire coming out of it to go to the coil? This needs to be DETERMINED! (get out your meter again), If so, then theoretically just replace the resistor wire from the Shift Interrupt switch, to the coil, and you should have a full 12volt (off the key) switched source for running.

Or, if my theory turns out to be all shot to hell You still need a 12volt switched source from somewhere, but either way it needs to go through your Shift Interrupter switch first, then to the coil, or you can damage your outdrive without this!

 

[renken83]

Re: Is electronic conversion a simple drop in?

Thank MikDee. I'll look for the cable mount with the switch in it. Just for clarity, the diagram shows a purple and a purple/yellow wire on the + side of the coil. I have a brown wire and a purple/yellow wire so I do believe you are correct that the brown is the resistor wire.

There is a switch (looks like a switch to me anyway) on the front (bow) side of the motor, on the opposite side of the motor from the coil and distributor, just above the alternator. There is a bundle of wires running around the front of the motor (from the bundle that runs to the coil) to this "switch" and the alternator. The shift cable ends and there is a flat metal piece on the switch that would be depressed when the cable moves. There's two posts on the switch and two wires coming off each. One is tan (possibly brown but faded?) but none have even the 10.52V, let alone 12V on them. Although there is continuity between the tan wire and brown wire on the coil, but that in of itself isn't a surefire diagnostic. This switch couldn't be the interupter switch could it?

 

[MikDee]

Re: Is electronic conversion a simple drop in?

Thank MikDee. I'll look for the cable mount with the switch in it. Just for clarity, the diagram shows a purple and a purple/yellow wire on the + side of the coil. I have a brown wire and a purple/yellow wire so I do believe you are correct that the brown is the resistor wire.

There is a switch (looks like a switch to me anyway) on the front (bow) side of the motor, on the opposite side of the motor from the coil and distributor, just above the alternator. There is a bundle of wires running around the front of the motor (from the bundle that runs to the coil) to this "switch" and the alternator. The shift cable ends and there is a flat metal piece on the switch that would be depressed when the cable moves. There's two posts on the switch and two wires coming off each. One is tan (possibly brown but faded?) but none have even the 10.52V, let alone 12V on them. Although there is continuity between the tan wire and brown wire on the coil, but that in of itself isn't a surefire diagnostic. This switch couldn't be the interupter switch could it?

I'm used to looking at the V6 & V8 I/O's shift cable switch location, your 4cyl might be in a different location, But, That sure sounds like the Microswitch, if you turn on the key it should be energized if you are in neutral, when you put one test probe on each wire post, between them, it should give you a reading (as long as your coil wires are hooked back up as was originally!), then if you gently depress the little flat lever, it should show momentarily no voltage (off)

Or, In other words, it should show contunuity between the 2 microswitch posts, and none when the lever is depressed. Next, you need try to determine if you have a full 12volts coming into the switch, and less at the very end of the wire that comes out of the switch, (probably at the coil) if so, that's your resistor wire to be replaced.

 

[Fishermark]

Re: Is electronic conversion a simple drop in?

Just to clarify - yes, the shift interrupt switch needs to be in the circuit - but it is on the (-) negative side, not the (+) positive side. When the switch is activated, it simply goes to ground. It is wired into the negative side of the coil and has nothing to do with the switched 12v to the positive side.

Also, if you want, you CAN keep the resistor wire - you simply need to make sure the Ignitor gets a full twelve volts. Someone noted above that I did not post the complete instructions. That's true. Here's some more - it shows what to do if you do away with the resistor wire -vs- keeping the resistor wire in the circuit:

ALSO - I believe you noted that you trimmed the gromment instead of filing the distributor cap. Again, the instructions are clear that you should file the cap:

 

[renken83]

Re: Is electronic conversion a simple drop in?

Doh! I'm thinking I had the coil unhooked when I checked that switch MikDee!:redface: I'll recheck.

Thanks for clarifying Fishermark. Yeah, I'm just trying to find a 12V post/wire I can connect to...thats all. I'm thinking of running wire all the way from the ignition switch itself! Didn't want to use that much wire but I would have saved some time if I did it that way to begin with

No, I trimmed the grommet AND filed the cap, but thanks for checking. The grommet runs down an inch or so of the wires and since the notch it was to go out of (on the bottom of the distributor and plate) was facing the motor, I only have about 3/4" of space and with the full length of the grommet, the wires were laying right on the motor. I only trimmed back the "to the coil" side of the grommet so the wires could make the bend w/o resting up against the motor. The part of the grommet that fills in the space filed in the cap is still intact.

