Adding aftermarket VOLTAGE REGULATOR - anyone actually done this ???

[Moody Blue]

I've read on these forums many discussions about needing / adding a voltage regulator to an older Merc (1971 Merc 800) but no information from anyone who has actually done this successfully.

I constantly see voltages of 17V while running and it has not caused any issues YET, but I'm not comfortable with it for a number of reasons. I have a type 24 marine maintenance free starting battery. If I run the battery down a little then run the motor, the voltage holds steady at about 14V for awhile then jumps to 17V, presumably once the battery has reached full charge.

Would really like to hear from anyone that has done this "upgrade".

 

[capslock118]

Re: Adding aftermarket VOLTAGE REGULATOR - anyone actually done this ???

Sure it's 17v and not 16v? I think 16v should be normal for charging while the engine is running.

 

[monk-monk]

Re: Adding aftermarket VOLTAGE REGULATOR - anyone actually done this ???

Yes, install a voltage regulator...especially with a maintenance free battery! These older charging systems were not designed for a maintenance free battery...with the open cell battery, the heat from over-charging would boil the acid/water out of the battery...saving the battery, but you would have to maintain the acid/water in the battery...with the closed cell maintenance free battery, it will bake the battery and ruin it...I got a voltage regulator from CDI for my 1150 and 1400...i will be installing it one day this week...i'll let you know how it does...

 

[Gomer50]

Re: Adding aftermarket VOLTAGE REGULATOR - anyone actually done this ???

Here is one that had my attention,,,
http://www.mfgsupply.com/m/c/01-090-1.html

 

[emilime75]

Re: Adding aftermarket VOLTAGE REGULATOR - anyone actually done this ???

I've read on these forums many discussions about needing / adding a voltage regulator to an older Merc (1971 Merc 800).

I'm a bit confused. Don't these older Mercs already come with a regulator/rectifier? My 78 1150 did.
Are you asking about adding one to a motor that does not have one, or upgrading the existing one to a better one?
The regulator on mine died and I replaced it, in a pinch, with a crap shack unit. It only cost a few bucks and had me back on the water that day. I thought I would replace it later but it's been working fine so there was no need.

 

[j_martin]

Re: Adding aftermarket VOLTAGE REGULATOR - anyone actually done this ???

I'm a bit confused. Don't these older Mercs already come with a regulator/rectifier? My 78 1150 did.
Are you asking about adding one to a motor that does not have one, or upgrading the existing one to a better one?
The regulator on mine died and I replaced it, in a pinch, with a crap shack unit. It only cost a few bucks and had me back on the water that day. I thought I would replace it later but it's been working fine so there was no need.

They come with a rectifier, which is what you replaced. Original design was to let the battery and load do the regulating, with a small cost in electrolyte in the battery. Worked OK, and didn't seem to shorten battery life significantly.

Maintenance free recombinant batteries change the game.

The regulator shown probably replaces the rectifier. You could also use a standard 20 amp Mercury or CDI regulator. Works well. No reason why the snowmobile regulator won't work.

Be sure you have a flat mounting place that can dissipate a little heat when you mount it.

Some of the V6's had a shunt/stator saturating regulator that was marginal in effect, and usually quite spectacular in failure.

hope it helps
John

 

[RRitt]

Re: Adding aftermarket VOLTAGE REGULATOR - anyone actually done this ???

there is no black and white answer. which one is best for you depends upon you.

Regulators protect your electronics from voltage spikes and on newer outboards with computers they are a must. However, regulators absorb all the extra electricity and dump it out as heat. They commonly overheat and burn out. It is quite possible for one to burn out while your motor is running and you find yourself in the middle of a lake with a dead battery.

Rectifiers turn AC into DC. They do not control the voltage level or absorb extra electricity. They are just a reed valve for electrons. Only positive flow is allowed to pass. Before computers and digital electronics regulation was not a big deal. The radio could have a few extra capacitors and take care of itself for cheap. In an unregulated engine the stator was designed to work with the battery as a single system. The internal resistance of the stator combined with the voltage constant of the battery provided stable voltage without cooking your battery. However, if the battery is disconnected while the engine is running it can easily fry your ignition. The up side is that rectifiers never break and your battery only goes dead after months of warning.

so pick your poison.

