Fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. w/pics

matt9923

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Their are a few spots i wan tto adress as well as the top,rail and consoul (i dont know the exact names of things). The transome has soem fiberglass problems, the wood is solid to my suprise but i want to fix up the patch work the previous owner did. Also i want to refurbish the toprail part. Their is like bano crap in between it and the boat an don one side a 1/2" space. Previous owner painted it and it looks bad thne he wood screwed it back to the hull.
Will a good sander even up the paint/fiberglass repairs? I think the stringers and floor are good, its solid no soft spots.
here are soem pictures, i just need soem advice on the best way to fix up the partchy work and fix the toprail.

(some of my pictures are upside down or sideways)

CIMG0670.jpg

CIMG0669.jpg

CIMG0668.jpg

CIMG0667.jpg

CIMG0666.jpg

CIMG0665.jpg
 

matt9923

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Messages
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Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

How is this suposed to be attached? riverts or screws. Idk what teh previous guy did to the poor thing but soem parts i can just lift off (just sitting on hull) and soem patrts are wood screwd on.
Rest of the boat looks ok but i would like to rebuild the top section.

CIMG0664.jpg

CIMG0663.jpg

CIMG0662-1.jpg
 

Bob_VT

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Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

First... please resize the pictures to 640 x 480 It can be done in photobucket.

Your tansom has some issues..... it should not be hollow. Yes the fiberglass floor looks sound but the stringers are under there ..... you need to investigate that.

The rubrail will have to be removed to start to disconnect the cap. That is wood blocking to take up the gap and that will probably need replacement before you are done.

You have your work cut out for yourself. Read through the restoration forums and completed projects to get a better grasp.
 

matt9923

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Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

ok i think i resised it idk. Anyway, the transome isint hollow its just some chipped out bando the guy put in its a 1/2" hole and not bare wood its all cover with fiberglass. I know the lower transoem is a bit rotted but I dont have time (or knowhow) to fix it now mbay next winter. It should be ok.
Also learned that the stringers are molded fiberlass and never need replacing.
How mutch would you say it would be to rebuild a transome?

Howabout this? http://transomrepair.com/zk/fullrepair.shtml
 

Bondo

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Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Ayuh,... Seacast might be a good transom option for you,...

The bottom picture in post #1,..?? Where, Exactly is that big crack located,..??
 

Mark42

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Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Hi Matt,

Oh man, that poor MFG! The PO really did some hack work. Well, a lot of it is easy to repair, some will take a little more research and work. But for starters, here is a list of things to do/don't do:

1) The rubrail:
- is aluminum with a vinyl insert.
- DO NOT TRASH THE ALUMINUM!!! it is very expensive, and fairly easy to bend and repair where dented.
- The black vinyl insert is about $30 for a 40 ft roll when I bought it a few years back, and easy to install.
- Remove it all, and store in a safe place while you work on the boat. Save any oem screws, they are stainless or aluminum.

2) The transom:
- The aluminum top cap is missing, so the transom MAY have already been repaired. Drill a few test probe holes from the inside to see if the wood is dry or wet or just dark mush resembling potting soil.

If wet/rotten:

- Remove the splashwell to work on the transom. Looks like the splashwell was hacked up a bit on the side openings, just sand them smooth to get rid of the hacked appearance.
- Decide if you want to do a Seacast or traditional plywood repair. I suggest doing a new plywood transom because of the much lower cost, and if pressure treated ply is used, even if future leaks develop, it will still hold up. There is lots of info available on these forums on transom repair, also on shareaproject.com. So I won't go into detail here.
- You do not have to use the same style brass tube drains if you don't want to, the brass "screw on" style from the outside will work fine too.

3) The deck:
- Niagara's came with a solid fiberglass floor (at least the first few years) with fiberglass stringers. It was often a light beige color. Yours looks funny, maybe its glue from carpet? The plywood was probably used to add strength for the post seats.
- Fill the holes in the floor from the original seat mounts by grinding a dip and laying a few layers of glass and resin.
- If it feels solid, it probably is.
- If it feels soft, its probably cracked, and you might think about cutting it out and redoing it with plywood.

4) The gel coat:
- So it was painted, probably was past being rejuvinated.
- I would sand and prep for a nice paint job.
- That CRACK!!!!! That crack is on the starboard side a few inches aft of the dash, right? Big, nasty crack. Not hard to fix. If you look up from under the gunnel, you will see its plywood reinforced (if the original foam is missing). So inspect the ply to see if its cracked too. If it is, just put a patch piece about 18" long over the crack (from below) and attach with construction adhesive. Use a few short screws to hold it until adhesive dries. Then grind away the crack from above, feathering the crack back about 6 inches on each side of the crack, then apply a few alternating layers of mat/resin and 10-12 oz weave. Top with mat. Sand smooth, primer and its ready for paint.

