Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

[pckeen]

Re: Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

Watermann,

I don't know if I'm breaking a rule here, but what did you pay for this? I see from a number of iboats threads that users don't post their purchase prices. Am I committing a sin in asking this? If so, I will accept my scolding/reprimand/inevitable shunning with good grace and apologies.

The reason I ask is I'm looking for a future project, and have been looking at Starcraft Chieftains. The asking prices for Chieftains, ranging from junk to reasonable quality boats, seem to be in the $3k-$7k range. Too rich for my blood....I'm looking for something to strip to the bone and start over with.

Given that you looked for a while, I thought I would stick my neck out and ask.

 

[Watermann]

Re: Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

Peter there isn't a rule I know of on boat prices, most guys say when they get a good deal and others don't when they pay too much. It really matters about the condition and the location. I picked the Chief up for $600.00 knowing that it was a complete basket case in need of restoration. The guy wanted double that for the boat but realized his pool of people was very small who wanted such a project.

I started searching the entire area for boats in alleys and back yards. Made a fun time of it, take the wife to lunch and then start alley creeping and back yard gazing. 2 sets of eyes helps. I took cash with me, $800 was all I was willing to spend on a ship wreck that needed $1000's to restore. Some times we were way too far apart in price and couldn't even come close to meeting in the middle so I would just walk away. Others when we almost got there, I would leave my phone number and the promise of quick cash money if they changed their mind. That's how I got this one, the guy mulled it over for a week and then called me figuring 6 bills in his pocket was better than a rotted boat in his yard.

Just have to keep looking and be ready to make that offer. Don't go boat shopping with an empty wallet, you could miss out a great boat.

 

[Watermann]

Re: Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

Let there be light! Got the outdrive out finally with half of the bolts snapped off in the outer mount. I can't believe the size of this boat compared to my little SN!

The transom cap removed too exposing the transom, shes a bit rotten alright. Every last one of the bolts fought me tooth and nail to come out. I used PB but they laughed at me so I resorted to a hack saw and grinder. Going to have to cut some aluminum on the side rails to get the transom to lift out.I don't think when they built these boats that Starcraft realized others would be tearing them down in the future.

Once the transom is removed I can see what lays ahead for the tear down. Piles of debris and rotted decking dead ahead! Oh yeah and more bee nests.

 

[dozerII]

Re: Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

Looks like your having fun Waterman, great project.

 

[pckeen]

Re: Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

Dozer has a warped sense of fun. Thought of using dynamite?

 

[Watermann]

Re: Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

Dozer has a warped sense of fun. Thought of using dynamite?

Funny you mention that because the transom is stuck in there so tight I think I may need some C4. Been over the whole thing twice, and famous last words... "no missed screws." Got an idea for using a jack on the ground to push up the transom by way of the keyhole. I also thought about cutting the sucker into 2 pieces. I don't have a cherry picker handy so any other ideas out there?

Definitely fun and worthwhile when progress is being made but this bad boy is stubborn and gives up nothing without a fight. I see it as a challenge, the immovable object and me the irresistible force.

 

[Streetgang]

Re: Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

All I can offer is Yikes, sure is interesting watching these 2 forces collide.

Pretty wild watching all the threads and seeing how this resto stuff isnt for the faint of heart eh.

The C4 reference brought back a memory from the service where the Seabees "Can Do" spirit and the plastic explosive allowed me save the day, but that is not for this thread....just a personal good nudge into the way back machine.

I certainly appreciate your experience and attention to detail so just offering that soon you will have a clean hull with all that crapola out of the way. We all know how important it is to inspect the hull completely for cracks, loose rivets, missing rivets, etc. Grandad has a similar hull design to yours and just suggesting that you may want to look through his analysis and solution while you have everything clean and exposed.

It is on his first page and is here: http://forums.iboats.com/boat-resto...tarcraft-holiday-reno-hull-repair-517895.html

His discovery of missing / loose rivets on the stringers and my discovery on missing / loose rivets on bulkheads seem to be causes of cracking I think. You know the drill, just throwing this out.

Always interesting !

 

[GA_Boater]

Re: Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

H2Oman - Get the transom out? Some of the others with the same problem have used a few different ways to get it out. One way is to screw a 2X4 chunk on the inner transom ply, another longer 2X4 and a fulcrum point to pry the transom up. Another is some screw eyes in the top of the transom and a hoist of some sort to lift it out. Might be a few other ways short of blowing the azz end off a Chief with C4.

 

[Watermann]

Re: Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

Transom is out using the keyhole and jack idea. All it took was a jack, cement blocks to elevate it, a 2x4 for a ram and me on the inside hammering the transom to break the mechanical bind that was sealing it in. Oh yeah and my SN resto buddy is now my SC resto pal.

Didn't stop there either, kept going a ways forward on the tear down. The decking is drilled loose but not lifted out, it's easier to move around inside that way.

 

[Pmccraney]

Re: Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

Good work getting that transom out...
Demo has officially begun!
Let's see - your Sea Nymph resto took about 30 minutes... So, I'm guessing you'll have this one splashed by end of August right?

 

[Watermann]

Re: Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

Good work getting that transom out...
Demo has officially begun!
Let's see - your Sea Nymph resto took about 30 minutes... So, I'm guessing you'll have this one splashed by end of August right?

