Bottom Paint

GrindKore

Petty Officer 1st Class
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Jun 20, 2008
Messages
211
We are considering on keeping new to us 2005 Bayliner 242 Classic in the marina for the season. The boat will be in fresh water on Lake Erie entire summer season. Being a trailer sailor I do not have much experience with issues that arise as result of hull and out-drive remaining in water for 4 to 5 month straight. Should we paint the bottom with anti-fouling paint? I just can't imagine any paint actually sticking to smooth gel-coat. I image first paint application involves sanding or chemical treatment to make paint stick.

Please share your thoughts regarding pros and cons of bottom painting. Keep in mind this boat will be in fresh waters of Lake Erie for at least 4 month per year. I understand the salt water boats are subject to extreme marine growth if left unprotected. Does anyone keep their boat in marina without bottom paint on Great Lakes?
 

imraan47

Petty Officer 1st Class
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Sep 18, 2009
Messages
315
Re: Bottom Paint

We are considering on keeping new to us 2005 Bayliner 242 Classic in the marina for the season. The boat will be in fresh water on Lake Erie entire summer season. Being a trailer sailor I do not have much experience with issues that arise as result of hull and out-drive remaining in water for 4 to 5 month straight. Should we paint the bottom with anti-fouling paint? I just can't imagine any paint actually sticking to smooth gel-coat. I image first paint application involves sanding or chemical treatment to make paint stick.

Please share your thoughts regarding pros and cons of bottom painting. Keep in mind this boat will be in fresh waters of Lake Erie for at least 4 month per year. I understand the salt water boats are subject to extreme marine growth if left unprotected. Does anyone keep their boat in marina without bottom paint on Great Lakes?

kept mine for 2 months at the end of last season (Lk. Ontario-Bluffers Marina)
When i pulled it out it was all green algea growing. i washed it out a little bit then stored for winter. now i have brown marks all over the place. anti-fouling paint here doesn't come in white so that sucks! i dont want to ruin the color scheme of my boat.

brownunderboat.jpg

brownandblackmarksunderboat.jpg
 

TilliamWe

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Dec 21, 2004
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6,579
Re: Bottom Paint

"Does anyone keep their boat in marina without bottom paint on Great Lakes?"

Only people that don't know what they are risking.

You absolutely, positively have to have bottom paint on Lake Erie, if you are slipping the boat. Anyone can disagree with me if they want to, but you will be sorry if you don't bottom paint.

The biggest CON to not bottom painting is that your hull will get SO FOULED, that your engine will be "lugged" at ALL times when the boat is in motion. This WILL lead to valve damage at the least, piston/head/complete engine damage at worst. And it will not be covered under the Mercruiser warranty. It is abuse.

Of course they have to sand the gelcoat first.

Do a search on here, and you'll find all the pros and cons. But you don't have a choice. Marine growth in Lake Erie is bad, as are the zebra mussels. You have to bottom paint. I would consult a local marina or two to see what type they suggest.

Good luck.
 

GrindKore

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Messages
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Re: Bottom Paint

I'm getting contradicting statements from various people including marina managers and boaters here on the lake. Some are saying "get her painted" others are saying "don't bother with it", it's split 50/50 no general consensus.

I sent a quick e-mail to the marina manager today where we want to wet slip our boat and asked him what his other clients do. Here is what he said; "Most boats don't have antifouling paint but you could ask Express Marine who works with these products". This is a large 400+ slip marina that has anything from jet-ski to 70'+ yachts here, I was a bit surprised by his answer.
 

TilliamWe

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Re: Bottom Paint

Does this marina manager have a mechanic who makes a living by removing and reconditioning cylinder heads? Or does he like to charge folks to lift their boats out and power wash the bottom. Also, since most people don't begin boating until Memorial Day on Erie, and the traffic really slows down after July 4th, and the season is DONE at Labor Day, it's not a real long season. It is "possible" that in whatever section of the lake you are at, that the water stays colder and the growth isn't as bad.
But even if the growth didn't exist, you still want to get the bottom painted, with an epoxy barrier coat first, to prevent hull blistering. Unless your Bayliner is made with epoxy resin, which I highly doubt, as it's expensive, and Bayliners are not.
 

GrindKore

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Messages
211
Re: Bottom Paint

kept mine for 2 months at the end of last season (Lk. Ontario-Bluffers Marina)
When i pulled it out it was all green algea growing. i washed it out a little bit then stored for winter. now i have brown marks all over the place. anti-fouling paint here doesn't come in white so that sucks! i dont want to ruin the color scheme of my boat.