 

[j_martin]

Re: Adding aftermarket VOLTAGE REGULATOR - anyone actually done this ???

there is no black and white answer. which one is best for you depends upon you.

Regulators protect your electronics from voltage spikes and on newer outboards with computers they are a must. However, regulators absorb all the extra electricity and dump it out as heat. They commonly overheat and burn out. It is quite possible for one to burn out while your motor is running and you find yourself in the middle of a lake with a dead battery.

It depends on the regulator. Yer right about the original little shunt regulator, and also about the Mercury wet dream 40 amp regulator, but these little cube jobs are TSR (Transistor Switching Regulator) type regulators that only dissipate heat when switching, and from the forward voltage drop of the rectifier section, so it's only a few watts per regulator. They need a heat sink, but not much. Early TSR regulators tended to fry semiconductors internally. Later versions are stronger, because design has improved, and also components.

A barefoot rectifier is pretty primitive, and can be very hard on electronics if a wire gets loose or corrodes. Regulated is much safer, and in addition cuts down on battery maintenance.

hope it helps
John

 

[ONERCBOATER]

Re: Adding aftermarket VOLTAGE REGULATOR - anyone actually done this ???

having a small merc 200 20hp from 1978 mine only had a rectifier on it as well, I replaced the rectifier with a used jetski regulator/rectifier unit off ebay as It cost a whopping $6 shipping included... so far so good. Very simple install... smooth voltage happy boater.

 

[Chris1956]

Re: Adding aftermarket VOLTAGE REGULATOR - anyone actually done this ???

A lot of the maintenance free batteries actually have places where you can add water to the cells. Look at the top closely and you may find flush caps, perhaps under the decal. If you batt has these, top her off every once in a while.

Normally those old Merc stators only put out 9A or so, at WOT, so regulation is not an issue. The battery simply absorbs the extra juice. If yu can find a heavy duty 16v zener diode, you could make a voltage cut out device, which is a primative VR.

 

[merc850]

Re: Adding aftermarket VOLTAGE REGULATOR - anyone actually done this ???

Okay I have the same 16v output and I am planning to install this
.
Is this one of the bad ones that has been mentioned above?
I think it's from a V6.
If this burned out wouldn't it just let the rectifier put out the 16v again.

 

[j_martin]

Re: Adding aftermarket VOLTAGE REGULATOR - anyone actually done this ???

When they work, they work. When they don't, they smoke, sometimes with a lot of show. There's a reason why it's NLA at Murkery.

 

[Moody Blue]

Re: Adding aftermarket VOLTAGE REGULATOR - anyone actually done this ???

I'm not too worried about the battery. It's survived 2 seasons so far with no ill effect. I'm more concerned about the fishfinder, stereo, gps etc that are connected to the battery. I've looked at many sites and was surprised to see the high cost of a regulator and how many different types there are. Three wire, four wire, five wire, six wire etc etc. As Chris1956 pointed out, the stator only puts out 9A at best, so I don't need a high capacity regulator like some of the 40A rated ones I've seen.

Is the regulator installed before or after the rectifier? I'm thinking after, but not sure.

If the regulator is dropping 3V across it (17-14), and the stator is outputting 9A, then it has to dissipate 27W. That is a fair amount of heat for a small device. Heatsinking will be very important.

Guess I need to take a look at the CDI website and see what they offer.

 

[Moody Blue]

Re: Adding aftermarket VOLTAGE REGULATOR - anyone actually done this ???