Yeah right! This is a long haul marathon but if each day, week or month I can satisfy my addiction it should be steady progress towards that goal.

Oh I forgot to mention the legendary ability of my resto buddy to photo bomb any picture taken in his presence.

 

[jvanhees]

Re: Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

Good work and great progress! Any more wasps left? I see the protection is still handy.

 

[Watermann]

Re: Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

Good work and great progress! Any more wasps left? I see the protection is still handy.

Oh yes BEES... but I'm slowly forcing them out as I move towards the bow, spray the nests, bees scatter, haul on out of there, come back and poke the nests down with wrecking bar. I'm up to 4 cans of spray and 3 bombs now. The cuddy is teaming with them, I even tried firing up a stogie and crawled up in there with them. Seems stogie smoke does the opposite of smoke used by bee keepers. I've only gotten stung once so far, feeling a bit lucky.

Slow going and nothing photo worthy right now, drilling rivets, grinding off old ferrous rusted screws and bolts. Prying up rotten decking and tossing junk overboard in a heap. Ya know the fun stuff!

Going on vacation next week, heading to Glacier National Park and then on down to Yellowstone so I should be rested up and ready for some serious work on the Chief when I get home.

 

[Watermann]

Re: Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

Back, rested sorta... and determined to finish the Chief gut job. Kicking, fighting the whole way I got down to scooping out crud and styrofoam this morning. Last few pieces and I found the hold out remaining active bee nest underneath. Swarming caused a bail out over the side and brought a halt to my progress since I ran out of bee spray. I had to leave them alone and just back off. I got a couple pics, somewhat lack luster phase of the operation I know but the good news is I've found no major issues structurally on the tear down.

Found what looks like some gluvit in the keel, in the pic it shows up as a dark strip.

Next problem child, the bow cap. OK, why would a boat maker cause it to be impossible to remove a bow cap? I don't get it really, there is no way to get the sucker to let go of the rub rail channel. Here is a pic of my nemesis of the day.

The cap moves freely and only had 2 rivets to drill out but the V shape of the bow keeps it held in the channels. Anyone have advice on how they defeated the Starcraft Islander bow cap from hell? The only way I can see is to remove the rub rail channels. The problem with that is there are 2 screws that are underneath the cap. I can guarantee that they will spin when trying to remove the nuts from the inside.

 

[GA_Boater]

Re: Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

Easy peezy- Pour some honey under the bow cap. As the critters build a new nest the cap is lifted right off. :laugh:

Get a couple of putty knives and work them under the cap. Pry them up and tap until the cap is on top of the rub rail channels. Sometimes you can work from side to side. After the cap is on top of the channels, just gently tap it forward. It will come off! Trust me.

I used the word gentle a few times with reason. The cap can crack if you use too much force. Little taps will do it.

It's all the Zen of Starcraft. :lol:

 

[Watermann]

Re: Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

Easy peezy- Pour some honey under the bow cap. As the critters build a new nest the cap is lifted right off. :laugh:

Get a couple of putty knives and work them under the cap. Pry them up and tap until the cap is on top of the rub rail channels. Sometimes you can work from side to side. After the cap is on top of the channels, just gently tap it forward. It will come off! Trust me.

I used the word gentle a few times with reason. The cap can crack if you use too much force. Little taps will do it.

It's all the Zen of Starcraft. :lol:

Ahh yes, the Zen moments of Starcraft is flowing... Well I thought about prying but I've never been very lucky when resorting to gentle persuasion. There is absolutely no gap on top to get the cap started coming off, it would rely on compression of the top deck. If I removed all of the support wood from underneath then maybe it would compress. I will have to give that a try. By the way, I see that all of the support wood in the cuddy is mahogany and in very good shape so far.

Also I do need to remove the rub rail channels if for no other reason than to replace the old machine screws and nuts with new SS and nylocks as well as clean off any corrosion under the rail channel. Is there any sort of problem that may be associated with the removal of the top rub rail channels?

 

[dozerII]

Re: Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

GA's got it, you will notice a little tab of aluminum sticking down over the inside edge of the cap locking it onto the rub rails, once you have those pried over the edge a little tapping takes it right off.

 

[GA_Boater]

Re: Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

Put the tool beside the channel and gently (there's that word again) tap until it goes under the cap. No need for any other parts removal. You need to lift the cap and the deck has to fairly firm to get the lift.

On my SC, the rub rail hardware is stainless. If I remember, no lock washers used and plain nuts. Which is plain nuts. Many were loose and I simply added lock washers.

 

[Watermann]

Re: Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

Alright I got that sucker off. Had to use 2 putty knives and put the end of a wrecking bar between then and tap in in until each side lifted off the rail and then it was easy to bump it off. I look forward to putting it back on now...

Thanks for the help GA & dozer, that info was all I needed to go forward.

My next conquest will be removing the windshields. On the top windshield they used ferrous nut and bolts... they are completely rusted solid and have to all be removed/replaced. Any words of wisdom for that job and things to look out for/tips.

 

[GA_Boater]

Re: Tin addiction 18' Starcraft Chieftain

Putting the cap on is easier. Just line it up and gently tap the front until it pops on.

When I hit rusted hardware like W/S hold downs that I don't care about because I'll replace with stainless, I just wrench it until it breaks the bolt shaft. I don't even bother with penetrating oil. The bolt shaft is probably half gone anyway.