need Expert advice, no wood for deck/stringers

[65Mech]

First off i have searched and found a few things, but nothing that really answered my questions. Sorry for the noob question
I know it is not a preferred way, to not use wood for decks. ive done a couple of boats with wood/glass, and was thinking out of the box a little bit. is there any kind of product that you could "pour" to make your structures. ie: stringers and deck.
The reason i got to thinking about this is:
what if you poured your foam first
then cut voids in the foam for (pourable)stringers
once that cures, pour your "mixture" over the foam and stringers to make your deck.
by pouring you would fill any holes and seal the foam all in one shot. kind of like epoxy flooring.
Now the question is do i make any sense???? Expert advice and criticism is welcomed, if its crazy or i am please tell me why.

also im not looking for anything pre-fabbed. mostly looking for pourable.
Corey

 

[83vert]

Re: need Expert advice, no wood for deck/stringers

Sounds like an awesome idea to me and since im the first do you need a partner in the new company?

 

[Maxum21]

Re: need Expert advice, no wood for deck/stringers

its a cool idea, but it would be a VERY EXPENSIVE "pour". And i think you would need some kind of reinforcement for the floor. ie, fiberglass cloth. Plus, how would you forrm out for the ski locker. would be difficult

 

[Alpheus]

Re: need Expert advice, no wood for deck/stringers

Seacast to heavy?

 

[65Mech]

Re: need Expert advice, no wood for deck/stringers

Ok i like the open minds!!! first off no ski locker its a cc. but when you cut troughs for the stringers, you could make a rectangle in the center, and when it cures take the foam out of the center of the rectangle. then glass it to make it 100% water proof. for drainage you could run a pvc pipe before you foam and pour, just cap the ends.





i was thinking the seacast is too expensive and heavy. i was thinking resin with wood chips/saw dust or something similar. before anyone says anything i didnt say completly rule out wood. the wood chips would thicken up the resin, less resin = less weight. the deck would only be 1/4" thick and then a couple layers of glass on top of the "poured mixture" would provide plenty of strength. ohh before i forget; for foam im looking at 8# min..

 

[Bondo]

Re: need Expert advice, no wood for deck/stringers

Ayuh,... Rock 'n Roll,.... I wanta see the Pictures,....

 

[ondarvr]

Re: need Expert advice, no wood for deck/stringers

I won't condemn your idea because new ways of looking at old problems is great.

First you need to invent this product to pour, it needs to be waterproof, strong, light, bond to anything, flow easily, safe to work with and low in cost. It would need to be much stronger and bond far better than Seacast to work, which means the cost will be much higher also.

Forget the 8lb foam its heavy, expensive and over kill.

 

[65Mech]

Re: need Expert advice, no wood for deck/stringers

Forget the 8lb foam its heavy, expensive and over kill.

Actually the 8# is 119$ here for 2 gal mix and so is the rest. overkill yes, but i gotta get the "pour mixture" down first. i figured 8# would help with some rigidity.

ok so testing will commence tomorrow!!!!!!!!! i had some great stuff big gap filler(roughly 2#) laying around so i filled up a box. i still have about 2.5 gallons of resin(resin sticks to just about everything) so now i just got to find some "filler".. and off to the testing.

 

[Alpheus]

Re: need Expert advice, no wood for deck/stringers

Just make sure to bring your camera with ya...

 

[ondarvr]

Re: need Expert advice, no wood for deck/stringers

The $119 for two gallons of "mix" is correct, the 2lb foam expands 4X more than the 8lb, so plan to buy about 4X more product to fill the same space.

Polyester resin isn't strong enough to do the job, epoxy would work better, but its still not strong enough to create a stringer on its own, even with fillers.

Pour some resin on the foam and see what happens.


You need to do some reading about these products before you start experimenting, all of these things have been tried before. I only say this to save you a great deal of time and money on trying things that won't work.

If you do come up with a method you may become very wealthy though.

 

[ezmobee]

Re: need Expert advice, no wood for deck/stringers

You need to start by reading this AWESOME thread in which he's pouring his stringers. His foam and glass forms are top notch. http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=365820

 

[65Mech]

Re: need Expert advice, no wood for deck/stringers

thats kinda what im looking at. except i dont want to use seacast. progress so far... i got my foam poured cut out my 2x4 slots now just waiting for the foam to cure. unfortunately i ran into a snag.. on of the cans of great stuff didnt set up .. i got my sister comming in today before she goes to boot camp on monday, so progress will be minimal today.

