Is AWD worth the upgrade on a new SUV?

[JustJason]

I have a Tundra with the 5.7. Except for the fact that it gets like 9 miles to the gallon around town, I like it. It will tow a space shuttle.

 

[robopath]

I would probably take the Pathfinder. I've towed with a Pathfinder, Pilot, RX350, and now a Sequoia.
The Pathfinder will feel the most secure for it's size. 6,000# is a pretty high tow rating for a 4400# vehicle. My 2008 Pilot for example was only 3500# for about the same dry weight.

 

[jkust]

I'll just mention that I believe this is the last year they will produce the Durango. Should be a corresponding decrease in price in the used market as there was with Pontiac, Saturn and SAAB. As for the Yukon, as it turns out I'm getting to the point of needing a larger tow vehicle which would also be my wife's daily driver. I'm am thinking I will actually be going with the Yukon Denali XL for the 6.2 liter and the extra size for back and forth to the cabin. I thought my wife would be afraid of one and she didn't balk at all on the size of them. I won't be buying any more 5.3 liters, as I currently own two, given their propensity to use oil due to the AMF system which is another reason for the Denali version of the Yukon for me. As to the original question...the Yukon Denali is an on demand AWD vehicle unlike the suburban that has high and low range. It is the one or two times a year you truly need it that you wished you had purchased it. I say that even though my wife's current Rainier (one of the 5.3 liter vehicles) had to have it's entire AWD system replaced way prematurely (good thing for warranties). There are some ramps, I wouldn't have made it out of even with a G80 Locking Rear Differential it has (not a limited slip but a full locker).

 

[cdnNick]

I'd imagine Dodge would replace it with something, it would be a big hole in their lineup with out the Durango. I'm having a tough time wanting to buy another Dodge, I've owned a few over the years and none of them have been very good. My mom owned one and it was terrible.

I think at this point I have to get my wife to test drive a Yukon/Tahoe to see if it's something she would consider driving, she likes the tiny little hatchbacks. Mind you she won't be driving this very often.

 

[jkust]

I'd imagine Dodge would replace it with something, it would be a big hole in their lineup with out the Durango. I'm having a tough time wanting to buy another Dodge, I've owned a few over the years and none of them have been very good. My mom owned one and it was terrible.

I think at this point I have to get my wife to test drive a Yukon/Tahoe to see if it's something she would consider driving, she likes the tiny little hatchbacks. Mind you she won't be driving this very often.

I think they will just rely on the Jeep GC. Same I think with the situation where Chrysler is now only going to make the Town and Country Minivan and cease production of the Dodge Caravan. I'm very frugal with vehicles and so GM's have always done a good job of depreciating pretty quickly so even a three or 4 year old low mile GM has taken a pretty big depreciation clip. My current SUV/daily driver is a GM and I've hit almost 92k miles on it and just now it is finally having it's very first thing go bad which is the left front wheel bearing which is a $40 dollar part. Point being I've had very fortunate luck with GM's having spent almost zero on repairs cumulatively on all of them combined and I drive them generally until there is very little value left. My Wife's Rainier is the only exception but luckily had a 0 dollar deductible GM extended warranty on it as it has would have cost thousands and thousands of dollars in expensive repairs point being I really think you just get lucky with some vehicles and unlucky with others.

 

[oldjeep]

I think they will just rely on the Jeep GC. Same I think with the situation where Chrysler is now only going to make the Town and Country Minivan and cease production of the Dodge Caravan. I'm very frugal with vehicles and so GM's have always done a good job of depreciating pretty quickly so even a three or 4 year old low mile GM has taken a pretty big depreciation clip. My current SUV/daily driver is a GM and I've hit almost 92k miles on it and just now it is finally having it's very first thing go bad which is the left front wheel bearing which is a $40 dollar part. Point being I've had very fortunate luck with GM's having spent almost zero on repairs cumulatively on all of them combined and I drive them generally until there is very little value left. My Wife's Rainier is the only exception but luckily had a 0 dollar deductible GM extended warranty on it as it has would have cost thousands and thousands of dollars in expensive repairs point being I really think you just get lucky with some vehicles and unlucky with others.

I agree since the GC is basically the same vehicle and outsells the Durango by a wide margin already.