The staining is not too bad. The hull of my open bow ski boat that I currently trailer looks similar if I don't wash it for a while. And its always stored dry. On the bottom picture if I'm not mistaken I see the gel-coat blisters, is that the case?
 

Home Cookin'

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May 26, 2009
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9,715
Re: Bottom Paint

around here, antifouling paint is prt of the color scheme, unless your topside is already "pine-sap green" or "river water brown."

PS use toilet bowl cleaner to get rid of the brown stains.
 

Home Cookin'

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Re: Bottom Paint

Heard a story over the weekend of a guy who takes regular paint and mixes cayenne pepper in it; no barnacles.
 

imraan47

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Sep 18, 2009
Messages
315
Re: Bottom Paint

The staining is not too bad. The hull of my open bow ski boat that I currently trailer looks similar if I don't wash it for a while. And its always stored dry. On the bottom picture if I'm not mistaken I see the gel-coat blisters, is that the case?

good eye..i didn't even catch that! damn i'm worried now!
i will have to go to the boat and i will check it out and take more pics.
 

imraan47

Petty Officer 1st Class
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Sep 18, 2009
Messages
315
Re: Bottom Paint

I dont know but personally just because there isn't a white color anti-fouling paint that is legal in Ontario so that prevents me from doing it. i really dont want to mess up the color scheme because my boat is just black and white, some grey too.

"Does anyone keep their boat in marina without bottom paint on Great Lakes?"

Only people that don't know what they are risking.

You absolutely, positively have to have bottom paint on Lake Erie, if you are slipping the boat. Anyone can disagree with me if they want to, but you will be sorry if you don't bottom paint.

The biggest CON to not bottom painting is that your hull will get SO FOULED, that your engine will be "lugged" at ALL times when the boat is in motion. This WILL lead to valve damage at the least, piston/head/complete engine damage at worst. And it will not be covered under the Mercruiser warranty. It is abuse.

Of course they have to sand the gelcoat first.

Do a search on here, and you'll find all the pros and cons. But you don't have a choice. Marine growth in Lake Erie is bad, as are the zebra mussels. You have to bottom paint. I would consult a local marina or two to see what type they suggest.

Good luck.
 

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GrindKore

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Re: Bottom Paint

I got this response from a reputable marine dealer where we are purchasing this boat from regarding bottom paint;


Well, my opinion is that it is not necessary to "protect" the bottom gelcoat from osmotic blistering with bottom paint, since vinylester resin has been used since the early 90s in gelcote formulation and blisters are quite rare anymore.

If left in-water though,you will experience some performance degradation over the summer as the bottom mosses up, slowing the vessel time to plane. This can be remedied by regular bottom scrubbing at the beach/sandbar or whatever.
 

TilliamWe

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Re: Bottom Paint

Vinlyester definately does help, but it doesn't prevent blisters entirely. I wonder what imraan47's boat model year is and what type of resin it uses. if it's mid 90s and uses vinylester, I'd say blistering isn't that rare! We have one picture of one boat, and it has blisters!

I respectfully disagree that beaching will remove enough growth. I have seen the growth on my sister's boat, that is left in the water near Port Clinton. The only beaching that would remove that stuff is a beach with sandpaper or huge boulders!

But hey, do what you want.
 

GrindKore

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Re: Bottom Paint

Vinlyester definately does help, but it doesn't prevent blisters entirely. I wonder what imraan47's boat model year is and what type of resin it uses. if it's mid 90s and uses vinylester, I'd say blistering isn't that rare! We have one picture of one boat, and it has blisters!

I respectfully disagree that beaching will remove enough growth. I have seen the growth on my sister's boat, that is left in the water near Port Clinton. The only beaching that would remove that stuff is a beach with sandpaper or huge boulders!

But hey, do what you want.


I'm not arguing for or against bottom paint. I'm trying to come up with the solution that will work for us in the long run. Here is how I see it.

Pros:
* Boat can be wet slipped all summer with minimal marine growth and performance deterioration.
* Additional protection against gelcoat blistering.
* Improved fuel consumption
* Reduced wear on the engine due to drag reduction.
* Eliminates the need to haul out mid season to pressure wash the hull or continually scrubbing hull.

Cons:
* Additional initial expense
* Permanent change to the boats appearance, potentially may be derogatory to a resale value if new owner decides to trailer and/or not wet slipping.
* Paint requites fresh coat or two every season, followed by occasional full strip down maintenance cycles.
* Additional reoccurring maintenance cost in terms of time and money.

