Disk Pads Failing??????

tank1949

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Years ago I owned a SR AJ and hauled it with a triple axel trailer with one axle having galvanized drum brakes initiated by surge coupler. I had replaced original rusted brakes with galvanized new ones about 3 years before I sold boat and trailer. They were still in good shape. Of course I had flush kits installed. Typically, I get to use a boat about a dozen or so times a year and trailed it about 25 miles round trip to and from launch.

I bought another rig around the first of 2012 and started working immediately on trailer/boat which was in very poor shape. I replaced rusted drums with SS disks brakes on one axle of the three. The salesman had tried to sell me three sets but I remembered that the single axle drum brakes on my SR had worked well and lasted long. The ss disk ought to perform just as or better???????? Right?

I installed brakes and went to work on rest of trailer and then boat. For about 12 trips they appeared to work well. They stopped boat.

I have made about a dozen trips to the same launch working out bugs/repairs in boat and just discovered that both disk outside pads were worn out on both disk brakes. Something is locking up calipers or not allowing them to release. Outside pads only!!!!!! The manufacture has been very helpful and warranted all materials. The dust boots are all but disintegrated on both disk brakes. As soon as I replace worn parts with new ones, I will send all used parts back to them for examination.

The surge coupler has solenoid to return brake fluid to master cylinder and appears to be working. However, although I have trailer lights certified for submerging and they work, I keep blowing fuses in my truck when backing into water. I never submerged solenoid. To keep from blowing truck fuses, I disconnect trailer light quick connect when I am about to submerge trailer. Since I am at an incline, I don't see how this short distance would wear out outside pads on both brakes. We are talking about 12 trips, maybe.

Of course, I wash off everything after returning with fresh water. Any ideas????????
 

batman99

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Re: Disk Pads Failing??????

Me thinks the trailer might have 2 x problems.

For 3 x axle trailer, I would determine loaded boat weight with empty trailer weight numbers, then ensure enough trailer "braking power" is installed on the trailer. For example, let's say your 3 x axle trailer has 3,500 lbs axles. That's 3 x 3500 = 10,500 lbs (of max combined weight). Let's say the total weight of trailer and loaded boat is 7,000 lbs. If only 1 x axle (3,500 lbs axle) has disc brakes, then that 1 x axle braking system is enduring double stress. Thus, wearing out very fast. Using above numbers (as example), I would install another set of disc brakes on the other axle. Thus, having 2 x 3500 axles with disc brakes = 7,000 lbs of "braking power". Do "crunch the weight numbers" on your boat trailer + loaded boat weight. Then, decide if trailer's other axles need disc brakes as well.

For my boat trailer (with full electric brakes), I always disconnect its 7-pin connector from Tow Vehicle. Never had a wiring problem from disconnecting "before" backing trailer into water. If this works for you, then continue to disconnect the 7-pin connector as well. Good long term habit to apply. From science, 12V should not be effected by water dippings. Something is shorting out. Are you using LED lights? I hear LED lights handle water dumpings much better. Might be worth investigating….

Hope this helps.
 
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bruceb58

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Re: Disk Pads Failing??????

Just to make sure what we are working with here, you have one axle of a 3 axle trailer with disk brakes and other axles have none right?

Second, not sure what load you have but I would have brakes on all 3 axles. What load are you carrying?

When you switched to disk form drum, did you replace the master cylinder with one for disk brakes? If not, that is the reason your brakes wore out. Drum brake master cylinders leave pressure in the line when they are released and you can't have that with disk brakes.
 

achris

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Re: Disk Pads Failing??????

.... However, although I have trailer lights certified for submerging and they work, I keep blowing fuses in my truck when backing into water. I never submerged solenoid. To keep from blowing truck fuses, I disconnect trailer light quick connect when I am about to submerge trailer. ....

You should not need to do that. You obviously have a problem somewhere in the circuit. Which fuses blows? (stop, indicators, tail lights) I would be checking all the wiring. If you're launching into salt water and someone has previously 'probed' the wiring with a pointed test light, you'll be getting your short from that....

Chris.......
 

tank1949

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Re: Disk Pads Failing??????

You should not need to do that. You obviously have a problem somewhere in the circuit. Which fuses blows? (stop, indicators, tail lights) I would be checking all the wiring. If you're launching into salt water and someone has previously 'probed' the wiring with a pointed test light, you'll be getting your short from that....

Chris.......

I requested a new master cylindar from vendor to match disk brakes from same vendor. However, vendor may have screwed up or some stock person put incorrect master cylender in box.

I did have a backup switch problem on my truck not energizing master cylinder solonoid, so I created a hot lead via toggle switch on dash of truck. It appears to energize bypass solonoid. Besides, when backing up, you damn sure notice if brakes are engaged.


One thing that I failed to mention is that driving about a mile from launch I must pass through a couple of stop signs and I did notice some (what appears) moaning sounds from trailer before I applied brakes. I am hearing impaired but can still hear them. Trailer doesn't do it all the time. Less than 1000 miles totally destroyed brakes. I am leaning more on incorrect master cylinder sent to me. Invoice plainly states master cylinder for disk brakes. However, per vendor, I had to drill and tap master cylinder to handle brake fluid return from solenoid.