5) The outer underside perimeter of the cap:

- The factory fill this gap with what appears to be a polyester filler.
- Remove all the bondo or whatever the PO packed on there.
- Pull out loose pieces.
- Replace with glass reinforced body filler. NOT regular body filler.
- Fill the thin cracks/gaps with a water proof construction adhesive.

So that should get you started.

Check out the boat in detail, let us know how it stands. Especially that transom.

What about the condition of the windshield?

Steering? Has it been upgraded with a teleflex type rotary helm?

That control box looks like a 60's Johnson/Evinrude unit. Will probably want to go with a newer unit to match the motor you use.

What are your plans for use? Restore/refurbish for just running around for fun? Convert to fishing boat?

Good luck, and keep posting pictures.

Mark
 

matt9923

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Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Ayuh,... Seacast might be a good transom option for you,...

The bottom picture in post #1,..?? Where, Exactly is that big crack located,..??

On the top rail i want to fix it.
 

matt9923

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Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Thanks Mark i realy apriciate it. What should i do with the crap between the railing and the hull?
I just want a boat for the river behind my house. I got it for 300$ spend $300 more on things and trying to fix motor its a johnson 33hp. Im getting a 1994 40hp mariner. Also i will be getting a new stearing system,

http://www.boatstoreusa.com/product..._Boat_Steering_System_W/_Wheel&ProductID=1811

and i hope the motor comes with the new cntrols cause thats more $$. Then its just a fun boat/fishing. Do a little driving around with the family, freinds goin to the rope swings ext. I have a nice spot by the water where we have partys and have a few boats and jet skis their.
I havent done much body work on anything besides a little patch on a jet ski so idk how hard a new transoem will be.
I see a little plywood from the inside so i think theirs a outer fiberglass skin and just paint on the plywood on the inside. I am scared to start cutting up my boat having never done any major body work. I will test the transoem and probably do no body work till next winter where i want to fix the top rail rebuild transome and repaint.
I am also not shure why mine has no holes for guages or anything, just a haked up pully stearing system witch i have no faith in.
Thanks Matt
 

*EdC*

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Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Matt,
Mark 42 knows what he's talking about. He recently did a full restoration on a similar MFG. He also has a link to it on each of his posts. Oh, BTW the aluminum around the deck line is called a rub rail. That stuff under it, is a polyester paste. Very typical of MFGs. It is easy to repair. Make a list of the things you (need) to do, then the things you (want) to do. MFGs were very well built. with some time and effort they can be brought to almost new condition, if that's what you want. Lastly, Iboats kindly supports a MFG section. You can find it at the bottom of each page. Listed under "Boat Manfacturers"

Regards,
Ed
 

matt9923

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Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Ok i did soem investigatong on the transome, And its not loking good :mad:
I see wood from the inside and i see at the bottom how the fiberglass is worked up on the plywood at the bottom. For now i am going to add a pice of sheet steel behind the engine just so it has support and rebuild the transoem in the winter inless i figure out how to do it.
Where would i start? Remove the splash well, cut where the fiberglass attaches to the plywood on the bottom (where the leves are).

CIMG0672.jpg

CIMG0671.jpg

Do i just cut along the splashwell? How do i put this back on and attach the plywood to the flooor and sides? Arent i suposed to rebuild part of the floor when i do this?
CIMG0673.jpg

Sorry for all the questions i am learning. My floor is fiberglass. Or i could cut the cap and remove the wood from inside and thru the cap, use plywood as a temporary skin and add seacast. Than can i put fiberglass over the seacast on the inside? I see seacast costing around 250$ or more or killing myself or my boat trying to rebuild the transoem the real way. I want my boat to be safe and fun so i need to start thinking about a fix.
Thanks Matt
 

Mark42

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Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Oh, dear. Someone tried to do a transom earlier, and didn't do it right.

That splashwell should be attached to the transom by a dozen stainless wood screws with a black rubber gasket between the transom and the splashwell. So you can see that they tried to just glass it to the transom.

Also appears that they cut most of the inside glass off and tossed it. Neither of these conditions are fatal. We'll just work with them.