 

[65Mech]

Re: need Expert advice, no wood for deck/stringers

Ok first test today. pine shavings and resin. strong as hell. pours like a dream. but weighs so much more. that was my biggest idea. actually my only idea. any ideas on something that wont suck up the resin??

 

[micks110]

Re: need Expert advice, no wood for deck/stringers

My advice would be to not use polyester resin or epoxy for such a big void. If you did go the epoxy route- it will cost you just as much most likely to fill the stringers as the seacast would.
But.... epoxy wasn't made to make stringers- seacast was.
http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=365820
I made up my forms with 3 layers of glass and used 1.5" foam taped in packaging tape so the poly didn't stick to it. I cut down everything to deck height and now I just have to fill with the seacast before putting my deck in and poring 2# foam from
http://www.jgreer.com/boat-foam.htm?gclid=CI6Zr5fUtpkCFQ48Qwod53JK7A

In no way do I think I'm an expert but I wouldn't skip the glassing in and encapsulating stage of the stringers no matter how you go about it.
Plus if you would pour foam and then cut out the voids for where the stringers would be how can you be sure to get down to fresh fiberglass for the poly or epoxy to bond too properly?

I would say that the only way you can do something that is not a wood product for you stringers is to do it the way myself and archbuilder did it. Here is archbuilders link- his stringer section is on page 2 I believe.
http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=364284

Any other way I can help- just ask.
Good Luck

 

[Bondo]

Re: need Expert advice, no wood for deck/stringers

In no way do I think I'm an expert but I wouldn't skip the glassing in and encapsulating stage of the stringers no matter how you go about it.

Ayuh,... Even if you glassed in cardboard tubes with poly,+ Glass,...
And Skip the foam, Altogether....

You'd have a Stronger, Lighter hull that co$t 1/4 the money....

 

[micks110]

Re: need Expert advice, no wood for deck/stringers

Bondo- the way I understood the post to read was that he wasn't going to be glassing in a stringer- bur he would just be using the cut out void in the foam as his stringer instead.
I understand that a stringer made of cardboard tubes glassed in would be strong, but the lack there of a fiberglass stringer and just a void in between foam was what I was a little Leary about.
Maybe I'm just not understanding his theory clearly- pictures or an illustration would help.

 

[ondarvr]

Re: need Expert advice, no wood for deck/stringers

Bondo- the way I understood the post to read was that he wasn't going to be glassing in a stringer- bur he would just be using the cut out void in the foam as his stringer instead.
I understand that a stringer made of cardboard tubes glassed in would be strong, but the lack there of a fiberglass stringer and just a void in between foam was what I was a little Leary about.
Maybe I'm just not understanding his theory clearly- pictures or an illustration would help.

What you didn't understand was Bond-o's post

 

[BigBoatinOkie]

Re: need Expert advice, no wood for deck/stringers

I used to be in the foam roofing, insulating, and commercial flooring business. There was an epoxy product we used to use on floors that was pretty awesome, and tough as nails. One time I let a large amount harden in the bottom of a bucket. When I pulled it out of the bucket, I was absolutely amazed how hard this stuff was. it was literally hard as a rock. Anyway, I was thinkin if you mixed in some tiny styrofoam balls it would still be dang strong and the styrofoam should make it much lighter. my 2 cents.

Also, instead of pouring, hire someone who does foam roofing and have them spray it in. The roofing foam is much denser,stiffer, and impact resistant than most foams. The dense roofing foam adds in incredible amount of rigidity to any structure all by itself. I have sprayed 3-4 inches of foam on a piece of cardboard, set it on sawhorses, and stood on it in the middle without breaking it.

 

[micks110]

Re: need Expert advice, no wood for deck/stringers

Ondarvr- got it now after re-reading it- oops

 

[65Mech]

Re: need Expert advice, no wood for deck/stringers

i wasnt looking to not glass them in. i like the way micks110 did his. i was looking for a somewhat cheap and fast approach. it was just a thought that was rolling around in the back of my mind. and i figured i would see what came up.