We were pretty cautious about not pricking wires but we could have missed something or former owner may have pricked wires and I just cant see spot. Usually, when salt water lays on unprotected copper wire, green stuff accumulates. I have not seen any.


thx'
 

tank1949

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Re: Disk Pads Failing??????

1 fuse blows in truck for back-up/turn sigls
 

BRICH1260

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Re: Disk Pads Failing??????

I would suggest that since you have a triple axle trailer, obvious a heavy rig, that you also need to add brakes to at least two, perhaps all three axles. Your asking that one set of pads to do alot, you need to give them some help.
 

tank1949

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Re: Disk Pads Failing??????

I don't mind adding another set if this would solve the problem. However, I trailered a heavy-*** 270 SR AJ on a tripple axle trailer for several years with a single pair of drums and never had a problem of wearing out or stopping. And, ironically, this trailer came with one pair of rusted out drums. The disk manufacturer has been very supportive. I am going to also give them a chance of solving the problem before mentioning them. The master cylinder, which is not theirs may be the problem. However, I wanted other opinions. That is why I went to IBOATS. Thx to all!!!!!!!
 

Bob's Garage

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Re: Disk Pads Failing??????

You obviously have multiple problems, some of which is due to a misunderstanding on how the disc brake system functions.

1st: You need to correct the shorting. It would be best to re-wire your trailer, using dedicated grounds for the lights w/waterproof connections, and an additional ground to the trailer for the marker lights. (The backup and turn signals are NOT on the same circuit).

2nd: When you disconnect your wiring harness you are disconnecting the backup solenoid, which locks the brakes. They may be slipping if they are wet, but that causes them to wear out. If you want to continue this practice, block the coupler from moving backward by using a wood block or a pin in the hole provided by some manufacturers. If you are using Tie-Down equipment that is the next problem you will be having.

By fixing the 1st problem, you should have fixed the 2nd.

By the way, most States require brakes on all axles, regardless of how the manufacturer and dealer set it up, and sold it to you. Suggest you check your state's regs.
 

tank1949

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Re: Disk Pads Failing??????

You obviously have multiple problems, some of which is due to a misunderstanding on how the disc brake system functions.

1st: You need to correct the shorting. It would be best to re-wire your trailer, using dedicated grounds for the lights w/waterproof connections, and an additional ground to the trailer for the marker lights. (The backup and turn signals are NOT on the same circuit).

2nd: When you disconnect your wiring harness you are disconnecting the backup solenoid, which locks the brakes. They may be slipping if they are wet, but that causes them to wear out. If you want to continue this practice, block the coupler from moving backward by using a wood block or a pin in the hole provided by some manufacturers. If you are using Tie-Down equipment that is the next problem you will be having.

By fixing the 1st problem, you should have fixed the 2nd.

By the way, most States require brakes on all axles, regardless of how the manufacturer and dealer set it up, and sold it to you. Suggest you check your state's regs.

Bob-Thx!!!!

I do have 3/8 rod I insert into coupler to keep it from moving so that brakes will not engaging when backing up after disconnecting electrical. I learned that real quick!!!!!

I am more inclined that bad master cylinder or dust boots failed causing excessive water mixing over ss and aluminum psiton/caliper. Dissimilar metal...

I don't see how as little driving as I have done would have completely destroyed outside pads on both brakes. I will check state reg.
 

tank1949

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Re: Disk Pads Failing??????

Do you use an equalizing hitch?



Never used one iun my lfe. RTrailer didn't come with one. Previouse SR trailer didn't have one either. Simple 2 5/16 coupler surge brakes.
 

bruceb58

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Re: Disk Pads Failing??????

How much is your towed weight?

Just noticed.. in your original post...If these disk brakes you have are the TieDown non vented stainless disk brakes, those are your problem. I had those on for around 500 miles. The rotors warped, some of the calipers pistons stuck and wore brake pads out quickly. I threw them in the trash and replaced with Kodiaks.
 
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tank1949

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Re: Disk Pads Failing??????

Tie Down totally waranteed brakes and have them re-installed. I sent failed brakes back but TD has yet to determine what cause premature failure. I have sinced purchased manual valve to stop braking pressure in reverse, if I choose. I did this just in case my bolt inserted into couple was not doing its job. I am also going to go over grounding again. Just to be sure.
 

phillyg

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Re: Disk Pads Failing??????

I agree with a couple other responses that you may need brakes on the second and possibly the third axles, but that is wholly contingent on the weight on the trailer. Not all states require brakes on all axles. Let's say you have 3500lb axles. If your boat and trailer don't exceed 3500lbs, brakes on one axle is okay. But if you have 6000lbs of boat and trailer then you need brakes on two axles. However, I don't think that's your problem since you only towed a short distance before the new pads wore out. Short of defective calipers/pads/master cylinder out of the box or an improper installation, I think your problem has to be a mismatched master cylinder or bad reverse solenoid.
 
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