I think it's a no brainer, but HELP Cobalt vs Four Winns

[KootenayTime]

I'm a new member to iboats, but have read up on things here frequently in the past. My wife and I are getting back into boating after 6 year hiatus. We sold our last boat when our first was born, and now that our two children are 6 and 3 we are getting back in. We have decided to buy used for various reasons and right now I have two different boats in my sights. I think it's a no brainer but due to mild OCD I could use some opinions, here we go;

2005 Four Winns 210 Horizon;
5.0 Volvo Gxi
Only 175 hours
8.5 out of 10 for condition
U-shaped back seat, which I think I like but am not sure
$25,000 without bimini or tower
$27,500 with monster tower and bimini

2004 Cobalt 220
6.2 Merc MPI - Bravo Drive
396 hours
8 out of 10 for condition
Perfect Pass
Better Swim Platform for the kids
$29,000 includes factory tower and bimini

The boat will be primarily for cruising with the kids, family and friends, some tubing thrown in and then wake boarding/skiing as the kids get older. We are in a relatively small inland body of water. The 4 Winns does not have a tower or bimini, and a bimini is a must right now, we wouldn't need a tower until later but will want one eventually. The dealer will install a tower with built in bimini for around $2500. I know 175 hours is extremely low for a 2005 but I believe 396 is still below average for a 2004. As I said it think it's a no brainer to go for the Cobalt, you get Cobalt build quality, a slightly bigger boat and more engine. Four Winns is nothing to sneeze at though and it will be far better than our 1988 Bayliner and with less hours than the Cobalt. The 4 Winns was not sold originally by the dealer who has it now so no maintenance records. The Cobalt has had two owners, it was sold originally and traded back into the very same dealer who I am talking with so they will be able to provide maintenance records. Please chime in with opinions, anyone with experience with either boat would be especially appreciated.

I have already negotiated on both prices, the Cobalt started at $32,900 and the 4 Winns started out at 27,900 with no tower or bimini. I live 4 hours away from these boats so in a way it is good since they will hold both boats until next weekend when I can drive down to see them in person, granted seeing them in person could change things, but let's just say for arguments sake they are exactly as I have said (what the salesmen have told me) and what I could glean from pictures. Note, each boat is from a different dealer.

Thanks and sorry for the long winded post.

 

[onewhippedpuppy]

Re: I think it's a no brainer, but HELP Cobalt vs Four Winns

Cobalt, no brainer. Nothing against Four Winns, but there is no comparison.

 

[tazrig]

Re: I think it's a no brainer, but HELP Cobalt vs Four Winns

:welcome: KootenayTime to iBoats! If both were new than yes, a no brainer for the reasons you yourself acknowledge. However after 10 years of use if the four winns was babied and the cobalt was beat on then they would be a lot closer than you think. It really comes down to how the boats were maintained. I would absolutely get a Professional Marine Survey done for the amount of money you are going to spend. The surveyor will check the boat(s) over from bow to stern and everything in between along with giving you a full report of any potential trouble spots. For $200-$300 for each survey it's cheap money. In fact I would have the Cobalt surveyed first and if it comes back with a clean bill of health just buy it. As stated above there really is no comparison between the 2 boats assuming each was cared for as it should have been. Also here are a couple of articles to chew on:


BoatUS Magazine: Boat Buying Mistakes


iboats.com Review | March 2013

Best of luck and be sure to let us know what you decide as well as posting some pics We love pics!!!

 

[tpenfield]

Re: I think it's a no brainer, but HELP Cobalt vs Four Winns

Welcome to iBoats . . . :thumb:

Cobalt . . .

Take a close look at the glassing of the stringers and the bulkheads of both boats. Also, check your negotiated pricing versus BUCvalue and perhaps NADA.

 

[JoLin]

Re: I think it's a no brainer, but HELP Cobalt vs Four Winns

All things being equal- Cobalt is the better boat. No question. After 10 years of use and potential misuse, however, the one in the best current condition is your best buy.