Did I miss anything?
 

imraan47

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Sep 18, 2009
Messages
315
Re: Bottom Paint

Well there you go..to me i'd rather not use anti-fouling paint because my con's over weight the pros.
I applogize to hijack this thread.

oh and my boat is a 1988

I'd rather pull the boat out on the trailer and give it a wash right at the marina's parking lot my self then put it back in the slip. thats easy to do with my boat as its not a big boat. i can arrange with my friend who has a car that i depends on anyway to pull my boat around.
now if there were a white anti-fouling paint, then i would use it. does anyone know why they dont have it in white color..there must be some reason.

I'm not arguing for or against bottom paint. I'm trying to come up with the solution that will work for us in the long run. Here is how I see it.

Pros:
* Boat can be wet slipped all summer with minimal marine growth and performance deterioration.
* Additional protection against gelcoat blistering.
* Improved fuel consumption
* Reduced wear on the engine due to drag reduction.
* Eliminates the need to haul out mid season to pressure wash the hull or continually scrubbing hull.

Cons:
* Additional initial expense
* Permanent change to the boats appearance, potentially may be derogatory to a resale value if new owner decides to trailer and/or not wet slipping.
* Paint requites fresh coat or two every season, followed by occasional full strip down maintenance cycles.
* Additional reoccurring maintenance cost in terms of time and money.

Did I miss anything?
 

bryan01601

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Mar 15, 2010
Messages
30
Re: Bottom Paint

Bottom Paint does not need to alter the appearance of the boat. Here is a picture of my Four Winns on the trailer. Only the very bottom is painted.
 

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Home Cookin'

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Re: Bottom Paint

Grindcore, you have a couple of facts off.
Bottom painting itself does not improve performance, engine live, etc.; in fact it creates drag more than an unpainted bottom. It's the marine growth that harms your performance.
In some places, even with bottom paint, you have to scrub or power wash the bottom mid0-season. Ask around. This is especially true if you don't run the boat often, or fast; bottom paints that are "ablative" require some action to wear off a layer, like skin does.
Don't worry about resale. Boats are a terrible investment, as investments go. Once the boat is several years old, other factors will be more important--and I assume you are keeping it for a while. True, if there were two otherwise identical used boats for sale, the unpainted one might sell faster or for a couple of bucks more--depends if most people in your area with 24' boats wet slip or dry slip/trailer them.
You never have to strip the paint.
You repaint after 2 seasons, not mid season. You may be able to eek out a third year. Ask around your marina.
there's no maintenance except mayby touch up from beaching.

Tilliam, I think the comment about beaching didn't mean running it up the beach to sand it off, but taking it to a sandbar, letting the tide drop, and cleaning the bottom when it's dry--or going under it in shallow water with a stiff brush. That is not a very practical alternative for many boats, though.

Imraan, I think your priorities are skewed. A boat is a piece of equipment first and a thing of beauty second. To neglect the bottom just for looks (and it's the bottom! it's underwater! No one sees it but the fish!) is like not adding oil so you won't spill any on the deck. And there's a shark-white (gray) that would just look fabulous on yours.
 

imraan47

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Sep 18, 2009
Messages
315
Re: Bottom Paint

Imraan, I think your priorities are skewed. A boat is a piece of equipment first and a thing of beauty second. To neglect the bottom just for looks (and it's the bottom! it's underwater! No one sees it but the fish!) is like not adding oil so you won't spill any on the deck. And there's a shark-white (gray) that would just look fabulous on yours.

Yea you are right..pretty much black or grey would look just fine on mine. My problem is that i am considering selling the boat mid season this year. in my area, for a boat like this is mostly trailered. i just don't have the place and means to keep it on a trailer after use. so if i go and put anti-fouling paint then the next person will not want the boat for the price i want to sell.

Where can i find more reading about the effects of a boat that is not cleaned properly/dirty bottom in terms of the drag it creates and how that all factors into fuel consumption and performance??
 

TilliamWe

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Re: Bottom Paint

Very good points Home Cookin'. I was actually kind of kidding about the beaching part. I know what the marina guy probably meant, but it is just not practical on most boats. The part you need to scrub, you can't reach!
Imraan, if your boat is a trailer boat, you are right about harming the resale value in your area.
Grind, your boat isn't really a trailer boat in your area, so it's less to worry about. Home Cookin is right on with the paint characteristics and not having to repaint as much as you stated. Also, in regards to value, you bought a Bayliner, it will depreciate as fast or faster than every other boat in its class. So bottom paint is not going to hurt its value very much at all.
 

dan t.

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Feb 28, 2008
Messages
1,131
Re: Bottom Paint

antifouling paint in its self will do nothing to prevent blistering, check the interlux site out, they will tell you to always coat the bottom with a epoxy barrier coat before you apply an antifouling paint
 
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