As for the rest, I don't think you'll find many modern vehicles of any brand that are having expensive issues before 100K miles. Vehicles are just built better across the board now. Occasionally you get a turd like the Raineer, but on the whole most modern cars are pretty reliable.

 

[jkust]

I agree since the GC is basically the same vehicle and outsells the Durango by a wide margin already.

As for the rest, I don't think you'll find many modern vehicles of any brand that are having expensive issues before 100K miles. Vehicles are just built better across the board now. Occasionally you get a turd like the Raineer, but on the whole most modern cars are pretty reliable.

The thing is that the Rainier wasn't a Turd...the whole line up of Trailblazer, Envoy, 9-7x, Rainier and Ascender were actually very good vehicles ownership-wise especially for GM's which is why I say I think we got a Friday Rainier. We replaced our former Rainier with another Rainer it was such a great vehicle...that first one went 100k with only an output shaft seal repair which was a cheap fix...then my wife rolled it on black ice and it met its end. We did do a lot of towing with the current Rainier that has given us the trouble however even though it is indeed meant for towing. The first Rainier had the same 5.3 liter but was prior to GM using the Cylinder Deactivation System that the current one has which causes the oil usage...again why I am leaning toward a 6.2 liter in a Yukon Denali since there is no cylinder deactivation system in the 6.2 (only available on the Denali version or the Escalade) and hence no oil usage issues and also why I won't consider a Suburban which only comes with a 5.3. In the end I might even consider a Buick Enclave or an Acadia. I used to think that there is no way that platform could tow my 4000 lb rig well and low and behold Boating Magazine did a long distance tow article towing my exact boat with an Acadia AWD and they praised the Acadia.

In a world where a Hyundai now takes top honors in various categories when it used to be the analogy for junk way back when, I absolutely agree that modern cars are just so much better than even 10 years ago.

 

[oldjeep]

We have had 3 of the Raniers in our extended family, and every one of them has had major issues. One of them went through 3 flexplates and 2 transmissions before my sister in-law had enough and got rid of it.

FWIW, the Kias and Hyundais are the best cars we've ever owned. My wife has had a Hyundai and a couple Kias and my mom owns 2 Kias. Not a problem with any of them.

 

[jkust]

We have had 3 of the Raniers in our extended family, and every one of them has had major issues. One of them went through 3 flexplates and 2 transmissions before my sister in-law had enough and got rid of it.

Interesting....I've got a 9-7x now as my daily driver which is just a Rainier with a slightly more euro sheet metal design and more stylish interior and a few other different bits....I'm about to hit 92k on it and just now something is finally starting to go out being the front left wheel bearing which is about a $40 part. I have literally spent zero dollars in repairs so far..not a single penny in 92k miles except brakes, tires and the preventative fluids schedule. To me that is how vehicles should be under 100k miles. The big mistake people make on this platform is they miss the 50,000 mile fluid change interval which if you miss, your xfer case/AWD will wear out premature. I didn't miss it with my wife's Rainier and it still went out but the 9-7x got it changed on time and no issues.
What is a Flexplate?

 

[smassey22180]

I tow 3000 lbs of 18' bow rider with an 06 RH400h AWD which has a Highlander drive-train. I really like the hybrid for towing for several major reasons.

They call the transmission a CVT but it is not a chain/belt driven CVT. It is a differential with a gas motor on one side and electric on the other. The electric motor spins at different speeds to vary the output ratio. There are no friction based parts to wear out. Everything is liquid cooled with its own cooling systems for both coolant and trans fluid.

The power. Lots of torque so it just idles up the boat ramp without feeling like I am damaging anything.

The brakes are powerful. I am still on my original brakes at 120k miles. Regenerative braking does most of the work so the normal brakes are not used as often. This keeps the brakes cool when towing. I have towed cross country.

The rear suspension is stiffer to handle the weight of the batteries. Even with 400 lbs of tongue weight the rear end does not squat.

Mileage is around 25 mpg when not towing for both highway and city.

I am thinking about my next boat and it probably will be 20'. At that point I probably will switch to a diesel BMW X5 which can tow 7000 lbs and gets mid 20 mpg.

 

[oldjeep]

What is a Flexplate?

The part that attaches to the crankshaft of the motor and the torque convertor. The fact that it kept breaking really points to a major alignment problem between the engine and the transmission. Unless it had a bent crank flange and nobody who worked on it ever bothered to check it.