 

[beech2000]

Re: I think it's a no brainer, but HELP Cobalt vs Four Winns

We had a Four Winns 5 years ago and loved it. Now we have a Sea Ray and its Okay...
But in this comparison thread.. 2 equally maintained for fairness discussions ... the Cobalt Winns hands down in my book (Like that?) I believe you'll be much happier with the Cobalt. Mercruiser with Bravo 3 alone Winns again. Already has your bimini top and and added bonus having a factory installed tower. The Cobalt gets my vote. Good luck

 

[rallyart]

Re: I think it's a no brainer, but HELP Cobalt vs Four Winns

PP is worth $1k, the better tower is at least another $1k, the Cobalt has a higher resale over the long run, the better swim deck for the kids is priceless but will cost over $1k to add to the Four Wynns, the 6.2 is better than the 5.0, the Cobalt is bigger.
My brother-in-law has a 2005 Four Wynns Horizon and it's a nice boat but the Cobalt is worth that price difference.
(If the driveline was looked after)

 

[KootenayTime]

Re: I think it's a no brainer, but HELP Cobalt vs Four Winns

Thanks for all of the replies so far, we are really looking hard at the Cobalt. It was sold and then taken in on trade and re-sold by the dealer we are working with. There service department isn't open again until Tuesday but I am hoping they have the maintenance records.

@tazrig; Thanks for the advise on the survey and those two links. I think you are right about getting the Cobalt surveyed first, if it's all good then it really is a no brainer.

Thanks to everyone else as well.

 

[KootenayTime]

Re: I think it's a no brainer, but HELP Cobalt vs Four Winns

Also, I forgot to mention, I found out it's a Bravo 1 not a Bravo 3 :grumpy: certainly not the end of the world though

 

[KootenayTime]

Re: I think it's a no brainer, but HELP Cobalt vs Four Winns

NADA on the Cobalt with trailer is $29,000 and the "extras" inputed
BUCvalue on Cobalt - $21,600 - $24,000
BUCvalue on Four Winns - $19,100 - $21,300

I imagine those sites quote in US dollars (I am in Canada) and I don't think the BUCvalue includes the trailer value??

 

[Thalasso]

Re: I think it's a no brainer, but HELP Cobalt vs Four Winns

Also, I forgot to mention, I found out it's a Bravo 1 not a Bravo 3 :grumpy: certainly not the end of the world though

Glad to see you got back on.
The Bravo 1 might be better for you because of the corrosion issues with the bravo 111. That corrosion issue is only if you leave it in a wet slip and hooked to shore power which i don't think you will be doing with either boat.

 

[KootenayTime]

Re: I think it's a no brainer, but HELP Cobalt vs Four Winns

Glad to see you got back on.
The Bravo 1 might be better for you because of the corrosion issues with the bravo 111. That corrosion issue is only if you leave it in a wet slip and hooked to shore power which i don't think you will be doing with either boat.

Hi Thalasso, yeah, weirdest thing. I couldn't go to the iboat site at all on my Mac. I dug out an old laptop and I can get to the site through Google Chrome only, Internet Explorer wouldn't work either. I'm happy to be back on and see all the replies. I'm thinking a marine survey on the Cobalt wouldn't be a bad idea as per tazrig's suggestions. We are just happy to get back into boating. To be honest our old '88 Bayliner ended up being a P.O.S., mainly due to lack of maintenance by the previous owner(s), so we want to do our due diligence on this next purchase.

 

[Thalasso]

Re: I think it's a no brainer, but HELP Cobalt vs Four Winns

Hi Thalasso, yeah, weirdest thing. I couldn't go to the iboat site at all on my Mac. I dug out an old laptop and I can get to the site through Google Chrome only, Internet Explorer wouldn't work either. I'm happy to be back on and see all the replies. I'm thinking a marine survey on the Cobalt wouldn't be a bad idea as per tazrig's suggestions. We are just happy to get back into boating. To be honest our old '88 Bayliner ended up being a P.O.S., mainly due to lack of maintenance by the previous owner(s), so we want to do our due diligence on this next purchase.

As said above, if any boat isn't taken car of it's going to be what it is. A POS
Download www mozillafirefox.com and use it for these type of sites. With there ad-blocker you don't get the pop up advertisements.All i have to do is open Firefox and all the sites i want are on the toolbar. Just have to click on them (name) to open what ever i want
good luck with your search.