Hopefully, the splashwell is still bolted to the gunnels on the sides? If so, remove the nuts and bolts and then cut the splashwell off of the transom (my guess is it will just pull off because it looks like a very poor glassing job). Then using a flapper disk, sand off the excess glass and get the splashwell back into its original condition.

It should look like this:

Captured2004-01-0900002.jpg


After the splashwell is cleaned up, try cutting the glass off on the inside of the transom flush to the hull, and pull out the plywood. Try your best to keep the outside transom glass as intact as possible. Clean everything out. Note that the hull gets very thick on the sides of the transom (the back corners). This is a strong part and try not to damage it. Once you cut and fit back in a new plywood transom (I suggest two layers of 3/4" pressure treated ply that has had a couple of weeks to dry, glued together with either construction adhesive or epoxy).

Then fit in the plywood. Epoxy or Polyester/mat install the plywood transom from the inside to the old outside glass skin. Clamp or use screws to clamp the skin to the plywood. After its all set, tab in the plywood transom from the inside. This means a few layers of glass about 6-8" wide that run the parimeter if the plywood attaching it to the hull. Then glass in the center.

Then bolt back in the splashwell. Seal the splashwell to the transom with 3m 4200 or similar sealer. Install new brass drain tubes (they are cheap).

That is the basic outline, without going into great detail about using epoxy or poly, that is your choice. BTW, the boat is 50 years old and made from polyester resin and glass. You don't have to make it exactly back to OEM condition, but you do need to make it solid and strong. The transom is PUSHED on by the motor, so the important thing is to make sure it is attached to the sides of the hull well with 3 or more layers of glass strips from the inside.

Once you get it torn apart, we can walk you through the details of reassembling. It should be fairly straight forward.
 

*EdC*

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Messages
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Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Matt,
Click on the link below. There are a few guys there rebuilding and restoring old MFGs. Also, MFG transom repairs. :)

http://forums.iboats.com/MFG
 

matt9923

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Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Ok so cut along the floor and sides as close to the hull as posible or just cut along the floor?
Where am i glassing the plywood? to the hull floor? I dont se how that will work. I think i am going to put sheet steel inbetween teh motor and transoem for this season. I want to get the motor and make shur eevrythign is good in that aspect befor doing the transome. The top 6" is solid and the left side that has glass over it is ok so i think ill be ok but i will keep an eye on it. It definitaly on the top5 to do list. Motor/battery, new steering, carpet, transom, toprail, windshield, repaint. Something like that but i know i need to do it. Im just debating if i want to seacast it and never have to worry about it again. Idk how long i will keep the boat probaly get another one within a few years but i have alot of land so I can sqeez in 2 boats :).
Thanks for all the help! I am jelous of your boat Mark, Nice inboard tank and guages. You made that think 110%, Mine is 10%, it floats thats about it.
Thanks Matt
 

Mark42

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Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Ok so cut along the floor and sides as close to the hull as posible or just cut along the floor?
Where am i glassing the plywood? to the hull floor? I dont se how that will work. I think i am going to put sheet steel inbetween teh motor and transoem for this season. I want to get the motor and make shur eevrythign is good in that aspect befor doing the transome. The top 6" is solid and the left side that has glass over it is ok so i think ill be ok but i will keep an eye on it. It definitaly on the top5 to do list. Motor/battery, new steering, carpet, transom, toprail, windshield, repaint. Something like that but i know i need to do it. Im just debating if i want to seacast it and never have to worry about it again. Idk how long i will keep the boat probaly get another one within a few years but i have alot of land so I can sqeez in 2 boats :).
Thanks for all the help! I am jelous of your boat Mark, Nice inboard tank and guages. You made that think 110%, Mine is 10%, it floats thats about it.
Thanks Matt

Yes, cut the sides and bottom. Normally this boat would be done where the inside and outside glass is kept intact. But because the PO had cut the inside "skin" off, I see no reason to try to save the inside skin. Just cut it off flush so the plywood can be removed.

The glassing is a process where a 6 or 8 inch wide strip is placed in the "corner" where the plywood meets the sides and bottom of the boat. About 3 or 4 inches on the hull, and 3 or 4 inches on the plywood. Its called 'tabbing' and its what will keep the plywood from being pushed forward into the boat when you hit the gas. After tabbing it in with a few layers, then cover the whole transom with one or two layers of glass to seal it all up. It doesn't have to be pretty, it won't show, it just has to be strong. Using the materials that others use here, you will have a transom that is more than strong enough to support a 40-50 hp motor.