 

[jkust]

The power. Lots of torque so it just idles up the boat ramp without feeling like I am damaging anything.

To comment on the torque, the biggest lesson I've learned is that my then 180hp/220lb of tq pos minivan I towed my 4000lb rig with many years ago, would idle up the steepest ramps with no effort and low rpm's meaning not peak torque. I'm talking steep where you wonder why they would put a ramp there, steep. Point being, it takes a lot less torque to get a boat out of the water than a person would think. It was contrary to what I would have expected.

 

[cdnNick]

I tow 3000 lbs of 18' bow rider with an 06 RH400h AWD which has a Highlander drive-train. I really like the hybrid for towing for several major reasons.

They call the transmission a CVT but it is not a chain/belt driven CVT. It is a differential with a gas motor on one side and electric on the other. The electric motor spins at different speeds to vary the output ratio. There are no friction based parts to wear out. Everything is liquid cooled with its own cooling systems for both coolant and trans fluid.

The power. Lots of torque so it just idles up the boat ramp without feeling like I am damaging anything.

The brakes are powerful. I am still on my original brakes at 120k miles. Regenerative braking does most of the work so the normal brakes are not used as often. This keeps the brakes cool when towing. I have towed cross country.

The rear suspension is stiffer to handle the weight of the batteries. Even with 400 lbs of tongue weight the rear end does not squat.

Mileage is around 25 mpg when not towing for both highway and city.

I am thinking about my next boat and it probably will be 20'. At that point I probably will switch to a diesel BMW X5 which can tow 7000 lbs and gets mid 20 mpg.

I noticed a 2009 Yukon hybrid last night, the price was good and the mileage was fairly low, not knowing much about hybrids I wonder how long the batteries are good for, since this is already a 6 year old car how long would the batteries be good for?

 

[Slip Away]

We towed our 20ft. bowrider with a dual axle trailer for two years with a 2008 Acadia, it performed very well.
Tow capacity is 5200 lbs, and my boat/trailer weighs 4,000 lbs.

 

[jkust]

The part that attaches to the crankshaft of the motor and the torque convertor. The fact that it kept breaking really points to a major alignment problem between the engine and the transmission. Unless it had a bent crank flange and nobody who worked on it ever bothered to check it.

I haven't heard of this one, having been on the GMT360 forum for maybe 6 years...maybe it affects the I6 models more and I just didn't pay attention?


As for the Acadia, Traverse and Buick Enclave...I am reluctant to pick one up even though I like them. I've rented several, some for a month at a time. I will say, I have never read as many truly awful owner reviews about any car ever. The early and mid years, the years I would buy, have 4 or 5 major/expensive problems. Things that break over and over. Maybe just because they are so popular that there are so many negative reviews?

 

[Slip Away]

Negative reviews = Edmunds.

 

[jkust]

Negative reviews = Edmunds.

Have you had issues with your 08?

 

[smassey22180]

I noticed a 2009 Yukon hybrid last night, the price was good and the mileage was fairly low, not knowing much about hybrids I wonder how long the batteries are good for, since this is already a 6 year old car how long would the batteries be good for?

The yukon is a pretty simple hybrid. It has a single electric motor hooked into a traditional transmission to assist. The Toyota AWD has 3 electric motors. Batteries are not an issue. Mine are 10 years old and there are a lot of 2000 Prius out there on the original battery at 15 years old. In the rare case when one goes bad, Toyota/Lexus normally picks up the bill. They don't want any more bad press this year.

 

[oldjeep]

I haven't heard of this one, having been on the GMT360 forum for maybe 6 years...maybe it affects the I6 models more and I just didn't pay attention?


As for the Acadia, Traverse and Buick Enclave...I am reluctant to pick one up even though I like them. I've rented several, some for a month at a time. I will say, I have never read as many truly awful owner reviews about any car ever. The early and mid years, the years I would buy, have 4 or 5 major/expensive problems. Things that break over and over. Maybe just because they are so popular that there are so many negative reviews?

Or like most things Chevy that are not a pickup - they could just suck

 

[Slip Away]

We had zero problems with our 08' .Acadia. One thing we liked about it, was a flat folding 3rd row seat. The Tahoe/Yukon does not have that (except in 2015)
My wife still misses the Acadia.