Anchor and windlass questions

HotTommy

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I'm thinking of getting a power windlass for my 24' foot pontoon boat used on a large lake. My research indicates the keys to successful anchoring are: 1. Rope length. 2. Chain connecting the anchor to the rope. 3. Properly setting the anchor at the outset. ... My question has to do with the anchor chain when using a windlass. I'd really like to add a power windlass to my boat, but I don't see how to do that with an inconvenient length of chain near the anchor. Am I missing something or does it come down to a choice between windlass and chain?
 

ahicks

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Not sure if this is helpful, but I have a deck mounted winch that came with our 22' alum deck boat when we bought it. It's fairly nice, even has a remote control. Problem is it uses very light rope, maybe not even 1/4". I don't think that winch is even capable of dealing with an anchor I would use on a 22' boat, so I've never used it. Not sure of it's intended use.
 

HotTommy

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Let me expand a bit. The windlasses I noted (all less than $300) have no provision for wrapping chain around them, and on a pontoon boat they would sit only 18" or so above the water. So any chain would be measured in inches rather than feet. ... So let me pose the question a little differently. .... I assume the purpose of the chain is to be sure the deployed anchor is pulled horizontally rather than vertically by the rope, increasing its ability to "set" into the bottom. So wouldn't a heavier anchor produce a similar effect without requiring a very expensive chain capable windlass?
 

ahicks

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I'm with you on a chain capable windlass mounted on a pontoon boat. That would be a little heavy duty for me as well.

This is what we "inherited" on our boat: http://tracoutdoor.com/wp-content/up...ual-073015.pdf

Manual talks about the use of a mushroom type anchor with a weight of up to 25 lbs.
They say the rope that comes with it is rated for 500 lbs, and that may be the case, but you couldn't prove that by me. It is just under 1/4".

Looking at the parts manual, the drive looks suspiciously similar to an automotive electric window motor....
 

racerone

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There are many " proper " units called a WINDLASS that will handle chain and rope for anchoring.------But the unit above looks like an ATV type winch bolted onto a boat.-------Just not in the same category.
 

dingbat

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I assume the purpose of the chain is to be sure the deployed anchor is pulled horizontally rather than vertically by the rope, increasing its ability to "set" into the bottom. So wouldn't a heavier anchor produce a similar effect without requiring a very expensive chain capable windlass?
Possibly, but how much weight would you need to keep stationary?

Depending weather conditions, weight of boat, depth anchored, current, etc. the weight most likely would exceed that of a inexpensive rope retriever.
 

racerone

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NOTES-----A " large lake " means very little when discussing anchoring.-------Depth of water , type of bottom , weight of boat , windage of the boat all come into the picture.-----And I have been at anchor on sailboats on many occasions.-----More chain and a longer line are difficult to buy the moment you need them !!
 

ahicks

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Possibly, but how much weight would you need to keep stationary?/QUOTE]

That's the question of the week. I wouldn't want to work a winch at it's max capacity, so my question would be, what does it take to drag a 20 lb mushroom anchor with a 6:1 scope on it? No idea here.... I've always used a Danforth type.

And I agree regarding a way less expensive winch. Looking at ours, I see nothing special here. It's not made from stainless or anything. A Harbor Freight winch would likely work as well, maybe better? Add a bow roller and you'd likely have a better winch (albeit a throw away) for less money.
 

HotTommy

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ahicks, I find you and I often share similar thoughts, so I'll consider your idea. .... Otherwise I may be looking at a windlass that costs more than my boat, and an onboard oxyacetlyne torch to release the anchor chain it appears I may need to properly secure my pontoon boat while eating lunch. ..... One more thing. Unlike the some other lakes, the bottom of the lake I frequent is deeper or shallower depending on where I choose to stop. So I can make the water whatever depth I choose.
 

ahicks

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So it would seem to me, your choice of "winch" would likely be about the size of the spool - to allow max amount of scope in deeper water. That, and the size and type of rope you select?

Yep, nearly always on the same page.... evil minds!
 

HotTommy

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My initial research indicates the problem with readily available winches is the speed in feet per minute. They seem to all be geared for very high loads and very slow speeds. Nobody wants to wait 15 mintues to retreive 75' of anchor rope even if you can lift 2,000 pounds. ... I could engineer a modification to lift one tenth the weight in one tenth the time, but I'd rather not do that.
 

ahicks

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Retrieval speed is something I hadn't thought of. Good point.That'll limit the list of choices for sure....
 

Maped

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A thought I would like to add to this discussion. The point of the rope being just under 1/4" is because the winch is only capable of lifting up to a 30 lb anchor. So if the rope is rated at 500 lbs then I would suggest the theory is that a 30lb anchor will only hold up to a 500lb force before it begins to slip. If you run your numbers and find that your boat will often exceed that amount of force you will want to upgrade the whole system or add a second anchor which is a pain to set both evenly, but upgrading the rope wouldn't give any benefit. As for my experience with an electric windlass, if your lake is deeper than 30 feet and your letting out 4xs that in rope length to anchor than the retrieval time with that small windlass will push close to 15 min and bother your, I wouldn't suggest that for anchoring any deeper than 20'
 

ahicks

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Or a 10lb anchor with 20+ lbs of weeds on it.....
"the winch is only capable of lifting up to a 30 lb anchor."
 

Cat nip

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I have seen windless and winches mounted in various places on toons and sometimes under a seat and the rope run through pullys under the boat and the anchor pulling up tight under the front deck in the middle where it should be. I am thinking about trying this myself when i come up with a plan lol. I have seen a anchor design on some larger west coast jet boats that lools promising for this type of mounting. If i can find the manufacturer i will post it but basically looks like a t bar with fixed flukes at the ends of the T . The size of the flukes and weight of the T Will determine the set ability and holding power. I am on the river most of the time and i have noticed that sometimes a 30lb fluke anchor will not hold in strong current or wind but something not much bigger or stronger than a chip clip will hold the boat when attached to a tiny twig! Im talking a toon with 22' tubes and 25' tip to tip. This tells me there's more drag from the rope and scope than the actual boat. Anyone else had this experience?
 

t-wood

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I'm a bit late to chime in. I have a entry model windless on my toon a love it. It uses 3/16 100' line that is weak. Although I've only had to replace the line and motor once. When I need more substantial anchoring I drop a heavier anchor. But most of time time you can't beat it for the convenience. Mine is mounted off center to avoid dock rash. I normally use a 15 lb mushroom anchor. In table rock lake anchors get hung up on trees and rocks so almost any weight will do.
 

HotTommy

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When the idea of a windlass first struck me, I was thinking of both the convenience and getting my old anchor stuff out of the way on the deck. I've given up on the windlass for myself, but I found a way to keep the anchor from being a tripping hazard. I stole the idea from a photo I found and built an anchor holder that is secured on a small area of the deck that would be otherwise unused. I mounted a 5 gallon plastic bucket next to it to hold the rope and chain. The bucket has a drain that allows water from the wet rope to go over the side. I haven't tried it out yet, but I'm optimistic it is an improvement over leaving the anchor and rope out on the deck. Here is a photo.
 

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MRS

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I like it I am now going to hook something like that on my toon. What did you make the anchor holder out of? I have my anchor and rope in a tote now.
 

HotTommy

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It's PVC lumber from the building supply store, assembled with stainless screws and PVC cement. The trickiest part was the piece that holds the top of the anchor. It's a u-shaped opening bounded by a bungee cord. The cord does not come free. You just stretch it to push the anchor into the U and the cord keeps it from vibrating free.
 
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