I suggest you skip the temporary bar, it would only take a few weekends to do that transom right. And it will last forever as long as you keep the water out. And forget the Seacast, because the inside skin of the transom is questionable anyway. And trying to clean out a transom of rotten wood is a horrible job.

Believe me it a really fun boat to drive. Kind of like the MGB of the water, quick, nimble, responsive. Its a blast!!!
 

matt9923

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Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

I feel a lot better about it now but im still debating... Maby when the weekend comes and I find a saw in my hand it will happen.
Should i get presshur treated or marine plywood? Do i resin it up or just let it dry?
(first piece) After i get all the wood out do i put resin/mat or just resin on the outer skin and then the first plywood

(second piece) and then resin/mat or just resin the next piece to the first piece? And then tab it out with 3 layers or so. Do i sand the floor and hull clean befor applying epoxy.
I want to use epoxy (i think) and what kind of mat?
Materials list-
-PT plywood
-epoxy (gallon or so?)
-mat (weight/weve)
-and a bunch of time and beer

Im not woried about looks as you can see :).
Thanks Mark i apriciate it dont want to bug you tho.
 

saxis

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Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

Re: looking into fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. Any suggestions

(first piece) After i get all the wood out do i put resin/mat or just resin on the outer skin and then the first plywood

(second piece) and then resin/mat or just resin the next piece to the first piece? And then tab it out with 3 layers or so. Do i sand the floor and hull clean befor applying epoxy.

Once you get the old transom cut out, grind/sand the inside sides/bottom of the hull smooth where you will be tabbing. You want a very strong bond. Then you'll probably want to make a template out of cardboard or something to trace and cut on plywood. I believe you want to laminate the 2 pieces of 3/4" plywood together with mat and resin, then tab it to the hull in one piece. I've seen where many people treat the wood with thinned resin for extra water protection also...

This is the process I have planned for my boat at least...
 

matt9923

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Re: Fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. transom rebuild w/pics

Re: Fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. transom rebuild w/pics

Ok so i need a sheet of PT plywood
How much and what kind of epoxy? where to get it
And how much and what kind of mat? where to get it.
Thanks
Matt
 

donnyskz1

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Re: Fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. transom rebuild w/pics

Re: Fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. transom rebuild w/pics

It Is Okay To Use Pressure Treated Plywood But If You Get It From Home Depot Or Lowes You Will Have Top Let It Dry For A Very Long Time Sometimes A Month Or Longer And You Will Want To Fasten It To A Wall Or Something Flat Because As It Drys It Will Start To Warp And Then It Would Be Very Difficult To Work With. As A Carpenter And Cabinet Builder I Have Seen Treated Plwood Warp So Bad That It Is Almost Impossible To Use It. When You Cut Into The Plywood You Will Have A Lot Of Voids To Deal With Also. If I Were Using Plywood (which I Am Not)
I Would Definitely Use A Marine Plywood And Seal It With Epoxy Then You Would Not Have To Worry About Anything For Many Years To Come. Marine Ply Also Has No Voids In It When You Cut Into It To Make Your Transom.
 

matt9923

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Re: Fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. transom rebuild w/pics

Re: Fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. transom rebuild w/pics

Ill proabably will just get a piece of PT plywood from homecheeppot and put it in the barn with soem weight on it so it doesnt warp. Then when it is dry ill put epoxy on it,
- let it dry and start with glassing the first piece to the outer skin.
- Then glass the next piece to the first piece with soem mat between it.
- Then glass it to the floor and hull sides and out an outer skin on it.
Im debating cutting the floor back 6" to glass it to the stringers instead of just the floor? What do you think. It would be easy to just glass to the floor and hull. :D
Also 3/4 plywood is what is recomended correct?
what kind of epoxy and mat?

Matt
 

Mark42

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Re: Fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. transom rebuild w/pics

Re: Fixing up my 14ft MFG Niagara. transom rebuild w/pics

The transom is 1 1/2" thick, so you can use 3/4 and double it up, or 1/2 and triple it up. Any method will be more than strong enough for the 50hp limit that boat has.

A lot depends on the dimension of the transom. If you can get three pieces from 1 sheet of 4x8, then use the 1/2", it will dry in a week or two, and cost less than the 3/4. So take some measurements to save a few bucks.

Also, buy from a lumber yard, the ply will be a better grade than what is available at the home centers. And its usually not as wet as the home centers.

You can use construction adhesive to laminate up the ply pieces, or the epoxy your using with the glass. Use screws to hold the layers together while the glue dries. Remove the screws when done or just glass over them, it won't matter.
 
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