has someone tryed wing for upforce om sport boat?

[satanclause]

I am restoring and playing with a old Selco sport boat.
Originaly made at the Rugan factory in norway.
Same factory that produced heavy water and got blown up
By SAS during ww2 ( just as a funny note even a movie made about it)
Anyway thinking of putting on speedrails on it to get better speed.
Then i started thinking " why not a wing like in sportcars also, that give lift instead of downforce, air recistanse must be alot less then water so it should give a performance gain"
Any that has experimented with this or are there any threads about it?

/Thomas

 

[Another retired guy]

Re: has someone tryed wing for upforce om sport boat?

Here are some pictures

boat aerofoil - Google Search

Just google boat aerofoil

 

[satanclause]

Re: has someone tryed wing for upforce om sport boat?

Well ty for reply but that was realy not what i was thinking of. I am thinking more of the rear wing of a Formula 1 car.
But moved forward to generate lift and decrease planing surface from water.

Alot more safe then to build a plane and mount my boat ontop of it :-D

 

[Another retired guy]

Re: has someone tryed wing for upforce om sport boat?

Well ty for reply but that was realy not what i was thinking of. I am thinking more of the rear wing of a Formula 1 car.
But moved forward to generate lift and decrease planing surface from water.

Alot more safe then to build a plane and mount my boat ontop of it :-D

Ok what you want is a boat spoiler. Try this thread which may help

Spoilers On My Concept Boats. - Boat Design Forums

 

[satanclause]

Re: has someone tryed wing for upforce om sport boat?

Ahh ty will check it out :-D

 

[satanclause]

Re: has someone tryed wing for upforce om sport boat?

Bahh that thread was about solar panels and went over to advices about using hamsters as a source of power hahaha. Think it is a private thread of the moderators of this forum and i stay away from it ;-)

 

[Frank Acampora]

Re: has someone tryed wing for upforce om sport boat?

Well, a wing would look nice, but unless your boat is going to go over 60 MPH, it will not do much good--unless it is so massive that it overpowers the boat. Remember: The spoiler wings on NASCAR racers are being dragged through the air at speeds over 100 MPH.

NOW: A properly designed set of hydrofoils will lift your hull completely out of the water and their streamlined airfoil shape has less drag too.

 

[spdracr39]

Re: has someone tryed wing for upforce om sport boat?

Well, a wing would look nice, but unless your boat is going to go over 60 MPH, it will not do much good--unless it is so massive that it overpowers the boat. Remember: The spoiler wings on NASCAR racers are being dragged through the air at speeds over 100 MPH.

NOW: A properly designed set of hydrofoils will lift your hull completely out of the water and their streamlined airfoil shape has less drag too.

Agree. Spoilers and wings (unless so large they aren't practical) are useless at the speeds normal boats travel. Now if your talking about the Miss Budweiser you might have an idea. If you will notice most of the pictures in your link are conceptual drawings only.

 

[DBreskin]

Re: has someone tryed wing for upforce om sport boat?

Keep in mind you control your boat by controlling its interface with the water. If you use airfoils to lift the boat and reduce contact with the water, you reduce control of the boat unless you have some way to control it using the airfoils. It sounds dangerous to me, especially at the speeds being discussed above.

 

[Ned L]

Re: has someone tryed wing for upforce om sport boat?

Racing hydroplanes do use exactly what you are talking about (lots of classes, not just the unlimiteds like Miss Budweiser), but as has been said, the speed needs to be in excess of 100mph and the control has to be very fine.

 

[metriccrescentwrench]

Re: has someone tryed wing for upforce om sport boat?

the speed needs to be in excess of 100mph

I don't see it that way. There are airplanes (ultralights for example) that fly at speeds below 30 miles per hour. It's a matter of how much lift is needed vs. speed vs. wing surface area. AND, we're not talking about a wing that's able to lift the entire weight of the boat, only a fraction of the total weight. It would be a hell of a design challenge to get it right, for sure, but I believe under the right conditions it could work.

and the control has to be very fine.

Probably true. There are, however, tunnel hull fishing boats running around very safely that use this principal (the bottom of the hull is the 'wing'). The thing is that the designer didn't design in enough lift that it's going to become a problem. And there are tunnel hull race boats that are a handful to keep right side up.

 

[emilsr]

Re: has someone tryed wing for upforce om sport boat?

Like a lot of you guys, when I first read this it sounded like a crazy and completely unworkable idea......but......

If everyone listened to what "they" said, we wouldn't have had the advancements in technology that we've had over the years. I say if you have the desire, give it a try!

 

[H20Rat]

Re: has someone tryed wing for upforce om sport boat?

I don't see it that way. There are airplanes (ultralights for example) that fly at speeds below 30 miles per hour. It's a matter of how much lift is needed vs. speed vs. wing surface area.

Yep, and none of those planes weight 3000#! At boating speeds, it simply isn't practical to have a wing large and light enough. Without doing the entire thing in carbon fiber, the wing is going to weigh more than the lift it generates, so its going to have the opposite affect.

 

[rallyart]

Re: has someone tryed wing for upforce om sport boat?

The lift from an airfoil quadruples as the speed doubles so if you had 500 # of lift at 30mph you would have 2000# of lift at 60mph. That means something that would not give a lot of help at cruise would give an enormous amount at top speed. That is assuming that the angle of attack stayed the same. If you hit a wave that lifted the bow of the boat and changed the angle of attack for the wing you might just blow the boat over. (exactly like a hydrofoil does)
The nice thing about hydrofoils for rough water use is usually a 'V' shaped front foil so that a lift up leaves less foil in the water so it does not continue to lift and the hull regains balance. A wing in the air does not have that benefit..

It would make a cool looking bimini but it would be hard to get a consistent response from it so the boat would behave erratically.

 

[metriccrescentwrench]

Re: has someone tryed wing for upforce om sport boat?

Yep, and none of those planes weight 3000#!

That Selco sport boat won't weigh anywhere close to 3000 pounds, just an educated guess probably closer to 800 pounds with fuel and engine (the ones I found using google used 35 HP engines). And he doesn't need to lift anywhere near that much weight to have the desired effect of unwetting some of the hull. Just another educated guess, but if he could make 100 to 200 pounds of lift it would probably be enough. (Sorry for sounding like a know-it-all, but I have built a fiberglass airplane and know a bit about aerodynamics. I'm not claiming doing this is PRACTICAL, but what the hell, it sounds like a fun project).

 

[satanclause]

Re: has someone tryed wing for upforce om sport boat?

Last speaker sound like he have a clue of what i am trying to do.
The Selco i have is a Riviera jr and it is wery light just 175 kilo, it is rated by norwegan veritas for a 40hp engine.
On the back of mine is a 1968 merc 500 50HP engine but as this Engine is rated not propeller HP output Guess it is close to manufactorer 40 HP due to its age.
Most intressting point i saw was the fact a spoiler would change angle as boat do, got me thinking gyro controlled spoiler :-D

 

[satanclause]

Re: has someone tryed wing for upforce om sport boat?

Got a second thought, dont need gyro.
If spoiler is set at proper height the boat itselfe will
Make the adjustment and it wont flip.
As nose of boat go up it Will block the airflow to spoiler.
Thus making this work, in theory :-D
Also as more the angle change the more the spoiler want to turn the boat back to horisontal.
Thus making it work the opposite of competition boats.