Dow closes near 13000!!!

POINTER94

Vice Admiral
Joined
Oct 12, 2003
Messages
5,031
Re: Dow closes near 13000!!!

PW,

GM has a history of making excellent products. What is possibly the most popular and dependable and versitile engine ever designed? The 350? I have had my issues with GM over the years but I will not throw them under the bus like so many Prius owners would like. When it comes to putting the chips on the table and creating a product that changes the world I would look to GM to produce it. They are creating better and better vehicles with each passing year. Their quality is improving, and they are doing this while saddled with legacy costs that would drive a foreign company to socialism/communism. What they are attempting to do as a company from a business perspective in monumental. If it were not for the great minds over the years at GM who had the foresight to diversify into other fields they would be gone already. To fully understand the talent pool at GM is staggering. Managing that large of a group is the challenge.

They are in phase one or two of their metamorphisis. Give them another 5-8 years and look out. The folks at Honda and Toyota do them a great service by setting the bar as high as they have. I would not look for GM to have the market share they once enjoyed, but I look for them to be on the forefront of the automotive industry in terms of innovation, quality, sales dollars and design. They have been using obsolete models in their design process's and their new approach is beginning to bear fruit. They have V8 engines in their truck line that get 24mpg because that is what their customers want. They are scapping old platforms and developing products like the Saturn Aura. The corvette remains the best buy in true sports cars. Have you checked out the Saab 9-2? A best buy on many consumer magazines recommended buy lists for small cars. Heck the 3.8l v6 was making over 200hp with pushrod technolgy and still getting 30+mpg back when gas was less than $1 a gallon. That bad boy was almost always good for 200K miles. Each year that goes by GM creeps up the customer satisfaction lists. Some of the new Caddy designs have been consistantly ranked among the best in the world. Not all, but most. Many of their new designs will benefit from improvements that are already available but are cost prohibitive. 6 speed tranny's are a good example. The legacy costs just prevent them from being able to offer these and remain price competitive. GM tranny's have been the benchmark for years. If you want to compare reliability rates of some of GM brands vs. say Audi or Volkswagon, well it might surprise you. Even some of the Mercedes and BMW (SUV) products have been more troublesome than GM products competing in similar markets.

Once they get a handle on the brand management and global integration of their resourses, the sleeper will awaken. Trust me, Toyota, Honda and the rest of their competitors are still very very nervous about what this company can bring to bear.
 

PW2

Commander
Joined
Apr 21, 2004
Messages
2,719
Re: Dow closes near 13000!!!

Pointer,

I don't mean to denigrate GM, and I am sure they are capable of making a fine vehicle. I've owned several of their products over the years, as well as Ford products, and Honda and Toyota. I have no specific problem with any of them. (I currently own a Jeep)

And I am not sure the quality of one specific vehicle, one way or another, would impact their corporate bottom line more than the vagaries of world wide interest rates and currency fluctuations.

If I had a problem with US automakers, it would be their tendency to run their business looking out of the rear view mirror, with decisions being made dominated by bean counters who are wonderful at analyzing past results, without paying enough attention to forward looking trends.

My first brand new car I ever owned was a 1975 Toyota Corrola, at the time that vehicle was so far superior to any comparable product being produced in Detroit it wasn't even funny, especially in light of the first "oil crisis".

And the history of Detroit is shaky at best. Sure they have had some great minds, but have not always used them. Deming, the father of modern day quality control, is a prime example. He developed his theories in Detroit, and was largely ignored at the time, yet was treated like a god in Japan.

IMO, the company that is going to dominate is the company that will develop a superior battery. My real concern is the competing forces, like the oil industry, that have so much invested in infrastucture that they will do whatever it takes to squash it in its tracks.
 

POINTER94

Vice Admiral
Joined
Oct 12, 2003
Messages
5,031
Re: Dow closes near 13000!!!

Our current electrical grid is in such a state that adding auto's to the mix on any great scale could be disasterous. Batteries are not the panacea of green technology that some would hold them out to be. Especially in this country. I believe that the future of autos lies in a mix of technology. Biodeisel, ethanol, electric, hydrogen perhaps, and gasoline as the primary. Look at the commericals that our out today touting "green" technology in cars. Modern cars are even rated on their "green" impact. The "religion of peace" area's of the world are just becoming more and more hands off even for those who are seeking oil without environmental concerns. The political ramifications are to be considered.

GM is suffering from a variety of group think, aniquated mentalities, and simply its own bloated weight. The liposuction procedures they are undergoing is helping. New management with fresh modern ideas, committment to techology, and attrition of the old "we have always done things this way" people are positioning this company for success. Today's green technology will be humorous in the next ten years. Innovation is driven by the creative mind. The foreign manufacturers are good at improving existing designs. They are not so good at thinking outside the box. Most of the hot new designs are not coming from Asia, they are coming out of design studios in California and Michigan. They often have toyota or Honda as brands on them though. Hyundai has an envyable reputation for the products they are building right here in America.

As I said earlier, GM is in my doghouse, but like any dynamic company looking to succeed, the bad eggs get weeded out. The future will tell what direction they will take, but from all the literature I read, the shakeup at GM goes from the board room, to the shop floor. In this environment, innovation comes naturally. And business models are made on the market, and not with so called covert alliances with "Big Oil". I have never seen one link between "Big Oil" and the auto industry published in any credible source. I don't believe there is one. If that were the case "big electrical" would be in there bidding as well.

I hope I am right and you are wrong, for the sake of this country and for no other reason. You may be right and GM may crumble. But if it does, nothing good will result from it. You can't wish technology into existance, it has to be driven. GM's strength will be the whip.
 
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