 

[onewhippedpuppy]

Re: I think it's a no brainer, but HELP Cobalt vs Four Winns

Well, did you buy it? I'm also looking for a similar used Cobalt, nice boats are hard to find and are selling quickly, even in the off season. I found a nice 2002 226 with only 95 hours on it, $35k and it sold within a couple of days. I just called on a mint 2004 226 with 200 hours that was advertised without a price, it was $37k! The challenge in finding a well kept Cobalt that is also reasonably priced is pushing me to look at other makes.

 

[KootenayTime]

Re: I think it's a no brainer, but HELP Cobalt vs Four Winns

Well, did you buy it? I'm also looking for a similar used Cobalt, nice boats are hard to find and are selling quickly, even in the off season. I found a nice 2002 226 with only 95 hours on it, $35k and it sold within a couple of days. I just called on a mint 2004 226 with 200 hours that was advertised without a price, it was $37k! The challenge in finding a well kept Cobalt that is also reasonably priced is pushing me to look at other makes.

onewhippedpuppy; I am going on Saturday to look at it and hopefully pull the trigger, the boat is 4 hours away. That being said a very good friend of mine who lives where the boat is (he is more anal than I am) has given the boat an 8.5 - 9 out of 10. The dealership has some of the maintenance records but not all as not all of the maintenance was done there, that is the only thing I have left in the back of my mind that would hold me back. The dealer is very reputable and offers 90 days warranty on their used stuff from date of delivery (we won't take delivery until April or May). At $29K I also feel like the boat is priced very well for a Cobalt from what I have seen on line for sale in and around the same year. Cobalt wasn't even on the radar a month ago, but around here it seems like I'm going to be paying $24K-$25K on a good used Four Winns, Monterey, Crownline etc. Spending an extra $4K to get into a Cobalt has me pretty excited. Where are you located U.S. or Canada? I'm curious, where you are seeing those prices.

 

[Slip Away]

Re: I think it's a no brainer, but HELP Cobalt vs Four Winns

There were no corrosion "issues" in 2003 with the Bravo III drives. That problem was solved years' before that.

 

[onewhippedpuppy]

Re: I think it's a no brainer, but HELP Cobalt vs Four Winns

I'm in the USA, KS specifically. I'm searching the surrounding states, just not a lot of reasonably priced nice boats out there.

 

[Thalasso]

Re: I think it's a no brainer, but HELP Cobalt vs Four Winns

There were no corrosion "issues" in 2003 with the Bravo III drives. That problem was solved years' before that.

Not so. I had a SeaRay 2004 that had problems

 

[KootenayTime]

Re: I think it's a no brainer, but HELP Cobalt vs Four Winns

We walked away from both boats to give it some more thought, though the Cobalt is out. The Four Winns was immaculate, a 9 out of 10 for sure. The Cobalt, (and all of this is subjective) was a 7 out of 10; it had some frayed carpet, a couple of small rips in the vinyl, a previous owner had screwed "something" into the swim deck, a logo/badge was missing from the starboard side and we didn't like the burgundy colour, I think the first owner used it pretty hard, my gut told me to walk away. I suppose we could have spent another $1500 fixing all of that but it just didn't feel right. Unfortunately we looked at the Four Winns first almost as a moot point, thinking that the Cobalt would be in as good shape and that we would buy it for sure. It took the wind out of our sails when we saw the Cobalt, especially after the rep gave it a 9 out of 10. We just walked away from both to get some perspective, we may go back to the Four Winns, my only two concerns with it is the horseshoe back seat taking up to much of the floor space, and whether the 5.0 GXi will have enough jam for a 21' boat but man was it well looked after.

onewhippedpuppy; I think had the Cobalt really been a 9 out of 10 it would have been priced higher, so it wasn't the deal I thought I was getting.

 

[thumpar]

Re: I think it's a no brainer, but HELP Cobalt vs Four Winns

That is sad. I hate to see good boats get poor care. Don't be afraid of a boat with a Bravo 1. I love mine. You may want to open up your search to some boats that are a tad older. My 1996 Crownline 202 BR is a little older but you would not know it. I get compliments from people at the ramp who have much newer boats all the time. It was only $8750 with trailer and ALL maintenance records from the local Crownline dealer going back to 2002.