Another approach I was thinking of is a "charge controller" that is used in solar panel charging systems. I have a 10A model that I use with a 60W solar panel setup on our camper. The thing automatically switches the output depending on the battery voltage. If battery voltage drops below 12.6V then the controller goes into CHARGE mode to charge the battery. Once the battery voltage exceeds 14.4V, the controller goes into FLOAT mode, preventing overcharging. Wondering if this would work with the MERC? One possible hangup I see is that the solar panel output is pure DC, while the stator output is fullwave rectified AC. Not sure the controller would like that.

I love taking the unconventional approach to solve problems :facepalm:

 

[j_martin]

Re: Adding aftermarket VOLTAGE REGULATOR - anyone actually done this ???

The 20 amp mercury regulator, and the 5 wire snowmobile regulator someone posted are actually rectifier/regulators. They replace the bridge rectifier that's there now. The two screw thing Mercury normally puts on has one wire to red, one to one of the stator wires, and grounds through a mounting screw. I believe the design is to DC upset or saturate the stator, which is pretty sophomoric to my mind.

You don't want a cycle controller on it, you want a voltage regulator at about 13.8 V.

hope it helps
John

 

[Moody Blue]

Re: Adding aftermarket VOLTAGE REGULATOR - anyone actually done this ???

I took a peek at the CDI website and for each of the devices they advertise, the following warning is printed.

DO NOT USE A MAINTAINENCE FREE, AGM OR DRY CELL BATTERY WITH THIS TYPE REGULATOR/RECTIFIER!!!

I checked the Merc types and the OMC types, and all had the same warning. I'm puzzled. Sent them an email asking for their recommendations.

 

[Moody Blue]

Re: Adding aftermarket VOLTAGE REGULATOR - anyone actually done this ???

Did some more searching and found several sources for "universal" rectifier/regulators for a fraction of the cost of the prices of the CDI components.

Here are a couple links for reference. Any reason to spend twice the money for a CDI part?

http://www.fullthrottletahoe.com/fu...ages/catalog-specs/09SnowPages/09Snow 243.pdf

http://www.regulatorrectifier.com/catalog/Universal-Solid-State-Single-Phase-Regulator-Rectifier

 

[RRitt]

Re: Adding aftermarket VOLTAGE REGULATOR - anyone actually done this ???

"universal" is kind of vague. you would need to compare the cdi specs to the "universal" ones. If the specs match then the only reason to avoid would be wiring or mounting.

 

[Moody Blue]

Re: Adding aftermarket VOLTAGE REGULATOR - anyone actually done this ???

That's the thing. CDI does not list the specs on their regulator/rectifiers. They only say it replaces model xzy etc. The universal ones I've seen are widely used on snowmobiles, electric scooter and so on and are rated at 200W or about 14A @ 14.4V. That is well within the 9A output of my stator.

For reference, here is the reply from CDI regarding batteries and the recommended regulator/rectifier. Interesting info on battery usage.

Check out the price at $162 for the regulator/rectifier

From CDI

Dear Sir,

We suggest replacing your battery with a Starting/Cranking or Dual Purpose non-Maintenance-Free battery and replacing your existing Rectifier with Regulator/Rectifier Part# 194-5279. List Price is $162.16. Please contact our Sales Department at 800-467-3371 to order.

The only model engine that advocates the use of Maintenance-Free batteries is a Mercury Verado. Yamaha actually strongly discourages the use of them in some of their service manuals. They are not recommended for use in any outboard (other than the Verado), especially a battery-driven ignition such as your's where battery voltage is ultra critical. Please see our Battery Charging Issues article located here for further clarification

From the CDI website, info on battery types and usage.

http://www.cdielectronics.com/TechS...ues, Regulator-Rectifiers and Tachometers.pdf

 

[Moody Blue]

Re: Adding aftermarket VOLTAGE REGULATOR - anyone actually done this ???

More food for thought. Spent the evening searching for a NON-maintenance free battery. Went to UAP/NAPA, Sears, Autozone, Canadian Tire (large Canadian automotive supplier) all without luck. They looked at me like I was crazy. WHY would you want one of those things they asked . Seems the general public has no interest in maintaining a battery

So, can anyone recommend where I might find a NON-maintenance free battery?