Occasional starting problem- Volvo 4.3L

[propbuster]

I have a 2001 Glastron with a Chevy 4.3L V-6. Occasionally the engine won't start- especially when I am in the middle of the lake and have turned the motor off and tried to restart. Basically, I turn the key and nothing happens. There is not any noise from the starter or any other component.<br /><br />By the way, I appreciate the kind people who have towed me back to the dock!<br /><br />I have taken the boat into the dealer twice to have them check out the problem. They put it in the tank and run the engine, and restart with no problem, time after time. From what I understand, they can't figure out what is wrong until they get it to not start. It is defintely not the battery.<br /><br />Both myself and the dealer have checked extensively for loose connections or other obvious problems.<br /><br />The problem seems to occur most often in hot weather, but not always. So maybe it is a solenoid, I understand those are sometimes subject to failure when hot. I suppose I could simply replace the solenoid and hope for the best, but I would like to be able to diagnose whether that is the problem. Plus, it could be something unrelated. Maybe it could be the button on the throttle that allows the engine to be revved without engaging the out drive? Or possibly just a loose wire somewhere. Or maybe a key component is getting wet.<br /><br />I am hoping someone else has had a similar problem and figured out how to fix it. This is very frustrating since it only happens on an occasional basis.<br /><br />I would appreciate any helpful advice.

 

[Ralph 123]

Re: Occasional starting problem- Volvo 4.3L

Propbuster - have you made sure that your controller is in neutral? This sounds like the neutral safety switch...

 

[propbuster]

Re: Occasional starting problem- Volvo 4.3L

Yep, I made sure the controller is in neutral. I have even taken it in and out of gear and back to neutral hoping that a connection would be made.<br /><br />Maybe the switch is not working correctly as you suggested. Is there a simple way to check the switch?

 

[Ralph 123]

Re: Occasional starting problem- Volvo 4.3L

The next time it happens you need to check that you have continuity through the switch or just bypass the switch and see if it starts. You should also check the connection back to the ignition switch to make sure it is making good contact.

 

[waterone1@aol.com]

Re: Occasional starting problem- Volvo 4.3L

Are you aware that there are two solenoids (a slave or assist on top of the engine and the starter mounted one) ? When you say that you turn the key and hear nothing, have you opened the engine hatch and listened for the faint click of the slave solenoid ? Do you have any accessories wired to the ignition "on" position ? If so, do they light up or work when this problem occurs ? Let's assume that you have a depth guage or something else that is on the key switch....and it still works....that would mean that power is getting to the key switch. I think I would go to radio shack and get a couple of small 12V panel lights (the kind that have 6 or 8 inch wires attached). I would wire one to the start terminal of the ignition switch and let it hang below the dash, the other one I would wire to the small terminals of the slave solenoid. The next time it acts up, you will be able to see if the ignition switch is passing voltage on the start terminal and be able to see if it is getting back to the slave solenoid....this will help narrow it down.

 

[propbuster]

Re: Occasional starting problem- Volvo 4.3L

All the other electric accessories work- depth finder, radio, horn, lights, blower, bilge pump- all that works when the engine does not start. I have listened for clicks or other tell-tale signs that power is getting to the starter, but have not heard anything. But, then again, you mention a faint click, so I need to listen a little closer. I will have to check that out. Does a faint click from a solenoid mean that it is good or bad? At least power is getting to it if it clicks I suppose.<br /><br />I like the idea of the panel lights- that way I can instantly see whether power is getting where it needs to go because the light will either be on or not.<br /><br />My general understanding of the electrical system is that the key switch completes the circuit and power then goes to the neutral switch on the throttle, then to the solenoids (I did not know that there are two solenoids!), and then to the starter. So, the places to install the radio shack lights would be at each of those intermediate locations.<br /><br />I appreciate the good advise. I'll see if I can get that wired up this weekend without electrocuting myself!

 

[JB]

Re: Occasional starting problem- Volvo 4.3L

I think this is an I/O engine problem. Moving it there.

 

[Don S]

Re: Occasional starting problem- Volvo 4.3L

All the other electric accessories work- depth finder, radio, horn, lights, blower, bilge pump- all that works when the engine does not start.

All those other accessories do not operate off the ignition side of the wiring.<br />You could have a slave solenoid, or even the main plug connection bad.<br />If the clamp on the main plug on the engine wiring harness has been overtightened, you could have a problem also, it just crushes all the connections.<br />Basically you need to get test light and a wiring diagram and find out where the power isn't, when it should be.

 

[Reel Poor]

Re: Occasional starting problem- Volvo 4.3L

Had a problem like this with my 2000 Volvo 5.0 Liter. Turned out to be the breaker for ignition switch. It would intermitenly fail. It started out like you describe and progressed to dieing while under way. Might restart, might not<br />"unpredictable". Mine is mounted directly below ignition switch. Had to bypass it one day about 75 miles offshore.

 

[bigbrownbuku]

Re: Occasional starting problem- Volvo 4.3L

the next time it happens to you isolate the location of the fault. disconnect the main harness plug and jump the starter manually, if the engine cranks and starts its a control issue. if it wont crank when the starter is jumped connect some jumper cables straight from the battery to the starter/block grounds and try again.<br />im sure your dealer is as frustrated as you are, but if it isnt broken......

 

[waterone1@aol.com]

Re: Occasional starting problem- Volvo 4.3L

Propbuster, what I was asking about in my previous post was any accessories that operated only when the key was on (for instance my trim tab indicators only come on when the key is in the on position), If you have something like that, and it (they) still work when you cannot start the engine, that tells us that you are still getting volatge to the ignition switch. If they don't work when the boat is "acting up" that tells us that you are losing power before the ignition switch. To clarify the "click" of the slave solenoid, it is much smaller than the solenoid mounted to the starter, it would be hard to hear unless the engine hatch is open. Intermittant problems are much more difficult than regular breakdowns, since you have to have the problem present to diagnose it. I think you said that the dealer was not able to find a problem, so the only way I can think to proceed is to narrow it down with the test lights. Just a reminder, you have a boat with a known problem...don't forget that....engines always die or won't start at the worst times....this is not a boat I would take onto a river with barge traffic or anywhere near a dam!!

 

[propbuster]

Re: Occasional starting problem- Volvo 4.3L

Maybe the switch is the problem- I have noticed sometimes that the trim gauge sometimes does not work, but I never noticed whether that occurred at the same time as the failure to start. Makes sense though...I take it that would be a positive identification that the switch is faulty?<br /><br />Reelpoor describes a similar problem with a breaker for the ignition switch- I will check that out as well. It has never died while underway, but its nice to know that could occur. <br /><br />I mainly go to a medium size lake and stay away from the dam. Safety is always a big concern since I usually have my wife and kids with me. I can never get the failure to occur in my driveway or on the boat ramp- it always happens when I turn the engine off to let the kids play in the water. I have seen a pictures of a boat going over a river dam- not something I would like to experience.

 

[trog100]

Re: Occasional starting problem- Volvo 4.3L

"By the way, I appreciate the kind people who have towed me back to the dock!"<br /><br />curious to know how long it has to stand before it decides to go again.. i assume after a certain while it always does..<br /><br />ten to one it is the solenoid.. but being 100% sure that it is isnt always easy to prove with intermittant faults.. there was an indepth thread a couple of weeks back about diagnosing and testing for this kinda thing.. i would try and find it if i were u.. <br /><br />trog100