 

[thumpar]

Re: Is electronic conversion a simple drop in?

There is a 12v wire in the bundle above the coil. Just remove some electrical tape and tap in to it. I think it is the pink wire but you can check it to make sure.

 

[cgrooves]

Re: Is electronic conversion a simple drop in?

edit: re-read thread and saw my answer.

 

[MikDee]

Re: Is electronic conversion a simple drop in?

Just to clarify - yes, the shift interrupt switch needs to be in the circuit - but it is on the (-) negative side, not the (+) positive side. When the switch is activated, it simply goes to ground. It is wired into the negative side of the coil and has nothing to do with the switched 12v to the positive side..

I don't think so Mark, a microswitch as used in the S.I. just breaks the circuit, it doesn't ground anything. Besides, your distributor itself is ground, or grounded, through it's base, that's what makes the points spark, when they open, and that ground is broken. As far as I know the small negative (-) coil wire goes directly to the distributor uniterrupted. That's why I still think the S.I. is on the incoming (plus +) terminal of the coil, not the negative (-) side.

Also, if you want, you CAN keep the resistor wire - you simply need to make sure the Ignitor gets a full twelve volts.

ALSO - I believe you noted that you trimmed the gromment instead of filing the distributor cap. Again, the instructions are clear that you should file the cap.

As I mentioned previously, maybe you could also tap into the electric choke wire (if you have one?) You just have to see what the voltage is on that? It should also be a switched full 12volt source (working off the ignition cycle "Run" off the key), check that as well.

 

[Fishermark]

Re: Is electronic conversion a simple drop in?

Here's a wiring diagram from an older Mercruiser manual, but I believe the wiring for the shift interrupt is the same for an engine with points. Note the wiring goes from the negative side - through the normally open shift interupt - then to ground. The three negative wires - 1) points; 2) tach; 3) shift interrupt switch. (Called a Shift interlock switch in the diagram below) :

 

[renken83]

Re: Is electronic conversion a simple drop in?

Yes, it is the shift interupter as I thought. When the gear cable moves, it depresses the metal strip which depresses a button and there is no reading on the tester. However, while there is juice to it, it's only 10.2V, not 12. AND, the electic choke wire also reads 10.2V (not 10.52 as I mentioned earlier). I think I already said that the + side of the coil, as is, reads 10.2 also. On top of that, I unwrapped the wire bundle just above the coil (orange, pink, 2blacks, 3purples, a grey or two) and NONE were switched 12V. Wire insulation looks like swiss cheese now. The orange and pink were constant 12V with the key on or off. The others? 10.2V and a couple 8.?V when the ignition switch was on. So, I figured why run over to the S.I. to get 10.2V when I can get 10.2V at the + side of the coil. So I hooked the red wire from the electronic module to the + side of the coil, loosened the distributor, backed off the idle adjustment screw and set the timing. I'm not giving up, just moving forward.
Feel free to warn me if I'm really going to mess something up

 

[MikDee]

Re: Is electronic conversion a simple drop in?

Here's a wiring diagram from an older Mercruiser manual, but I believe the wiring for the shift interrupt is the same for an engine with points. Note the wiring goes from the negative side - through the normally open shift interupt - then to ground. The three negative wires - 1) points; 2) tach; 3) shift interrupt switch. (Called a Shift interlock switch in the diagram below) :

Well Mark, That's proof enough on how the S. I. works

Another thing I noticed in the schematic, is that at the main electrical plug, It appears that the resistor wire begins there on #5 socket, previous to that towards the key seems like a full 12volts. Maybe something delivering a full 12volts switched off the key, could be rigged to the coil, from there?

 

[renken83]

Re: Is electronic conversion a simple drop in?

Thanks for all the input! The gentleman that sold me the ignitor said I should be able to just hook up to the + side of the coil. Since I already had and that I had 10+ volts there, I set the timing and took her out. Ran great! Also used some Deep Creep to de-carb and after a couple minor "pops" she reved up nice and smooth.

 

[saints5]

Re: Is electronic conversion a simple drop in?

On mine when I installed the magnet sleave the top of the sleave prevented the rotor from sliding on the distributor shaft as far down as it should. I had to trim 1/4" off the bottom of the rotor. Is there a different rotor to use?

 

[Fishermark]

Re: Is electronic conversion a simple drop in?

saints5 - welcome to the board! You might want to start a new thread instead of tacking on the bottom of an old one. The chances are better that someone will see it.