85 Johnson 150 V6 - no water at tell tale

[jakedaawg]

inspect the splines at the top of the vertical shaft and in the crank shaft where it seats. Engine may not be spinning vertical shaft. Your new camera you have coming may help you see the splines on the crank.

 

[dsharretts]

I've thought about that too - during my tests, with the engine running, I've put it in gear and the prop spins in both forward and reverse.

 

[jakedaawg]

Through all your tests it should work. The only thing I can think of then is that the water pump tube is either Jammed to far into the upper bushing so your not getting a seal around the grommet or you somehow missing when you install it. I have at times had to use a thin piece of string to guide the tubes into place.

I also would still look at the splines, I suppose it may be possible (though doubtful) that the engine is turning the shaft enough to make it appear as though its working while at the same time slipping enought to not pump a lot of water.

Have you tried running it in a deep garbage can instead of useing muffs?

 

[rtpassini]

Thats a better question. My motors never worked on muffs. Dunk it in a tank, boom. no problem. Have you tried it in a tank or in water? If you cant find a setup with a tank, just put the trailer in a boat launch that isnt busy.

 

[dsharretts]

Ive tried it on a ramp a couple times. It did work on muffs before. My camera should still be coming today so I can inspect the top of the tube. To me it seems that I've tested everything and it should work - but it stopped working before I ever started messing with it - and I haven't found anything that would have caused it to stop. I'll have to see if the camera gives me any insight and try it again - focusing on the water tube insertion.

 

[dsharretts]

Just throwing this out there - the only other thing I had done prior to my water issue was I pulled the carbs and cleaned them. I had water on the muffs once after that and once in the water. Next time I ran the motor on the muffs (2days later)I had no water - not less water - absolutely no water.

 

[glenn property of pam]

Just throwing this out there - the only other thing I had done prior to my water issue was I pulled the carbs and cleaned them. I had water on the muffs once after that and once in the water. Next time I ran the motor on the muffs (2days later)I had no water - not less water - absolutely no water.

99% certain carbs have nothing to do with it. To be honest I would swear its 100% but no one seems to have ever seen a problem like yours. Every test says it works every question has been asked so now we are all interested to know whats happening. To be honest a good set of muffs on a bad water pump can get at least some water from the tell tale so either its assembled wrong, parts are wrong or theres a blockage that only shows up when its assembled.

Theres no way you have a blocked exhaust. I mean I can not think of a way to block one unless someone was having a evil joke on you

 

[dsharretts]

I didn't think carbs had anything to do with it either but I'm at a loss. Camera showed up yesterday afternoon but didn't provide any more clues. I ran it up along side the water tube and it's connected securely. I ran it up the water tube and it's clean clear all the way up to the motor. I stuck it in the tell tale connection at the block - couldn't see anything other than straight in but again looked very clean. So I reattached the lower unit. I felt with my fingers and could feel the water tube enter the impeller housing. I pushed it around a little and could feel it hit the sides of the impeller housing tube. I pushed the unit up a little more to get the bolts started. I then feed the camera up into the gap between the lower unit and mid section. It took a while to maneuver it but I got pictures of the water tube connected to the impeller housing. So now I'm 100% confident the the water tube is in. As I pushed up the lower unit and tightened the bolts I rocked (wiggled) it and can feel what I assume is the water tube fitting into the rubber grommet in the impeller housing. I know it's anti climactic but I haven't tried it yet. Everything has gone exactly like it has the past 4 times I've done this. I'll try it today and post results - for sure on muffs but hope to have time to get it to the landing as well. If this doesn't work I'm going to have to take it in. I'm out of ideas. Thanks again for the assistance. It's given me the confidence to know I'm on the right track at least.

 

[rtpassini]

I disagree with the statement "good set of muffs will get some water through"

Muffs worked just fine with my Mercury. My evinrude, not one bit. I held the muffs on so water did even spray out the sides, still nothing. the second I dunked it, it pee'd instanstly. DONT TRUST MUFFS. the motor is made to be ran in water, you have to replicate it in real life scenarios to be 100% certian.

 

[dsharretts]

I haven't had time to get it to a landing - I'm hoping I can tomorrow evening. Someone else had mentioned to me that with some of the larger motors, muffs can't keep enough water pressure to keep the tell tale flowing. Even though it had worked on the muffs previously, maybe with a new impeller it's pulling in some air - that's my hopeful theory.

I may also try to pick up an inexpensive infrared temp gun to check the temp at the cylinder heads.

 

[Tim Frank]

can you run it in a barrel?

 

[dsharretts]

I haven't found a barrel big enough yet. Got it to the landing today and I think it's working. It started but killed and wouldn't start again - maybe I'm on to the next problem. I had water coming out the tell tale while I was cranking it over - so I think that's a good sign. I didn't do anything different, I didn't find anything that would have been causing problems - the last time I dropped the lower unit all I did was my drill test and camera inspection. Put it back on the same way I had in the past. Maybe the 5th time is the charm. Granted, I haven't ran the motor yet. I may try the muffs again in a day or two. Obviously, something wasn't right, or is different - I just don't know what it is.

 

[dsharretts]

Think my VRO might be my starting issue - oil was dumping like crazy. Think my mix was too oil heavy. Going to bypass the oil line in my VRO and see if it runs a little smoother and starts at the ramp - not the first time I've had issues like that. thought it wasn't getting fuel but this time noticed the oil issue.

Should be able to try it tomorrow to verify that the water pump is functioning. Maybe I'll actually get some wind in my hair!

 

[dsharretts]

No wind in my hair. Pulled the oil line on VRO and went with mix. Got it started at landing - no water at tell tale and engine was hot. So it appears that I can only get water out the tell tale when the motor ISN'T running. I can get water through with a drill test and I guess when turning the motor over but when it's running I get nothing. So do I have a gasket issue where my water is going somewhere it shouldn't? Someone mentioned earlier to check the exhaust covers? Could water be dropping in to the exhaust before it runs through the block/tell tale? I can do a compression test and check the pistons to see if any are squeaky clean like water is coming in. It may be time for some professional help.

 

[dsharretts]

Ordered exhaust cover gaskets as well as new thermostats and cover gaskets. I'll see if the exhaust gaskets might be letting exhaust pressure into water system and pushing the water out or letting the water go straight into the exhaust. The last time I ran it i felt hot air coming out the tell tale - maybe that was exhaust. I'll start there and if I don't find any thing move on to the head gaskets.